Player actions need more noticable effect overall

[Misery]

There is another balance option, besides buffing all of the player actions.  And that is toning down the wild swings the game takes.  If instead of a race declaring war on a neutral race and wiping them out in a solar month or two, if the escalation and then eventual war was more gradual, it would give us more time to alter the universe.

This, this is a very good point.

I'm not against the idea of doing something, but having it take some time to really perform it's task.  That's fine.

But that idea utterly breaks down when different things happen fast enough that you CANT do anything about them with the options that you do have.  And this is currently the case.   The game's pacing is still too fast.  The solar system descends into chaos quickly, and there's little that can be done about it.

Heck, part of the point of the Dispatch system is to advance the time, but in a way that you are doing an action WHILE you wait, making it more meaningful.  That alone suggests a slower pace to things overall.  But right now it's like "Ok, I'll just take 8 months to do this here, allright, let's see what happ- OMIGOD THE ANDORS EXPLODED", and that is.... pretty frequent.

[lifehole]

There is another balance option, besides buffing all of the player actions.  And that is toning down the wild swings the game takes.  If instead of a race declaring war on a neutral race and wiping them out in a solar month or two, if the escalation and then eventual war was more gradual, it would give us more time to alter the universe.

This, this is a very good point.

I'm not against the idea of doing something, but having it take some time to really perform it's task.  That's fine.

But that idea utterly breaks down when different things happen fast enough that you CANT do anything about them with the options that you do have.  And this is currently the case.   The game's pacing is still too fast.  The solar system descends into chaos quickly, and there's little that can be done about it.

Heck, part of the point of the Dispatch system is to advance the time, but in a way that you are doing an action WHILE you wait, making it more meaningful.  That alone suggests a slower pace to things overall.  But right now it's like "Ok, I'll just take 8 months to do this here, allright, let's see what happ- OMIGOD THE ANDORS EXPLODED", and that is.... pretty frequent.

Very. The amount of techs that gets researched in the period of just one 10 month dispatch is insane. Especially considering it's basically always 3 people who research it. If they're going to increase they length they have to decrease the frequency. I really don't understand the point, though, if that time is just going to be spent fast-forwarding.

[GC13]

I think armadas and troops not costing any maintenance hurts the long-term strategic planning of the game. Right now a military buildup is totally normal, and it means that a race can be wiped out before we can even see the war start.

Now, I think we all agree that war declarations should automatically pause the game and maybe even prompt you to cancel your current dispatch mission. However, wading into a war that's already started should be a last resort. We're supposed to be masterminds here: we should see the war coming and try to either stop it or redirect it.

If a race had to pay maintenance on its armadas, and even higher maintenance when they were stationed in orbit around a hostile world, there would be a real strategic tradeoff to building up the fleets. Build too many armadas and you're not able to spend on stuff that will make you stronger in the long-term, like your science and RCI buildings. Build too few and pin all of your hopes on the late game though, and you'll find your planet hosting a new Thoraxian hive.

If armadas cost maintenance, a large military buildup would send ripples through the solar system. Neighbors would see the growth and respond in kind. Now in possession of new, expensive hardware, races will start looking to make those fleets pay for themselves, so everyone definitely doesn't want to be seen as the easy target. Mutual defense pacts and non-aggression pacts can help calm the tension, but if races aren't already friendly they might need a credible force willing to work the backchannels for them...

[runetrantor]

If we take war declarations that seriously, then so should the races. I lost count how many times the event 'planet attack' which seems to be the war declaration equivalent is called by like 5 races, and then everyone... sort of sit there doing nothing, and if I am lucky, I do get to see a siege over the attacked planet 6 months down the line.

[Hartmann]

If we take war declarations that seriously, then so should the races. I lost count how many times the event 'planet attack' which seems to be the war declaration equivalent is called by like 5 races, and then everyone... sort of sit there doing nothing, and if I am lucky, I do get to see a siege over the attacked planet 6 months down the line.

I got the same problem in my game.
And, just now, I played the patched game.
In one year, I won the campaign. All the ships flying around the burlusk planet finally attacked, eradicating them. Then the boarines died, out of the blue, because of the thoraxians, and then the acutians got killed too.

I think they can fix it by simply having the races maintaining only minimal military forces when it's not the war. Something like "we got some pirates here and here, but we don't need that giant battleship, a cruiser will be enough" followed by "The acutians are declaring war on us? MOBILISATION !! EVERYONE TAKE A GUN AND FIGHT THE ROBOTIC INVADER, LET'S DO IT SPACE-SPARTAN STYLE, EVEN THROUGH WE'RE NOT SUPPOSED TO KNOW WHAT SPARTAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA IS"

[lifehole]

If we take war declarations that seriously, then so should the races. I lost count how many times the event 'planet attack' which seems to be the war declaration equivalent is called by like 5 races, and then everyone... sort of sit there doing nothing, and if I am lucky, I do get to see a siege over the attacked planet 6 months down the line.

I got the same problem in my game.
And, just now, I played the patched game.
In one year, I won the campaign. All the ships flying around the burlusk planet finally attacked, eradicating them. Then the boarines died, out of the blue, because of the thoraxians, and then the acutians got killed too.

I think they can fix it by simply having the races maintaining only minimal military forces when it's not the war. Something like "we got some pirates here and here, but we don't need that giant battleship, a cruiser will be enough" followed by "The acutians are declaring war on us? MOBILISATION !! EVERYONE TAKE A GUN AND FIGHT THE ROBOTIC INVADER, LET'S DO IT SPACE-SPARTAN STYLE, EVEN THROUGH WE'RE NOT SUPPOSED TO KNOW WHAT SPARTAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA IS"

How did you win in one year? With the new patch observer games take like 200 years to resolve.

Also how is what you're saying related to what he is saying? He said it took a long time for the AI to do things, you're saying it took only a year and it all happened instantly.

[Hartmann]

How did you win in one year? With the new patch observer games take like 200 years to resolve.

Also how is what you're saying related to what he is saying? He said it took a long time for the AI to do things, you're saying it took only a year and it all happened instantly.

Because there are (correction: WERE) ships all over the place. The patch just activated them somehow.
And also, while it may happen that over the course of a slight misunderstanding, I feared that he might be victim of the following boring handicap named "haven't patched it". To remedy to say problem, I presented my situation, that you obviously understood as "GNEUU I HAVE SHIT AND THEY DON'T DO SHIP", who magically (devs are wizzards) turned into "OH MY GOD A SPACE STEAMROLLER ! WHERE IS DIO?". Alas, one could say that these statements are not related, to which I would say "I used to have PEOPLE ARE GETTING ON THE PLANET ! PREPARE THE BOOZE announces, and then I learned to stop worry about it and it magically turned from a flying magical circus of ships to a general steamroller with only one zOMG THEY ARE COMING THE SKYLAXIANS ARE COMING, ROLL FOR NASAL CIRCUMFERENCE announce, followed by a THAT PATHETIC RACE OF OVERWEIGHT LOSER GOT STOMPED IN THE GROUND SO HARD WE'RE GOING TO CONFUSE THEM FOR DINOSAURS WHEN WE'LL START DIGGING THAT STUFF TO FIND SHINY".


TL;DR : I also got these "planetary assault" messages. Then I got the patch. Now they are relevant, as they signed the death of three races.

EDIT : Also, by "I won in one year", I meant "it was a stalemate that lasted for 20 years. Everything got resolved in one year because the new patch is so awesome it makes my computer smells gooOH MY GOD THERE'S A SPIDER IN MY ROOM

[lifehole]

How did you win in one year? With the new patch observer games take like 200 years to resolve.

Also how is what you're saying related to what he is saying? He said it took a long time for the AI to do things, you're saying it took only a year and it all happened instantly.

Because there are (correction: WERE) ships all over the place. The patch just activated them somehow.
And also, while it may happen that over the course of a slight misunderstanding, I feared that he might be victim of the following boring handicap named "haven't patched it". To remedy to say problem, I presented my situation, that you obviously understood as "GNEUU I HAVE SHIT AND THEY DON'T DO SHIP", who magically (devs are wizzards) turned into "OH MY GOD A SPACE STEAMROLLER ! WHERE IS DIO?". Alas, one could say that these statements are not related, to which I would say "I used to have PEOPLE ARE GETTING ON THE PLANET ! PREPARE THE BOOZE announces, and then I learned to stop worry about it and it magically turned from a flying magical circus of ships to a general steamroller with only one zOMG THEY ARE COMING THE SKYLAXIANS ARE COMING, ROLL FOR NASAL CIRCUMFERENCE announce, followed by a THAT PATHETIC RACE OF OVERWEIGHT LOSER GOT STOMPED IN THE GROUND SO HARD WE'RE GOING TO CONFUSE THEM FOR DINOSAURS WHEN WE'LL START DIGGING THAT STUFF TO FIND SHINY".


TL;DR : I also got these "planetary assault" messages. Then I got the patch. Now they are relevant, as they signed the death of three races.

EDIT : Also, by "I won in one year", I meant "it was a stalemate that lasted for 20 years. Everything got resolved in one year because the new patch is so awesome it makes my computer smells gooOH MY GOD THERE'S A SPIDER IN MY ROOM

Did someone forget to take his ADHD meds today? Haha, I know the feeling. Alright, so the patch changed the rules of the game you were playing and caused everything to resolve. Thanks for explaining.

[Hartmann]

Did someone forget to take his ADHD meds today? Haha, I know the feeling. Alright, so the patch changed the rules of the game you were playing and caused everything to resolve. Thanks for explaining.

Don't joke about medicines.

[lifehole]

Did someone forget to take his ADHD meds today? Haha, I know the feeling. Alright, so the patch changed the rules of the game you were playing and caused everything to resolve. Thanks for explaining.

Don't joke about medicines.

Sorry, I go to a mental health institute for a daily program so it's something I've become accustomed to.

[Hartmann]

Sorry, I go to a mental health institute for a daily program so it's something I've become accustomed to.

I try to laugh about everything (including my lack of skills at TLF) because that's what humour is, but there are still things I can't joke with. Addictions being one of them.

[lifehole]

Sorry, I go to a mental health institute for a daily program so it's something I've become accustomed to.

I try to laugh about everything (including my lack of skills at TLF) because that's what humour is, but there are still things I can't joke with. Addictions being one of them.

Okay man, I understand, not here to argue/go off topic, sorry.

[Hartmann]

Okay man, I understand, not here to argue/go off topic, sorry.

No problem, it's my fault as well.

Now that's being said, I started a new game, and I can tell you, the patch definitely got rid of the "we're circling over your head" bug. I'm fighting to keep the acutian alive here.

EDIT : and it bothers me how everything will declare war on each other despite their relationships being "neutral".

[chemical_art]

EDIT : and it bothers me how everything will declare war on each other despite their relationships being "neutral".

Is there more going on here though then just that?

For me, if playing a strategy game, "neutral" just means "one less variable to worry about". SO if for example my military is much stronger, and politics/diplomacy/ internal order all say "good enough" then I ATTACK, because...that is what strategy games say to do? I have this expensive military...gotta use them for something, right? And if no bigger threat oppose me...and I'm a bad guy already...why not attack?

[Hartmann]

Is there more going on here though then just that?

For me, if playing a strategy game, "neutral" just means "one less variable to worry about". SO if for example my military is much stronger, and politics/diplomacy/ internal order all say "good enough" then I ATTACK, because...that is what strategy games say to do? I have this expensive military...gotta use them for something, right? And if no bigger threat oppose me...and I'm a bad guy already...why not attack?

In that case, there's a balance problem. In my last (I mean current, but since I ragequitted after healing BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD) game, the Acutians were one of the first accessing spacefaring (the third), and yet the thoraxians and burlusks declared war on them, despite accessing spacefaring way later.
And frankly, it's making my game impossible, since I spend all my time defending the acutians instead of boosting my diplomacy, my influence, or researching techs.