How well do races late to spacefaring generally do?

[Professor Paul1290]

I was curious as to what your experiences have been with races that end up being relatively late to spacefaring compared to others.

I think the Peltians ended up being pretty late to the party during my last game, but they seemed to do OK anyway. They kind of got lucky with not being attacked much for a while and the more powerful races who would be hostile were being attacked or otherwise suffering from various problems.

With that in mind I get the impression that how a race does shortly after becoming spacefaring seems to have more to do with how things are going at the time the make the jump rather than how early or late they are. While they aren't spacefaring they seem to be isolated from the arena somewhat.

Experiences? Opinions?

[x4000]

Yes, if they aren't spacefaring, the other races can't bother them.  The idea is that the game is simply smaller at that point -- that's the goal, anyhow.

[Teal_Blue]

Has anyone done an observer mode just to see what kind of things happen over the course of the millennia?
Just a thought.

[Professor Paul1290]

Has anyone done an observer mode just to see what kind of things happen over the course of the millennia?
Just a thought.

That's...    ...not a bad idea actually, I'll try that! 

[dersquatch]

I let a game play out in double-time without me interfering once.

The Thoraxians massacred most of the system before the Evucks blew themselves up. After that was just Peltian bombardment of Bug planets, and Bugs taking other planets, leapfrog-style.

[Teal_Blue]

I let a game play out in double-time without me interfering once.

The Thoraxians massacred most of the system before the Evucks blew themselves up. After that was just Peltian bombardment of Bug planets, and Bugs taking other planets, leapfrog-style.

It would be cool to see vids of this, if it was OK with Chris and company.   But not sure he wants that yet.

-T

[Professor Paul1290]

Ok, so findings from my brief fast-forward test.

By far the last races to get to spacefaring were the Evucks and the Peltians, and they were so late almost everyone else had space outposts at that point.
The Evucks actually started out pretty strong, they fizzled out after a while but it took quite a long while before that happened and a lot of stuff changed by then.
The Peltians started slower and they got pretty strong. I think by the time I decided to end it they had the 3rd highest population and the largest number of armadas.

That does seems to back up my earlier guess that the effect of when a race goes spacefaring seems to have more to do with what's happening at the time they become spacefaring and earlier does not equal better.

Come to think of it, that may suggest that putting-off making a potential ally race spacefaring might actually be a good idea in some situations, maybe if the current situation isn't very favorable.

[Teal_Blue]

Ok, so findings from my brief fast-forward test.

By far the last races to get to spacefaring were the Evucks and the Peltians, and they were so late almost everyone else had space outposts at that point.
The Evucks actually started out pretty strong, they fizzled out after a while but it took quite a long while before that happened and a lot of stuff changed by then.
The Peltians started slower and they got pretty strong. I think by the time I decided to end it they had the 3rd highest population and the largest number of armadas.

That does seems to back up my earlier guess that the effect of when a race goes spacefaring seems to have more to do with what's happening at the time they become spacefaring and earlier does not equal better.

Come to think of it, that may suggest that putting-off making a potential ally race spacefaring might actually be a good idea in some situations, maybe if the current situation isn't very favorable.

sounds like good logic. How long are these games taking when you play them? Or is there a mechanic for making short or long games?

[keith.lamothe]

You can basically do observer mode by using the Advanced Start and ticking the Ghost Mode toggle there (so that assassins don't come after you, etc).

When I do it I generally see either the Thoraxians, the Burlusts, or the Peltians conquer the system.

Peltians are a fearful invasion force.  For both sides.

[Teal_Blue]

Not to complicate things... but it would be interesting to see other races, in effect not just the Thoraxians, the Burlusts and the Peltians end up as conquerors of the system.

Perhaps there could be 'events' inserted into the flow of history, where the acquisition of space faring tech has a possibility of backfiring and blowing up a large section of the planet and the planets population. This could be temporary, or permanent. Permanent might be interesting as it could change the 'landscape' of a game from instance to instance (from game to game).

In this way, by chance some races will fail, and others will come to the fore.

What this could also mean, is that even with all our efforts to get a race to space faring status, our efforts could come to naught. An interesting possibility which makes the process of helping them a doubtful thing. Also interesting because it is possible to produce a different outcome each time we try to bring a race to space faring status.

Or you might have other things in place already, but just thought i would throw an idea out to see what you thought, hope you don't mind.
-T

[x4000]

Since .808, the Thoraxians are less dominant than they had been, or at least not as fast.  It's back to more like it was in December, where they or the Burlusts tend to conquer everything if left unchecked, but it takes a goodly while.  In .809, I expect that there will be more mutual aid happening from races thanks to the attitude adjustments up and down in key circumstances, so we'll see how that affects things.

[Teal_Blue]

  sounds good. looking forward to it. A possibility of more than one outcome in events sounds interesting, not to mention the re-playability. 

[Teal_Blue]

Not to complicate things... but it would be interesting to see other races, in effect not just the Thoraxians, the Burlusts and the Peltians end up as conquerors of the system.

Perhaps there could be 'events' inserted into the flow of history, where the acquisition of space faring tech has a possibility of backfiring and blowing up a large section of the planet and the planets population. This could be temporary, or permanent. Permanent might be interesting as it could change the 'landscape' of a game from instance to instance (from game to game).

In this way, by chance some races will fail, and others will come to the fore.

What this could also mean, is that even with all our efforts to get a race to space faring status, our efforts could come to naught. An interesting possibility which makes the process of helping them a doubtful thing. Also interesting because it is possible to produce a different outcome each time we try to bring a race to space faring status.

Or you might have other things in place already, but just thought i would throw an idea out to see what you thought, hope you don't mind.
-T

Just a quick amendment.

Looking at this now makes me wonder if it doesn't seem sort of over much to have this happen on a 'regular' basis. I mean the possibility 50% every time a race tries to go space faring, might be way too much.

To be fair and to put it in a 'proper' light (one with less chance of happening all the time), it might be better to pare this possibility of failure during the try to reach space fairing status back to a 10% chance of happening. So it will happen, but much less frequently.

And as Chris mentioned there will be the possibility of 'other' things coming into play that effect that event. Like several races banding together to reach space fairing status together, or banding together into a mutual group to fend off the larger or more advanced or hostile races.

So we could have several kinds of empires or federations, Our Federation of Peace, The Federation of Fear, but also the Federation of Mutual Interests?

Each type of Federation could be permanent on forming, or as in real life, subject to the forces of the universe around them. Perhaps forming and then a hundred years later collapsing from internal disinterest, or opposing agendas of the member parties. 

There could be other 'events' of course just as viable as the groups of races banding together for self protection. Such as random meteor showers that destroy armadas, or planets. Thereby eliminating some participants accidentally. Which may make things interesting in that it may make us realize that the workings of the universe around the player and the other races is just as deadly, and game altering, as their skirmishes and wars and political maneuvering.

Just some thoughts, hope this all is OK. You've probably already thought of all this stuff, but it is just occurring to me, so it all seems new. 

Thanks for listening,
-Teal