Author Topic: AVWW Beta 0.531, "Glyph Transplants and Abandoned Settlements," Released!  (Read 4433 times)

Offline x4000

  • Chris McElligott Park, Arcen Founder and Lead Dev
  • Arcen Staff
  • Zenith Council Member Mark III
  • *****
  • Posts: 31,651
Original: http://arcengames.blogspot.com/2011/10/avww-beta-0531-glyph-transplants-and.html

This one doesn't have hugely long feature list, but it includes several things that have been on my to-do list for what seems like forever.

First up is the new Glyph Transplant spell scroll, which basically lets you do a body swap with any NPC you like.  You become them, and they become you, and you continue on with their stats, name, and appearance.

Thematically, this is actually passing your blue, floating "glyph" (and all the associated inventory that goes with it) to another character.  This is actually what happens when you die, too, but when you die you always pass the glyph to a "wandering" NPC that hasn't yet shown up in any of your settlements or other locations.  This lets you actually become someone you've already met, which has been a goal for the game from the start.

Next thing is that there is finally a solution for the abandoned settlements.  Previously if you found yourself with literally no NPCs in a settlement, well, that settlement was just dead because you normally need at least one NPC to use to recruit other NPCs.

Now if there are literally no NPCs in a settlement (and all the monsters have been cleared out), go and talk to one of the guardian stones of the settlement and they'll call a wanderer to the settlement.  You can then use that new resident to recruit more residents, and you're back off to the races.

There are a few other things in this release as well, including a fix to that lighting issue in the prior version.  But the above were the high points.

Notes On The AVWW Multiverse
Today was a hardcore design day for Keith and I; it's been over a month since we last did this, I think, and it was definitely overdue.  We got a number of important middle-term things planned based on what we've each been thinking about lately and what we've learned from the beta.

One consistent theme from what we were talking about today is that the concept of a multiverse is really getting increasingly central to this game.  The idea of a string-theory-type multiverse has always been one of the founding ideas of the AVWW mythos, but it's been a much more subtle thing up until now.

It's why all the instance of the world are called Environ, for instance, but each one is completely different in the details.  Each one exists in a separate universe. It's also key to why all the time periods are able to co-exist in the newly re-formed universe that now exists after the cataclysm.

A lot of that gets into backstory and explanations that are really something that we want players to be able to solve and figure out through piecing together clues in the game, but most of those clues haven't actually been added to the game yet.  That's another thing on the list prior to 1.0, and is also heavily related to the future return of the memory crystals.

Anyway, I don't want to spoil much, but we've come up with some new gameplay ideas that tie several existing gameplay elements together better, and which weave in more of the story, too, and even which tie into multiplayer in a wholly unique way.  You'll start seeing the results of all that coming up in the next weeks and months.

The one that I'm most excited about are the new "personas," which are an idea of Keith's that I won't spoil.  But I will say that these will provide yet another way of customizing and improving your characters, among other benefits, so that's some welcome news I'm sure.

Notes On The AVWW Multiplayer
Keith has gotten the multiplayer functioning to the point where the main barrier we were running up against is the simple speed of even LAN networks versus the amount of precision demanded by pixel-perfect, shmup-style projectiles and dodging ability.

The networking model was getting really refined, but still was a definitively inferior gameplay experience to solo play, which obviously isn't an acceptable state of affairs.  There's a reason why there are very few networked multiplayer shmups, particularly those of the 2D pixel-perfect variety.

Traditional action-game networking just isn't sufficient for the precision that they demand in order to avoid frustrating players with wrong collision hits.  Minor client/server disagreements where there is as little as 200ms worth of difference in entity positions can mean the difference between a hit and a miss at this sort of scale and this sort of projectile speed.

So what do we do when we meet a seemingly-intractable problem like this? We redefine the problem.  I don't want to get into the details yet because there's a lot we still have to actually implement and test out how it works, but the bulk of Keith's and my time today was spent redesigning the networking model based on some ideas we'd batted around way back in early alpha in the event that the traditional approach couldn't be smoothed and predicted into as precise an experience as we wanted.

Our core goal with this redesign was to make the multiplayer combat experience absolutely just as precise and as much fun to the solo combat experience regardless of network conditions or lag, but still while maintaining the ability to have co-op and PVP styles of play.  That said, the design for PVP play has really changed for the game, and even the way that the co-op aspects will work is now really unique from any other game I can think of.

This is a big shift for the multiplayer modes, so I felt I should give a heads up about that before we actually fully unveil it later.  It's kind of like the shift from being a 2D top-down game to being a 2D sidescroller in terms of the scale of the change, but this change only affects multiplayer play; solo play isn't changing one iota in response to this.

Still no ETA on multiplayer actually becoming publicly available.  A majority of what has already been done for multiplayer actually will be retained, but now we have a bunch more logical complexity to set up and add in on top of that stuff.  But shifting this to being a logical design problem rather than something primarily bound by the speed of the Internet is something we're really happy about, to put it mildly.

More to come soon.  Enjoy!

This is a standard update that you can download through the in-game updater itself, if you already have 0.500 or later. When you launch the game, you'll see the notice of the update having been found if you're connected to the Internet at the time.  If you don't have 0.500 or later, you can download that here.
Have ideas or bug reports for one of our games?  Mantis for Suggestions and Bug Reports. Thanks for helping to make our games better!

Offline x4000

  • Chris McElligott Park, Arcen Founder and Lead Dev
  • Arcen Staff
  • Zenith Council Member Mark III
  • *****
  • Posts: 31,651
Have ideas or bug reports for one of our games?  Mantis for Suggestions and Bug Reports. Thanks for helping to make our games better!

Offline goodgimp

  • Jr. Member Mark II
  • **
  • Posts: 87
Our core goal with this redesign was to make the multiplayer combat experience absolutely just as precise and as much fun to the solo combat experience regardless of network conditions or lag, but still while maintaining the ability to have co-op and PVP styles of play.  That said, the design for PVP play has really changed for the game, and even the way that the co-op aspects will work is now really unique from any other game I can think of.

This is a big shift for the multiplayer modes, so I felt I should give a heads up about that before we actually fully unveil it later.  It's kind of like the shift from being a 2D top-down game to being a 2D sidescroller in terms of the scale of the change, but this change only affects multiplayer play; solo play isn't changing one iota in response to this.

I'm curious if you can go into any more detail at all on what changes are coming to coop at this stage? Given that the coop component is one of the most important to me, it leaves me very curious (and maybe a little nervous :D).


Offline x4000

  • Chris McElligott Park, Arcen Founder and Lead Dev
  • Arcen Staff
  • Zenith Council Member Mark III
  • *****
  • Posts: 31,651
I'd really rather not just yet, to be honest, because I'd like to get this all working first so that we can actually say it with complete confidence.  I'm pretty positive that this will work out in terms of the technical aspects, but we need to make sure that this feels fun and functional -- I think that it will, but you never know until you actually playtest it.  I will say that when I explained it to my wife, who is as big into co-op as myself (and planning to be able to play the game co-op with me once this is in!), her reaction was "that sounds really cool!"

If that helps at all. :)
Have ideas or bug reports for one of our games?  Mantis for Suggestions and Bug Reports. Thanks for helping to make our games better!

Offline Yuugi

  • Newbie Mark III
  • *
  • Posts: 30
That only makes us more curious. :|

Offline x4000

  • Chris McElligott Park, Arcen Founder and Lead Dev
  • Arcen Staff
  • Zenith Council Member Mark III
  • *****
  • Posts: 31,651
Sorry -- it was meant to make you feel more reassured!
Have ideas or bug reports for one of our games?  Mantis for Suggestions and Bug Reports. Thanks for helping to make our games better!

Offline TechSY730

  • Core Member Mark V
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,570
Well, now I am worried. Is co-op no longer going to be single player except with multiple people running around at the same time? That is something I liked about AI War's co-op.

Offline zebramatt

  • Master Member Mark II
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,574
I'm going to not go out on any sort of particular limb here and suggest that maybe, just maybe, knowing only that the multiplayer has changed from some state of affairs we knew very little about to some other state of affairs we know just as little about but which may not have been completely decided yet as well, might make it just ever so slightly too early to start worrying about it.

But maybe I'm just being optimistic and in fact we should all run about panicking with our arms flapping above our heads...

 :D

Offline tigersfan

  • Arcen Games Contractor
  • Arcen Staff
  • Master Member Mark II
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,599
I'm going to not go out on any sort of particular limb here and suggest that maybe, just maybe, knowing only that the multiplayer has changed from some state of affairs we knew very little about to some other state of affairs we know just as little about but which may not have been completely decided yet as well, might make it just ever so slightly too early to start worrying about it.

But maybe I'm just being optimistic and in fact we should all run about panicking with our arms flapping above our heads...

 :D

Yeah, I don't think you have anything to worry about. Chris explained it to me as well, and while I'm not as into co-op and multiplayer as he is, I thought it sounded like a lot of fun too.

Offline x4000

  • Chris McElligott Park, Arcen Founder and Lead Dev
  • Arcen Staff
  • Zenith Council Member Mark III
  • *****
  • Posts: 31,651
Yeah, I wouldn't worry about it too much.  We're trying to keep as close to the spirit of "single player except with multiple people running around at the same time" as possible, but there's multiple ways to interpret and implement that.  We've moved from one interpretation that is more "traditional" and also unacceptably imprecise over the Internet (that whole schmup thing), to another interpretation of that same idea using some design concepts that are specific to AVWW and which I've not seen in any other game ever, but which meet all the core goals of having lagproof combat while at the same time letting players run around together and kill enemies and bosses together, and all that jazz.
Have ideas or bug reports for one of our games?  Mantis for Suggestions and Bug Reports. Thanks for helping to make our games better!

Offline Hyfrydle

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 587
Re: AVWW Beta 0.531, "Glyph Transplants and Abandoned Settlements," Released!
« Reply #10 on: October 27, 2011, 02:15:59 pm »
The idea of transferring the Glyph to an npc is cool but I've yet to find any npc with better or even equal stats to the player character so have had no reason to do this. Has anyone else found a use for this?

Offline @B0FH

  • Full Member Mark II
  • ***
  • Posts: 162
Re: AVWW Beta 0.531, "Glyph Transplants and Abandoned Settlements," Released!
« Reply #11 on: October 27, 2011, 02:21:39 pm »
Being honest my main use for it currently has been to use up my dust so my higher-level ones don't disappear off the page and be unselectable when I need to craft with them lol

Am sure to try them out at some point just for the sake of it though

Offline TechSY730

  • Core Member Mark V
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,570
Re: AVWW Beta 0.531, "Glyph Transplants and Abandoned Settlements," Released!
« Reply #12 on: October 27, 2011, 02:33:35 pm »
Being honest my main use for it currently has been to use up my dust so my higher-level ones don't disappear off the page and be unselectable when I need to craft with them lol

Am sure to try them out at some point just for the sake of it though

What? There still is no scroll bar or page type thing to accommodate huge inventories? That sounds like one for Mantis.

Offline @B0FH

  • Full Member Mark II
  • ***
  • Posts: 162
Re: AVWW Beta 0.531, "Glyph Transplants and Abandoned Settlements," Released!
« Reply #13 on: October 27, 2011, 02:36:25 pm »
Not that I have noticed, but it is the sort of thing I'd maybe not spot (Not seeing the wood for the trees)

Offline x4000

  • Chris McElligott Park, Arcen Founder and Lead Dev
  • Arcen Staff
  • Zenith Council Member Mark III
  • *****
  • Posts: 31,651
Re: AVWW Beta 0.531, "Glyph Transplants and Abandoned Settlements," Released!
« Reply #14 on: October 27, 2011, 02:39:40 pm »
Being honest my main use for it currently has been to use up my dust so my higher-level ones don't disappear off the page and be unselectable when I need to craft with them lol

Am sure to try them out at some point just for the sake of it though

What? There still is no scroll bar or page type thing to accommodate huge inventories? That sounds like one for Mantis.

Your inventory is actually finite.  Right now it's just not capping you to be unable to pick up more items when there are too many rows.  There won't be scrollbars or paging, you just need to clear out the inventory!  But it hasn't been a big priority for us because most folks don't seem to be reaching that degree of inventory saturation -- you can hold 100 -- or maybe it's 120, I can't remember -- items in each category.
Have ideas or bug reports for one of our games?  Mantis for Suggestions and Bug Reports. Thanks for helping to make our games better!

 

SMF spam blocked by CleanTalk