How To Force The AI To Use A Wormhole ?????

[Shadoz]

Next to my front planet is an neutral planet ... after i cleaned up and killed all enemys i get back to rebuild myself ... during this time the ai placed around 15k new ships (12k in carriers + 3k normal) at the neutral planet at the wormhole to my front planet ...
Now they wast their time waiting for something :-) ...

now my question ... is their a "normal" way without warheads or golems to FORCE them using the wormhole to attack my planet

this happends soo often that they place so much ships at wormholes next to me and they dont attack ... by attacking at my own i loos so much ships that i need so long time to rebuild that they have arrived next ships in the range of 10k :-) ... so i cannt go forward at this time ... all are mkIV and in the carriers are much mkV ships inside ... i need another way instead of using warheads ...
i moves a hiver golem to them unloaded the 500 ships what it builds - after this they used the wormhole and attacked my planet ...
but iam looking for an alternate method without warheads or golems to use this method in other games without golems


do someone know how to force enemy big fleets parking at wormholes to fly through


please answer me

[Orelius]

First of all, the title is a tad misleading - you may want to structure it as a question, so people don't look at it and think it's a guide on how to do something._{The spelling and capitalization could use work, too, though.}

If you want the AI to go through the wormhole, just provoke them!  Send a handful of ships to stir up the fleet, or send a martyr or warhead into their midst.  But that's what you didn't want do do, right?

Never fear!  You can also take your fleet off of the world for but a few seconds, so the firepower on the planet drastically reduces, causing AI ships to flood in, after which you quickly withdraw your fleet and duke it out with the AI fleet.

Thing is, if there are fifteen thousand ships parked out of your world, you're much better off spending an AI progress or two hitting them with an EMP or lightning warhead.  What difficulty are you playing on?  AI progress?  It seems to be a bit ... excessive.

[Shadoz]

Iam playing 2x Diff 9 / 2x Extreme Raider / 2x +150% resources / high ship caps / 3 starting planets

AI progress is II by around 300 PKTs ... next to the neutral planet where the enemys parked is an mkIV planet which spawns mass of mkIV units to park at wormhole ...
i dont see i good chance ... the best way would to force them fly through the wormhole to attack me ^^ than the 15k wouldn't be a problem my defense is extremle heavy ... but in open battle by attacking the enemys i have no chance ... 1025 mercs i have die so fast and thats a wast of resources cause untill i have only build around some pieces of rebuilding mercs the ai have the next 15k fleet parking ^^ .... and the 1025 mercs dont do a big job cause the 15k are to much ^^ ... supporting the 1k mercs by my 32 super spire ships (fallen spire campaign -3 city hubs are build) will change nothing ... i can send all ships i can build ... this will kill most of them but my own fleet decrease so heavy that is is no way ...
and both attacks DONT force them to fly through the wormhole ...
by warheads i can send so much that all die ^^^^ ... this force them only in the last step to fly throught ...

there had to be a forcing method ...

[Red Spot]

Pull all your ships of the planet for a few seconds, this may trigger the AI to attack. At which point you send your own fleet back in order to defend the planet.

Personally though, 15k mk2 ships I would handle by finding a Xampite mineral and getting 4 mk2 Martyrs ... dont think the rest needs much explaining

[keith.lamothe]

My usual tactic is to use a mkI or mkII EMP warhead and send my Fallen Spire capital ships through and just mop them up (harder if they're in carriers since the emp doesn't hit the stuff inside).  It does cost AIP but not very much.

Another tactic I use is to send my capital ships out of my territory by another path and bring them around to enter the blob's planet from a different wormhole (so I'm not flying right into their teeth).  The combination of not having the capital ship firepower on my planet AND having it on their planet instead is usually enough to tip over the threshold and make them think they've got a shot at actually taking down my planet and that they don't want to stay on the planet with all my big ships anyway.  Then I rush the capital fleet through to my planet to strafe the blob as they rush my city defenses on the other side.

Alternatively, for the future, you can maintain a buffer of human worlds (or even neutral worlds, I suppose) with only modest defenses (no spire cities or capital ships or fortresses, etc) and the AI will happily attack those with much smaller forces, and you can either dispatch them with those local defenses or temporarily bring in the big guns to clean them out and then pull back to the "citadel" world.  This could potentially take more of your time than periodically wiping out the collecting blobs, but it's also probably less dangerous (in my experience, 2000-3000 mkIII/mkIV ships on low-caps is sufficient to simply overrun even a max-tech city with significant fleet support, so in theory an 8000-12000 blob on high caps would do much the same).

[Garthor]

To force the AI to use a wormhole, use Etherjets, Tractor Platforms, or Black Widow Golems.

Sometimes Martyrs, but that can backfire miserably, as they don't do the explodey thing if they die while wormholing.

Oh, also Riot Starships.

[keith.lamothe]

Yea, I thought of the tractor approach too, but with literally 15,000 AI ships sitting on the wormhole they'd probably vaporize your tractor force before they could get back through the wormhole with their prizes.  Possibly even the black widow golem; but even if not that would be a very expensive repair bill.

[Shadoz]

i tryed all your answers befor i posted here ^^^^

no chance ... i fly trough the wormhole and be killed near instant ...
the only way it work i send much lightning warheads throught ... but in this way they dont use the wormhole ... instead they all die ...
but this method is not what i want to use ... takes much AI progress in order to do this multiple times and they get this wormhole waiting by 15k units and more on every planet ...

so no other opinions

[TechSY730]

i tryed all your answers befor i posted here ^^^^

no chance ... i fly trough the wormhole and be killed near instant ...
the only way it work i send much lightning warheads throught ... but in this way they dont use the wormhole ... instead they all die ...
but this method is not what i want to use ... takes much AI progress in order to do this multiple times and they get this wormhole waiting by 15k units and more on every planet ...

so no other opinions

Yea, you got a tricky issue here. I'm surprised with 15k units, the AI still does not think that it has enough firepower to take out the planet they are "stalking".

If you think your defenses + mobile military can take them on if they were on your terf, try moving your mobile military to another planet temporarily. (As has been suggested before)

Once they start piling in, bring you mobile military back into the system, and stomp them.

If you don't think your defenses + mobile military could take them on, then the AI has got you kind of cornered. If that is the case, their decision to stall you until they get enough forces to curb-stomp you quickly is the right choice. You may have no choice but to lose several planets, widdling down their force a bit each time.

Annoying, yes, but then again, we human players gather "blobs" of units to attack and defend all the time. Why shouldn't the AI?

Part of the challenge of AI War is to avoid freeing too many units that you can't kill while still on the offense. Otherwise, they will stack up like this, and be really hard to take on.

[Red Spot]

Pretty much illustrating why I so very much like the Spirecraft Minor faction.
Martyrs allow for easy removal of overly big AI-blobs. Penetrators allow for nuking a CC that has been surrounded by 1k+ Hybrids and escorts.
You can 'grind' your way through them, but 20 planets into a game it becomes a bit too much of a grind. The Spirecraft give you a sweet alternative .. though leave some room for abusive use.





(If you build a cap of mk1+2 Penetrators and simultaniously hit as many CCs at the same time as you can, you only get reinforcements dripping in based of the AIP when you started nuking, making for a very undefended last planet relative to actual AIP. Just brace yourself when the freed ships start hitting you, and hope you can remain standing )

[Shrugging Khan]

Set up defences on your side of the wormhole, retreat your mobile military to some nearby system, do something else for a while. When the enemy's numbers have grown enough, they will attack - let your turrets handle them for as long as it takes for your mobiles to come back in and save the day.