Author Topic: Centrifuge, Misery Mode  (Read 5219 times)

Offline Misery

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Centrifuge, Misery Mode
« on: February 25, 2016, 01:18:07 am »
Allright, the showcase of whatever the hell these things are continues, with Centrifuge this time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dUKSXOOAe2Q


I cant even overstate how hard this one is.  Nearly jumped out of my chair when the horrible thing finally went down.   It's tougher than it looks.  But it's doable.  You just have to be REALLY careful.

And yes, I panic-dodged near the end.  I do that every now and then in these games.  In THIS game, it usually happens when Blaze Cannons are around...


Offline Cinth

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Re: Centrifuge, Misery Mode
« Reply #1 on: February 25, 2016, 01:58:42 am »
Allright, the showcase of whatever the hell these things are continues, with Centrifuge this time.




Fixed that for you :)
« Last Edit: February 25, 2016, 02:00:18 am by Cinth »
Quote from: keith.lamothe
Opened your save. My computer wept. Switched to the ST planet and ship icons filled my screen, so I zoomed out. Game told me that it _was_ totally zoomed out. You could seriously walk from one end of the inner grav well to the other without getting your feet cold.

Offline Misery

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Re: Centrifuge, Misery Mode
« Reply #2 on: February 25, 2016, 02:10:44 am »
Yeah, that seems to describe it pretty darn well indeed.

Offline mrhanman

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Re: Centrifuge, Misery Mode
« Reply #3 on: February 25, 2016, 03:24:46 am »
Holy crap! That required way more focus than I think I could muster.  :o

Now, do it again, but perfect this time.  8)

Offline PokerChen

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Re: Centrifuge, Misery Mode
« Reply #4 on: February 25, 2016, 08:07:55 am »
Hmm, I'm a bit torn between whether you should actually be able to see what you're shooting, or being able to see the shots that are coming. The video seems to make it mutually exclusive.

Offline Misery

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Re: Centrifuge, Misery Mode
« Reply #5 on: February 25, 2016, 08:19:26 am »
Hmm, I'm a bit torn between whether you should actually be able to see what you're shooting, or being able to see the shots that are coming. The video seems to make it mutually exclusive.

Actually this is one of the reasons why most of my bosses do not move.

I also suspect that this is one reason why bosses in Cave's games (which mine are inspired by) do not move;  because on higher difficulties, with certain patterns, you cant SEE them.  It depends very heavily on the nature of the pattern.

In this type of game though, being able to spot the bullets takes absolute precedence over everything else.  Otherwise you get.... one of Raizing's games (ugh).  I'll not rant about that though, I did that in a different topic awhile back already.

Those few bosses capable of movement will never have patterns this thick.  Instead, I'll find other things they can do.

Though, I will note that actually MOST bosses will never have patterns THIS thick (some will come close though!).  Thickness can make a pattern harder, but it's not where the core difficulty of one comes from.

Of course... it only matters so much, in a way.  With something like this, the player is typically going to be absolutely focused on the immediate area around their ship/mech/whatever at all times anyway.  If they try to just look at the boss for a moment, SPLAT!  There goes some HP...

Offline x4000

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Re: Centrifuge, Misery Mode
« Reply #6 on: February 25, 2016, 01:32:58 pm »
Holy cow, that's the first time I've seen you ever show any visible signs of worry in one of your videos.  You could see how you were basically "ffffff thissss" at a couple of points there, and then escaped and continued to win.  Nice.  ;D
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Offline steelwing

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Re: Centrifuge, Misery Mode
« Reply #7 on: February 25, 2016, 03:16:06 pm »
:O I was like "What is this I don't even..."

Offline TheVampire100

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Re: Centrifuge, Misery Mode
« Reply #8 on: February 25, 2016, 05:11:51 pm »
Can we just agree that thos boss is unbeatable? I mean, even Misery got a hard time and barely defeated it. So how should a normal mortal react to this monstrosity?

Misery, how long took it you to practice games like this to become so good?

Offline Hearteater

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Re: Centrifuge, Misery Mode
« Reply #9 on: February 25, 2016, 05:36:00 pm »
Soooo, no 2nd stage? :)

Offline ptarth

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Re: Centrifuge, Misery Mode
« Reply #10 on: February 25, 2016, 06:04:48 pm »
Easy.
Second stage: the pattern starts rotating the other way.
Third stage: the pattern switches rotations every rand(X,Y) second.
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Offline Hearteater

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Re: Centrifuge, Misery Mode
« Reply #11 on: February 25, 2016, 06:24:52 pm »
I kinda envisioned a series of rotating C-shaped rings that start out large and contract, with the player's ship at the center. So you need to maneuver out of through the opening of these rings.

Offline Misery

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Re: Centrifuge, Misery Mode
« Reply #12 on: February 25, 2016, 08:44:44 pm »
Holy cow, that's the first time I've seen you ever show any visible signs of worry in one of your videos.  You could see how you were basically "ffffff thissss" at a couple of points there, and then escaped and continued to win.  Nice.  ;D

Yes, this is the bit that made me wonder if I'd gone a little too far.  Though, at the same time, the pattern is very abnormal.  It's been *really* difficult to balance.  It took forever to get the stupid thing to do that.  You shoulda seen some of the stuff it was doing during testing.  I tell ya, it's hard to dodge when every inch of the screen is glowing pain.

With this game though I figure, if I'm not getting hit somewhat... it's not hard enough.  In an actual bullet-hell shmup, with one-hit deaths, this would be a very nasty pattern.  Not quite AS nasty here...  sort of.  It's kinda difficult to figure out where the difficulty should be with the varying levels of HP and such that can happen in this.  Not just on this difficulty, but on all of them.

And this is a mid-game boss, too.  Later ones will get interesting though I'm not looking forward to testing THOSE.  Particularly a certain upcoming special boss.  That'll get more than a little frustrating.

What'll be interesting with this specific boss though will be to see wether players can figure out HOW to deal with it.  The more you move, the more distorted the whole thing can become, depending on HOW you move.   Kinda like the Warden's second attack.


So how should a normal mortal react to this monstrosity?

Pray that the thing somehow glitches out and stops firing.  Though I'm hoping it doesnt do that... These stupid things can be buggy as heck since my code is so messy, I do get tired of fixing them (Warden).

Misery, how long took it you to practice games like this to become so good?

A couple of years.  These games are made that way (Roguelikes kinda are too, like, the traditional ones like Nethack and all... or something like Dwarf Fortress, where I watched *50* tutorial videos just to learn how to play it; so freaking worth it though, that game).  They give you as much replay value as possible by having nearly unlimited difficulty while still being technically entirely fair.  The worst example was the boss at the very end of Mushihime-sama's Ultra mode.  It took me AGES to get to that little nightmare.  It was another year (literally) before it finally went down.  Talk about a difficulty spike...   And then there's it's sequel.  I dont stand a ghost of a chance in that one's version of the "Ultra" mode.  Can do the first level but the second eats me.

Soooo, no 2nd stage? :)

Ugh, even I'm not THAT unpleasant.  Well, maybe... but I'm saving that for later.  THIS boss does enough.  And if I have to test it just one more time I'll throw the monitor out the window.

I kinda envisioned a series of rotating C-shaped rings that start out large and contract, with the player's ship at the center. So you need to maneuver out of through the opening of these rings.

Ya know, I'd had this thought before, for other bosses or whatever, but when I think about it, it's one of those patterns that's actually a little overused.  I've seen that one in so very many games.  Doesnt mean it's a bad one, mostly just that I personally didn't want to use it.  Of course, if someone else wants to make a boss or miniboss that does this, by all means, go for it.
« Last Edit: February 25, 2016, 08:47:49 pm by Misery »

Offline tombik

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Re: Centrifuge, Misery Mode
« Reply #13 on: February 29, 2016, 01:32:55 pm »
My biggest gripe with this boss is performance.

Most of the bullets are irrelevant because of the ones which are closer, is not there anyway to "summarize" the pattern?

By summarizing I mean: Areas which are safe to walk are still same, but this is forced by fewer bullets.

Offline Logorouge

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Re: Centrifuge, Misery Mode
« Reply #14 on: February 29, 2016, 02:40:28 pm »
By summarizing I mean: Areas which are safe to walk are still same, but this is forced by fewer bullets.
I see your point, but I think a redux version of that pattern would remove one important element from the boss: The panic-inducing effect of seeing such a large amount of bullets coming your way. You have to stay calm and solve the puzzle, despite the waves moving in front of you. I think it's an important part of it.

 

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