Author Topic: The bomb-generator thing in rooms  (Read 275 times)

Offline carldong

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The bomb-generator thing in rooms
« on: January 08, 2017, 03:06:39 PM »
So this is the map: QuadEE/PT_Brain. If I remember correctly, in some previous builds, the room is cleared without the need to clean up all the drones/bombs generated by those generators. Now I have to, but the problem is that I have nowhere near the firepower to outpace its generation rate because this is the first room I encounter, That means base firepower. The four generators are so far apart and is separated by a laser, so that it is simply impossible to clean them. So,

This is a room that is (almost) impossible to clear, even on Very Easy, at this stage

Given the folder name of QuadEE, I suppose there are more rooms like this.

Offline Frumple

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Re: The bomb-generator thing in rooms
« Reply #1 on: January 08, 2017, 04:10:06 PM »
Dunno if it means much (I have noticed any rooms that actually require missile use to clear, after all), but iirc those generators are missile breakable.

Offline carldong

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Re: The bomb-generator thing in rooms
« Reply #2 on: January 08, 2017, 04:46:53 PM »
Didn't know they are missile breakable. However, something is wrong if I have to use 4 missiles on these things to clear a room/

Offline Cinth

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Re: The bomb-generator thing in rooms
« Reply #3 on: January 08, 2017, 04:57:13 PM »
You don't happen to have a save while in that room do you?
Quote from: keith.lamothe
Opened your save. My computer wept. Switched to the ST planet and ship icons filled my screen, so I zoomed out. Game told me that it _was_ totally zoomed out. You could seriously walk from one end of the inner grav well to the other without getting your feet cold.

Offline carldong

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Re: The bomb-generator thing in rooms
« Reply #4 on: January 08, 2017, 05:01:50 PM »
Um... Didn't keep the save. Does the game keep old saves a few games before? But I think I got the room name correctly. Unless PT_Brain.txt is not its name.

Offline Cinth

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Re: The bomb-generator thing in rooms
« Reply #5 on: January 08, 2017, 05:10:04 PM »
The only saves that are kept beyond the norm are bug report saves.  Those are actually pretty helpful in cases like these (we can see exactly what you saw and maybe see whats up or test changes directly on that).

I wasn't questioning the room name since that is a room.
Quote from: keith.lamothe
Opened your save. My computer wept. Switched to the ST planet and ship icons filled my screen, so I zoomed out. Game told me that it _was_ totally zoomed out. You could seriously walk from one end of the inner grav well to the other without getting your feet cold.

Offline carldong

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Re: The bomb-generator thing in rooms
« Reply #6 on: January 08, 2017, 05:15:02 PM »
I see. Next time I will get the bug report save and attach that.

Offline Cinth

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Re: The bomb-generator thing in rooms
« Reply #7 on: January 08, 2017, 06:01:52 PM »
After looking at the room, I think it just needs more available missile drops.  If you kill 2 or 3 then the last should be able to pop via clearing the spawns out.
Quote from: keith.lamothe
Opened your save. My computer wept. Switched to the ST planet and ship icons filled my screen, so I zoomed out. Game told me that it _was_ totally zoomed out. You could seriously walk from one end of the inner grav well to the other without getting your feet cold.

Offline carldong

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Re: The bomb-generator thing in rooms
« Reply #8 on: January 08, 2017, 06:04:11 PM »
After looking at the room, I think it just needs more available missile drops.  If you kill 2 or 3 then the last should be able to pop via clearing the spawns out.

What if I run out of missiles before starting to kill these things? I think this game is designed around that you can use the White Gloss's main weapon alone to clear everything(theoretically, maybe if you are Misery), and missiles are not required, just makes stuff easier.

Offline Cinth

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Re: The bomb-generator thing in rooms
« Reply #9 on: January 08, 2017, 06:07:17 PM »
What if I run out of missiles before starting to kill these things? I think this game is designed around that you can use the White Gloss's main weapon alone to clear everything(theoretically, maybe if you are Misery), and missiles are not required, just makes stuff easier.

If a room needs missiles, then it should give you enough to clear the room, that is the rule there.  That way you can come in with 0 missiles and not get blocked.  PT_Brain has a missile drop, maybe one more would help.

That's what I'm going to suggest anyway.
Quote from: keith.lamothe
Opened your save. My computer wept. Switched to the ST planet and ship icons filled my screen, so I zoomed out. Game told me that it _was_ totally zoomed out. You could seriously walk from one end of the inner grav well to the other without getting your feet cold.

Offline carldong

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Re: The bomb-generator thing in rooms
« Reply #10 on: January 08, 2017, 06:14:06 PM »
So this is the map: QuadEE/PT_Brain. If I remember correctly, in some previous builds, the room is cleared without the need to clean up all the drones/bombs generated by those generators. Now I have to, but the problem is that I have nowhere near the firepower to outpace its generation rate because this is the first room I encounter, That means base firepower. The four generators are so far apart and is separated by a laser, so that it is simply impossible to clean them. So,

This is a room that is (almost) impossible to clear, even on Very Easy, at this stage

Given the folder name of QuadEE, I suppose there are more rooms like this.

I have never seen other rooms that hard requre missiles. Not knowing that a room requires missiles(especially multiple missiles) can lead players to use those extras on enemies, and doomed when they finally realize they are supposed to use those missiles on something else. Feels like "lol in your face now you lose" situation, especially on first encounter, when such rooms are no different from "normal" rooms from the interface. See, I encountered those drone launchers multiple times but didn't know they can be destroyed(Yes, I know I didn't try. I am not a missile person).

Even generator rooms are passable without a missile. This room requires 4. Again, I have never seen any other room that hard requires missiles. I feel like bullethell games shouldn't require finite resources to be used.

Offline Logorouge

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Re: The bomb-generator thing in rooms
« Reply #11 on: January 08, 2017, 06:19:13 PM »
Worst case scenario, some alien eggs could be added near the spawners. Their explosion would work for that (I think), even if the player burns through all of the room's missile reserve.

Offline carldong

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Re: The bomb-generator thing in rooms
« Reply #12 on: January 08, 2017, 06:22:54 PM »
alien eggs

Those bombs are alien eggs???

Fortunately they don't hatch.

Offline Cinth

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Re: The bomb-generator thing in rooms
« Reply #13 on: January 08, 2017, 07:55:30 PM »
Even generator rooms are passable without a missile. This room requires 4. Again, I have never seen any other room that hard requires missiles. I feel like bullethell games shouldn't require finite resources to be used.

At most, 3 missiles.  Those spawners blow up once the other mobs are cleared out.

Quote from: keith.lamothe
Opened your save. My computer wept. Switched to the ST planet and ship icons filled my screen, so I zoomed out. Game told me that it _was_ totally zoomed out. You could seriously walk from one end of the inner grav well to the other without getting your feet cold.

Offline carldong

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Re: The bomb-generator thing in rooms
« Reply #14 on: January 08, 2017, 08:14:32 PM »
Even generator rooms are passable without a missile. This room requires 4. Again, I have never seen any other room that hard requires missiles. I feel like bullethell games shouldn't require finite resources to be used.

At most, 3 missiles.  Those spawners blow up once the other mobs are cleared out.

Yeah, but it doesn't change my thought that hard requiring consumables to clear a room is an unwise design.