Author Topic: The worst space game ever?  (Read 27031 times)

Offline Misery

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Re: The worst space game ever?
« Reply #60 on: March 20, 2015, 05:27:59 am »

Also, I don't think I can really enjoy a space flight sim in the year of our lord 2015 if I can't walk around in my ship, and also land on planets and stations and walk around there as well. You can have Elite Dangerous and the endless vapor that is Star Citizen,

Wait a minute, isnt one of Star Citizen's big selling point the fact that you CAN do those things?

It's current state is NOT the finished game.  I am told (in really, really extreme detail) that those things will indeed exist in the game, and a bit more than just that (repairs, for example, dont involve simple menus and such; you have to actually go to the spot and repair it, even if it's on the outside of the ship...).

Wheras Elite just isnt about that element to begin with.


Have you considered Space Engineers?  That game is HUGELY popular and there's about 5 bazillion mods for it.  The game is VERY complex, and the updates are extremely rapid (every week or so, like Nuclear Throne is doing), and even in it's early access form, it's got ALOT of depth and content.  And yes, this is one of those ones that's safe to purchase in early access;  I wouldnt be recommending it if it wasnt.  Hell, one of the recent updates added programmable.... somethings, some sort of computer console I'm betting (Steam flipped out before I could have a good look at the thing), that you program in C#.  It might be worth looking into if you havent already. 

The only problem is it requires a beefy computer, due to the very high amount of physics stuff that it will always be doing.   But holy heck, it is DETAILED. 

You wont land on planets in this one, but that's not what it's about.  It's about building and interacting with your ship (and repairing it, the damage modeling is detailed), mining and utilizing asteroids (you could build stations on them, for instance, which is a common use of them, if you want.  Or just build a big smiley face, I dont know, whatever) and so on.  Seriously, that one really is something special.

And finally.... there's Space Engine.  I have a hard time describing this one.  Here:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mootV7Iqa34

Obvoiusly, you can see all sorts of stars, a bazillion of them, in the background of most of those shots.  Here's the thing about Space Engine:  You can click on any one of them.... ANY of them.... and have the game jump you towards it (which is impressive to see).  Each can have it's own individual planets and asteroids and thing.  Every planet, you can go to the surface of. The surface of each is very detailed.  All of it seamless.   For the planets that are well known to astronomers and such, they are recreated in detail in the game.  Everything else is procedural, though not in an "enter a seed" sort of way.   If you find a particularly cool planet somewhere, you could mark down it's coordinates, send them to a friend, and they can go and find that very same planet, and explore it.  They'll find the same craters or mountains or lakes or whatever as you did if they look in the same spots.   You can travel to different galaxies as well, which isnt immediately evident (I found this just randomly on accident, friend of mine didn't believe it until I showed him) which again, is filled with... a bazillion things. 

Seriously, it's freaking incredible.  When I first found it I sat there for 3 totally hypnotized hours just exploring at random. And that's ME doing that, and as I said, I aint exactly made of patience here and dont sit still well.   

And the feature list is huuuuuuuuuge.  The developers have made a list of things that describe where they want it to eventually go, and... if they pull it off, it's going to be the Dwarf Fortress of space games.  But even just in it's current state, it's awesome.  If the game even looks somewhat interesting to you, I very strongly suggest going and having a look at the features listed on the site, because there's ALOT of them.  The game gets very.... science-y. 



Also I looked at that link you dropped there, and arrrrgh.....   I'm going to buy the damn thing, arent I?  I'm going to buy the damn thing.  I dont know why I even try to resist, I always end up buying eventually (AKA, within the space of an hour or so), I may as well do it now.  That looks really darn good and right up my alley.

« Last Edit: March 20, 2015, 05:32:42 am by Misery »

Offline Shrugging Khan

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Re: The worst space game ever?
« Reply #61 on: March 20, 2015, 06:00:20 am »
Are we forgetting about Drox Operative?
What about Drox Operative?
It's ugly as sin, has nothing at all to do with space, and the ARPG play is pretty overused...but apart from that, it at least tries to shake things up a bit.

I've only played the demo, but I thought the graphics and style were at least adequate.  Certainly not ugly, anyway.  And what do you mean it has nothing to do with space?  You fly a spaceship of some sort around from planet to planet.  That's pretty space-y, right?
Not in my book, no. The game could just as well be set underwater, in an empty cereal bowl, or in a dungeon below a doomed village. None of the mechanics require or reflect anything belonging to space; Bugs Bunny is a better representation of a rabbit than DO is one of space.
And Soldak, as much as I like their games, have crap taste in visuals. At least to me, the more leeway they get, the more ugly things become - Din's Curse had human-like proportions on things, but everything looked like it had been created with a minimum of effort. In Drox Operative though, the gloves come off - now everything looks like effort never factored into it, and everything was just mashed together randomly. None of the shapes or colours make sense or even look good.
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Offline Misery

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Re: The worst space game ever?
« Reply #62 on: March 20, 2015, 07:12:47 am »
Also I looked at that link you dropped there, and arrrrgh.....   I'm going to buy the damn thing, arent I?  I'm going to buy the damn thing.  I dont know why I even try to resist, I always end up buying eventually (AKA, within the space of an hour or so), I may as well do it now.  That looks really darn good and right up my alley.

Okay so quoting myself there, aaaand.....  ye gods, that Shrapnel place is.... irritating.  The price, I dont care about.  That's fine, whatever.  But the store and the way they handle things.... ugh.  DRM from Hell on this one.  Which doesnt appear to be functioning correctly, at least right now.   Really, you shouldnt have to put in a serial number into a game that is singleplayer only, yet NEEDS TO CONNECT ONLINE just to do some crazy magic rituals with that number before you're able to actually play it. 

It's like they WANT people to pirate it.  What kind of corporate dolt thinks this is a good idea?  Ugh. 

Looking around though apparently the game is absolutely fan-freaking-tastic, so it might be worth the fact that I have to deal with customer support with one of these damn companies for about the billionth time.   It's like a routine, now.   And problems with other services have been worse than this, that's for sure.  I'm not even going to try to describe what the Desura client is currently doing lately.

Might just see if the laptop will do this.  I'll actually be angry if it does.

EDIT:  or it did it after I repeated it enough.  I'm just gonna blame Windows.

« Last Edit: March 20, 2015, 07:24:14 am by Misery »

Offline Mánagarmr

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Re: The worst space game ever?
« Reply #63 on: March 20, 2015, 07:37:20 am »
Shrapnel Games sounds like a company but it's just one guy, if I remember correctly. It's the dude who made the Space Empires series.
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Offline Shrugging Khan

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Re: The worst space game ever?
« Reply #64 on: March 20, 2015, 07:53:57 am »
So I tried Infinite Space, and oh boy. How can anyone play this? The Story seems to be sewn together from the desiccated corpses of every sci-fi anime ever, the menu structure is extremely aggravating -tons of different screens and tons and tons of "are you sure you want to leave this screen" - and, oh let me get back to the story, the main character is so much of a cardboard cutout I want to find a way to get him killed and replace him. Combat seems to come down to a gamble, apart from having better ships, and consists of repeated (and fortunately skippable) cut scenes with horrible audio. Also, so far it's not a space game IMO - it could just as well have been sailing ships and islands instead of spaceships and planets.

I'm trying out Approaching Infinity next. Here's to hope.
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Offline Misery

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Re: The worst space game ever?
« Reply #65 on: March 20, 2015, 09:36:31 am »
So I tried Infinite Space, and oh boy. How can anyone play this? The Story seems to be sewn together from the desiccated corpses of every sci-fi anime ever, the menu structure is extremely aggravating -tons of different screens and tons and tons of "are you sure you want to leave this screen" - and, oh let me get back to the story, the main character is so much of a cardboard cutout I want to find a way to get him killed and replace him. Combat seems to come down to a gamble, apart from having better ships, and consists of repeated (and fortunately skippable) cut scenes with horrible audio. Also, so far it's not a space game IMO - it could just as well have been sailing ships and islands instead of spaceships and planets.

I'm trying out Approaching Infinity next. Here's to hope.

AI definitely aint for everyone.  Biggest problem:  The tutorial does NOT tell you enough.  There's *alot* of stuff to the game overall.  Like, a ton.   The tutorial will tell you only the absolute basics, and even then, it'll not explain them fully.

I, so far, am quite enjoying it.  Some things in it are very typical of roguelikes... extremely simplistic combat (does ANY roguelike ever not have that aspect?), for instance, you've got a ranged weapon and a melee weapon when on planets, and so far for me at least just a missile.... thing, for space combat; apparently more can be gotten there (as in, more than one weapon equipped on the ship at once), but I've not figured that out yet.  Unlike many roguelikes though, particularly on planets or in stations or whatever, each enemy type is actually DIFFERENT and does different things.  This part, I like, as alot of roguelikes dont actually do this.

And none of that Nethack sort of thing where you get an unidentified thing, the only way to figure it out is to use it, so you use it and instantly die.  Yeah.  None of that here.  That's good, because I haaaaaaaaaaaate that.   

Exploring planets and other things that require an away team can be tough because of the blasted oxygen.   That system can be pretty annoying, but I can understand why it's there, so I dont mind it too much.  And you'll do MUCH more combat on planets than in space.  Away team death does not = captain death (usually) so that's not instant game over, but ship destruction is.

I dont entirely understand the crafting yet, and I DEFINITELY dont understand the "lab" thing, that's.... confusing.  Interesting, but confusing.

Interface is a little strange, but functional.  There's like 50 thousand buttons in the top right of the interface that do stuff I dont remember.

Dont expect anything from the graphics.  Typical roguelike:  They are very function-over-form.   They look fine to me (alot better than most tilesets), but then I tend to think ASCII looks nice, so my opinion on that probably doesnt mean much.  The dude that represents your team on away missions though looks alarmingly stupid. 


But yeah, after a couple of hours, I'm thoroughly enjoying it so far, and there's alot to it, yet I've barely scratched the surface of it.  So far I'm thinking that for me at least it was a worthy purchase.  Love games like this, but I have trouble finding ones I consider genuinely good and deep enough to keep my attention.

Also:  this one looks to prove to be a LONG game.  If you turn perma-death on, well.... yeah.  That one's gonna HURT if you go down far into it, as this isnt one of those roguelikes where a run takes like 15 minutes.  It's more like Dungeons of Dredmor.... that game, it can take 15 *hours* when the dungeon size is at it's default and the difficulty is medium or high.  And it suuuuuuuucks to die on like, the last floor in that game.  I'm expecting this one will prove to be very, very similar in that regard.

EDIT:  Or it turns out the game doesnt HAVE an ending unless you specifically choose to do one of the end quests, which are apparantly lengthy and complicated.  There's no end to the number of sectors and things that you can explore and do whatever you want in.

EDIT:  Okay, so I found a dungeon thing, has very good things in it but the captain has to come along with the away team (he dies, it's game over), did mostly fine, chopped through many of the normal baddies without trouble, ran back to ship for healing when needed, was nearing the end of the area... boss appears.  No way I can kill it, so, run back to the ship.... and I die *on* the exit tile, the moment I reach it.  Just.   What.    Now THAT is an irritating way to go down.  ONE more turn and.... uuuuuugh.   
« Last Edit: March 20, 2015, 11:23:19 am by Misery »

Offline doctorfrog

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Re: The worst space game ever?
« Reply #66 on: March 20, 2015, 07:54:55 pm »
words
I'm showing some major prejudice against Star Citizen, I'll freely admit that. I honestly don't think its end result will be very compelling to me, even if every feature bullet point is ticked. By the time it is "done" it will have wandered completely off my radar, having turned mostly into a combination of online store and its own operating system. It will also have an esoteric in-language, interface, and a hostile inbred crypto-culture like Eve Online. That's my dour prediction. Right now, though, it's an intriguing list of promises, and little more.

Space Engineers actually looks fun, and I'm looking forward to it as a finished project, hopefully with a lively in-game universe.

You're buying Approaching Infinity? It does have a demo, do try it out first!
edit: you've bought it and enjoy it. Cool, thanks for your impressions. If Shrapnel ever untightens its bowels about the price, I might untighten my wallet strings and buy it!
« Last Edit: March 20, 2015, 07:56:46 pm by doctorfrog »

Offline eRe4s3r

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Re: The worst space game ever?
« Reply #67 on: March 20, 2015, 08:05:51 pm »
Shrapnel truly has absurd pricing ...

Cities: Skylines Deluxe Edition : 27€
After Infinity Normal Edition: 40€

Something is very wrong there ;)
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Offline Cyborg

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Re: The worst space game ever?
« Reply #68 on: March 20, 2015, 09:38:17 pm »
Regarding the autism topic.



I have serious questions about the amount of autism diagnoses we are seeing. I have serious questions about the difference between behaving badly and exhibiting symptoms of autism. And I have serious questions about accountability. I have serious questions for parents that actually *want* to declare their children autistic.


Actually, these are all the questions that were being asked about the sudden increase in ADD diagnoses in the 90s and then followed by depression diagnoses. And a mountain of medication that followed.
Questions. Lots and lots of questions.


Do I think it’s fake? Do I think depression and ADD are fake? No. However, when does one cross the line between just who someone is versus a medical disability? For example, how much of the DSM could we diagnose bad behavior in the Middle East? Is that a medical problem? How much of the behaviors associated with autism could also be associated with childhood trauma (Hint: all of them!)? How much of the behaviors associated with autism survive any of a number of other diagnoses?


Does it even matter? Only when it comes to accountability. When does one have to be accountable for their behavior and when is it a disability? Lots and lots of questions.


Without a medical marker, we have observational diagnoses, which is factually ambiguous. However, declaring someone to have autism as a disability comes with legal protections and becomes a shield for a variety of behaviors. I have concerns about that.


I don't have concerns about people needing adaptations, modifications, notions of understanding how to interact with someone, spending extra time understanding of the person, indulging obsessions, or otherwise making the world more accessible for people exhibiting symptoms of autism. I don't doubt that some people are clearly suffering.


But I do have questions.

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Offline Misery

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Re: The worst space game ever?
« Reply #69 on: March 21, 2015, 01:04:49 am »
Regarding the autism topic.



I have serious questions about the amount of autism diagnoses we are seeing. I have serious questions about the difference between behaving badly and exhibiting symptoms of autism. And I have serious questions about accountability. I have serious questions for parents that actually *want* to declare their children autistic.


Actually, these are all the questions that were being asked about the sudden increase in ADD diagnoses in the 90s and then followed by depression diagnoses. And a mountain of medication that followed.
Questions. Lots and lots of questions.


Do I think it’s fake? Do I think depression and ADD are fake? No. However, when does one cross the line between just who someone is versus a medical disability? For example, how much of the DSM could we diagnose bad behavior in the Middle East? Is that a medical problem? How much of the behaviors associated with autism could also be associated with childhood trauma (Hint: all of them!)? How much of the behaviors associated with autism survive any of a number of other diagnoses?


Does it even matter? Only when it comes to accountability. When does one have to be accountable for their behavior and when is it a disability? Lots and lots of questions.


Without a medical marker, we have observational diagnoses, which is factually ambiguous. However, declaring someone to have autism as a disability comes with legal protections and becomes a shield for a variety of behaviors. I have concerns about that.


I don't have concerns about people needing adaptations, modifications, notions of understanding how to interact with someone, spending extra time understanding of the person, indulging obsessions, or otherwise making the world more accessible for people exhibiting symptoms of autism. I don't doubt that some people are clearly suffering.


But I do have questions.

And most of those questions, I think, are perfectly valid.  I personally get SO tired of people doing the "self-diagnosis" thing.  It's so bloody stupid.  I dont care if people get offended by that one, I'm going to endlessly keep repeating it.  That kind of crap is one of the largest reasons by far why the number of diagnosises (I dont know how to spell that) are rising so dramatically, because people are doing it in a very half-assed way.  It's so idiotic.

My own diagnosis was a bit more... abnormal.   My father believes in being very thorough, and has the money to do things that way.  As such, this didn't involve dealing with one specialist;  it involved a team of about 7 of them and this loooooooooong barrage of complicated tests of all sorts.  It took quite awhile and required many seperate sessions.  I dont have any doubts as to it's validity; but if it had been dealing with ONE guy over a session that's like one hour long.... ahh, that'd not suffice, for me.  Too vague.  So it bugs me that most do it that way.  And you're right, it is used to shield alot of stupid things that some people do; this bugs me as well. 

Just... ugh.  There's too much stupid around the whole thing, that it hurts alot of those that ACTUALLY have it.  I see that pretty often when dealing with others that have it;  they usually definitely dont have things easy.

Offline Shrugging Khan

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Re: The worst space game ever?
« Reply #70 on: March 21, 2015, 05:25:32 am »
People keep telling me I must have some form of ADD, just because my concentration, attention and memory are shot to hell. I keep telling them it's because I drank to much as a teen, played too many video games, or because elementary school was too easy for me. Or maybe it's just the way I am? In any case, I don't know in what way any sort of diagnosis (Plural: Diagnoses. Do not confuse with Diogenes or Theognosis.) would help me. It's not like the world will suddenly give me things for free; and I seriously doubt that medication would do more good than harm even if it worked on me.

On topic:
Dear god, Approaching Infinity having perfunctory graphics...wasn't a lie. I'm going to need to muster my courage before I can make it past the character creation screen.

And Infinite Space...I have more crew now, but I don't understand how the fact that I have several ships factors into the game. I only see one set of HP displayed in battle, I assign my crew to posts globally and not on a per-ship basis, and only the frontmost ship seems to appear in the cutscenes. A manual really would do some good, I guess.
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Offline Mánagarmr

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Re: The worst space game ever?
« Reply #71 on: March 21, 2015, 07:38:28 am »
Yeah, I'm heading to a neuropsych eval in a couple of weeks time and that will finish up what has been a two year process to determine how I work. Notice I didn't say there was something "wrong" with me. The evaluation is not to put a stamp on someone and say "you have asperger/ADHD". It's to find out how your brain is wired. If it turns out you also have a diagnose like that, well then you can get training and perhaps medication to help deal with it.


I, however, do not have any problems saying I have ADHD even though the eval isn't completed entirely yet. Because we know already that such things are heriditary and both my mother and father, one of my sisters, both her children have ADHD. My other sister is autistic and two of her children are diagnosed with ADD/ADHD respectively. Combining that strong genetic lineup with the initial evaluation my psychologist and I've done together in mapping up my life, I'm pretty convinced of the fact. That doesn't give me the right to act like a jerk.


A diagnose isn't an excuse to order the rest of the world to adapt to you. It's not a free ticket to being an asshole to people. A diagnose is a handicap. Just like missing a leg or suffering from epilepsia. It's YOUR problem and it's YOURS alone to deal with. Thankfully, ADHD comes with a few perks as well. My point is that it's helpful if my surroundings are aware of my diagnosis and how that can affect them. But I do not expect to be treated any differently than anyone else. That would extremely narcissistic.
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Offline Mánagarmr

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Re: The worst space game ever?
« Reply #72 on: March 21, 2015, 07:38:57 am »
On topic:
Dear god, Approaching Infinity having perfunctory graphics...wasn't a lie. I'm going to need to muster my courage before I can make it past the character creation screen.
Ever played Space Empires IV *shivers*
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Offline Captain Jack

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Re: The worst space game ever?
« Reply #73 on: March 21, 2015, 06:40:24 pm »
And Infinite Space...I have more crew now, but I don't understand how the fact that I have several ships factors into the game. I only see one set of HP displayed in battle, I assign my crew to posts globally and not on a per-ship basis, and only the frontmost ship seems to appear in the cutscenes. A manual really would do some good, I guess.
Have you equipped your extra ships? You can check which ones you have at the CTA under Edit Fleet, though you're still early enough in the game that I think you might just have one slot. The ships you're collecting are designs until you build them, and then in a pool of possible ships until you add them to your fleet. Fleet size is determined by Yuri's Fleet Leader ability and goes up as you do story stuff.

And yeah crew is universal. Think of it as having officers on the flagship and generic crew everywhere else.

Offline Misery

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Re: The worst space game ever?
« Reply #74 on: March 21, 2015, 09:08:48 pm »
Dear god, Approaching Infinity having perfunctory graphics...wasn't a lie. I'm going to need to muster my courage before I can make it past the character creation screen.

Just be glad it has graphics at all.

It could look like this: 



Which is usually the sort of look that I associate with roguelikes.


Definitely enjoying it myself though, that game holds my attention well.   You gotta really be careful when making decisions though, like any game in that genre things can go bad really darn fast.  Expect possible frustration.