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My first feedback after ~15 runs

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nas1m:
Below I will give my initial thoughts on the current alpha as they occured during my very first couple of runs.
The version I used is .136.
I am sorry to say that there is not much fun for me in the game yet, although I can see the potential.
A major part of this might be things like the temp sound effects, which just don't give the satisfaction that I expected to get out of, well - shooting stuff.
So please take all I am saying here with a grain of salt.

For now this will be a simple bullet pointed list (hey ptarth!)
I will move relevant issues to Mantis later.

Disclaimer: I don't think that I am "getting the game" yet in terms of what it will look like once it is finished, especially with regard to how much it is supposed to cater to shmup and roguelike audiences respectively (of which I count myself more to the latter in recent times, but shmups and I have a past, you know ;) - ah good times). 

Confusing stuff

* I can't damage turrets? That just seems weird.
Later note: I encountered at least one turret type enemy that I was not able to damage, which greatly confused me since it was the first enemy I encountered. It stopped firing once I had cleared the room, though. I can provide an image if need be.
* I am often missing the fact that I got hit, even though the ship lights up. Not sure what to do about this at the moment.
* Ouch. I did not expect my missles to damage me as well in case that I am too near. But lesson learned I guess.
* Enemies don't do collison damage? This just feels wrong.
* Mines can't be shot (and exploded that way)? Feels wrong as well.
* How can I restore my shields? Health packs don't seem to do it?
* I am not sure whether there is an invincibility period after I have been hit and if so, how long it lasts.
Graphical stuff

* Wow, somehow I feel a little crowded. I just can't see far enough to reasonably plan my movement.
Later note: I discovered that the view can be zoomed after that, which totally provides ample view of all surroundings. So if at all this is just a question of the initial zoom factor being a little too far in, at least for small screens (I am playing on a laptop).
* I find it a little hard to tell background tiles and props from objects that matter (like chests). This got better once I "learned" what chests look like, but they definitely did not jump out to me like a chest does e.g. in Zelda games - I hope you get what I mean here. They just don't "pop" enough.
* The death animation of speeding up feels really weird - at least if it does not end with a suitable explosion :)
* Opening chests really feels underwhelming. Some animation or bigger banner communicating what has been found might go a long way here.
And there needs to be a fanfare - No point opening chests without an "item acquired" fanfare, right?
* The starfield backgrounds feel wrong/weird to me given the provided intro story. Why am I able to see the stars from everywhere within a ship?
* Not a big fan of the player ship sprite unfortunately. This is only my personnel taste of course.
I guess the main issue for me is that it does not look very "Hydral"/badass/Batman-In-Space to me...
* Wall tiles are sometimes hard to distinguish from floor tiles. I can provide an image illustrating what I mean if need be.
* What loot I find I don't feel inclined to use. A bonus for ten seconds does not seem that big a deal if I can easily spend this time just navigating the room and not shooting anything.
Maybe add the TLF style blast (to consume projectiles) as an additional incentive?
Gameplay

* Afterburner speed feels good, standard movement a tad too slow in my book. Some enemies move too fast in comparison (but you already mentioned as much in the dev notes at startup I think).
* Hotrod Bomber firing (and that of a couple of other lower-rate-of-fire hulls) feels too slooow.
* I like the bosses I have seen so far. A lot. These were the highlights of my short time with the game, but...
* Bosses also feel kind of disconnected to their environments. As in: Here is a boss that looks like a big flower (it reminds of a certain boss in Zelda 1 btw) but there is nothing in the room that "explains" why it would be here in this room of all rooms in a huge spaceship: No green, no "nature" props etc.
To some degree this is true for all enemies. Its all feels very arbitrary and disconnected at the moment in terms of rooms and what is in them.
Maybe this is just an issue of all those assets not being in the game yet, but I thought I should mention it.
I guess what I am looking for is some kind of "metroid-style" logic to areas: Fire-themed enemies in magma themed areas etc.
* Being able to stop on a dime definitely is essential and should be kept around even if momentum is introduced into player movement.
* I have a hard time getting into the game with the current temp sound effects. It just feels so wrong and underwhelming that I went with disabling sound altogether after a while.
Get me right, I know these are temp. I just want to stress how important they are in my book for the feel of this (kind of) game.
I guess I am one of those gamers for which lacking sounds really kill the experience...
* The gameplay currently does not "click" for me, mostly due to the game neither scratching my shmup nor my roguelike itch at the moment.
The rooms feel too small and not "railroaded" enough to classify as a shmup to me in a classical sense
(see Jamestown for an impression of what I have in mind here). Also the enemy count is too low for that.
My association with a shmup is fighting my way through waves of enemies. I have yet to see that here.
Maybe add a few "hallway" style rooms that could house more vanilla shmup action?
For a roguelike, there simply is too few exploration and loot going on in my book (again this might just be an issue of content)
Potential Bugs

* In one boss room, the boss spawned on top of me (i.e. immediately behind the door I entered) - kinda cheap.
EDIT: Just happened again. "Backfire" seems to be the offender here.
* The "Brick" enemy does not wake up if fired at.
* The "Richochet" circuit does nothing? At least none of my shots got deflected by walls.
* Enemies spawning in closed corner "pockets" often seem to get stuck in a single tile

ptarth:

* Welcome to the fold
* I think the turret that doesn't take damage is actually a reflector, it shoots when you shoot, and it isn't an enemy, more of a trap/obstacle.
* I agree with most of your points.
* Damage taking is weird. I can't tell when or how I'm taking damage, so I just don't get hit if I can help it, and then pray otherwise.
* The death animation could use some more sound effects and more random variation on your path while dying.
* The sounds are still underdevelopment as its an alpha.
* Loot items I would like more if I could have control when they start, although temporary bonuses have the same problem as secondary weapons. I save them until I need them, which I never do, because it could always be more dangerous later.
* The spaceship has giant windows...  ;)

tombik:

--- Quote from: ptarth on November 22, 2015, 02:55:18 pm ---

* The death animation
--- End quote ---

Actually thinking about it, animation for death itself implies that stopping should be harder.

Mostly when I die, I was not moving at all. So, having to speed up after i die to find a wall seems a bit forced. Whichever the movement scheme chosen, this should be considered I think.

Misery:
Let's see, a couple of things....

Firstly, that bit you mention about enemy count.  That I think is something to put onto Mantis to make sure everyone can see it, since that sorta bit is one of those things that will create the "feel" of the overall game.   Heck, you could almost put this whole thing on Mantis as a feedback report.  It just makes it easier for everyone to see it.  I have the time to check the forums alot, but everyone else might not.

I'd say, bring up that bit about the rooms and such as well on there.

As for the enemy count, this specific bit would be a little wonky right now anyway;  there's only so many enemies available.  In addition, something that might be slowing down the whole experience for you... and thus, changing it up so it "doesnt feel like a shmup" is the fact that the HP on enemies (and bosses) hasnt been balanced AT ALL.  Like, it's not been touched.  I've just been slapping the same number on many things, but have asked Chris about this, and he's pointed out that with so many items not in the game, and all of those items being hugely responsible for your stats, there's no point in worrying about enemy HP right now.  So some things that shouldnt take long to die will take forever, as the usual result seems to be too much HP right now instead of not enough.

Let's see... what else....

Sounds, most of those indeed just arent in yet.  You can probably expect the usuall array of explosions and other explosions that you get from Arcen :D

Mines, you can blow those up with missiles.

Backfire boss spawning on you, I could SWEAR I turned that stupid thing off.  I distinctly remember telling it not to spawn right now. 

Brick enemy being weird, that enemy wasnt supposed to be spawning in the first place, it's not finished, so it's all glitchy and weird.  I hadnt realized it was spawning like that but it should be fixed up when .137 comes out.

Shields simply regenerate whenever you switch rooms.

Bosses being disconnected from their environments:  This one, honestly, I think isnt going to change all that much.  ALOT of games of this type have this sort of issue, since when the bosses for a stage are chosen randomly, you cant really tailor the level to them very much.  Isaac being a good example;  Monstro is still Monstro no matter where you encounter him.  It doesnt make a whole lot of sense for him to be hopping around inside of a cathedral, but he'll still be there anyway, making a jerk of himself.  And so it goes with many games like this, in that enemies and bosses can seem a little disjointed.

As for consumable item effects not doing enough (I agree) that's another thing you should write up onto Mantis; I'll probably add my own comments to it afterwards. 



Now outside of that, any specific feedback on the enemies/bosses or whatever?  Like, are any of them too annoying, or too stupid, or does any of them seem broken somehow or cheap or anything like that?

nas1m:
As requested (and threatened) I added a couple of issues to Mantis:
Gameplay Issues
Confusing Stuff
Graphics Feedback
Backfire
Brick
Richochet

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