Arcen Games
General Category => Stars Beyond Reach... This World Is Mine => Topic started by: x4000 on June 05, 2014, 10:23:40 pm
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I've been thinking about the races for this game, and I've decided to do a compilation of all the races from AI War and TLF, plus some from our other games as well (Skelebots and Espers from AVWW). I also want to do the Chelonians as a new race that is only in this game (they were originally going to be in TLF until the Hydrals replaced them), and something along the lines of a spectral menace could also be there to double down on the meaning.
This is the current list, feel free to add other suggestions if you like:
Some Sort Of Ghosts (New here)
Andors (TLF)
Acutians (TLF)
Boarines (TLF)
Burlusts (TLF)
Evucks (TLF)
Peltians (TLF)
Skylaxians (TLF)
Thoraxians (TLF)
Spire (AI War)
Zenith (AI War)
Neinzul (AI War)
Chelonians (Originally in Starport 28, now unique to this game)
Espers (Valley 2)
Obscura (TLF - Expansion 1)
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As a clarification -- I felt like going this route was the most intuitive thing, on reflection, because then players no only get more cool backstory and tie-ins with our existing franchises, but also for fans of our work it makes for less learning. You know something about the Burlusts as soon as you meet them in the new game if you have previously played TLF, for instance.
This will all be kind of an offshoot of the other universes, so it won't be canon in those other areas, though all of this could logically exist in the same universe, just different solar systems or galaxies. Incidentally, AI War and Valley 1 and 2 are already tied together in that way. Actually, frankly Valley 1 and 2 are tied together that way; they are very different parts of a much larger screwed up world. But the Skelebot future has all sorts of AI War references, and is kind of a planet that was left behind in the civil wars of AI War's backstory.
TLF, on the other hand, is just some other solar system somewhere out there away from what is going on with AI War. It's not alternate history or whatever, it's just not the same place -- the galaxy itself is freaking huge.
So what we're seeing here in this new 4x is a planet where some offshoots of these various races are unexpectedly thrown together. I'd be curious if there are other fan favorite suggestions for the races. Eagles, maybe? ;)
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You should totally have a race of the little guys from Tidalis.
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As a clarification -- I felt like going this route was the most intuitive thing, on reflection, because then players not only get more cool backstory and tie-ins with our existing franchises,
More lore is pretty awesome! :D
but also for fans of our work it makes for less learning. You know something about the Burlusts as soon as you meet them in the new game if you have previously played TLF, for instance.
And a bonus comes out of it too, which is win-win for you guys.
Aside from being picky on the skelebots (weren't they vaguely retconned from Valley2 after the rename to Robotic Research Center instead?) and bringing murdoch up somewhere because why not, I don't have any race in particular to suggest.
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Boarines are a yes from me. Because come on, space pigs.
Having the Hydrals at least mentioned would be a plus. Whether or not they're actually around I don't know, but I kind of feel that if they were it makes the game feel like it takes place before TLF and I'd feel better if it takes place after. The TLF races grew up and expanded beyond their home system.
Zenith and Spire? Could totally see it. In fact, that would be a plus, as the Spire has wicked awesome crystaline tech that no one else knows how to really utilize and the Zenith have their "so what if it's big? we only need one..." (and have some kind of racial bonus towards building things really really big in reasonable times, but can't make anything small).
No strong opinions on the rest.
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Whoa whoa whoa...so we will be able to play the Zenith Remnant and subjugate those filthy spirelings?
I'LL HAVE A HUNDRED COPIES, PLEASE.
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True, I'm not the biggest fan of the Skelebots. I've taken them out. Having a race of ghosts, as mentioned in another thread, would be really fun and interesting. Could be a super different way to play the game, we'll see. That might have to be expansion material, or an NPC race, not sure.
Having the Hydrals or not is something that did bug me a lot. On the one hand I did want to show them, on the other hand that race is, well, special. And I agree this should be taking place long after TLF. But actually probably before AI War by several eons. Interesting timeline we're building up here.
The guys from Tidalis would definitely be fun, but they don't really have names or a consistent style of being, and are quite cartoony. I thought a lot about ways to tie that in but couldn't think of anything.
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I'm also taking out humans, because if the timeline is TLF -> This Game -> AI War, as makes sense, then humans would not exist yet.
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True, I'm not the biggest fan of the Skelebots. I've taken them out.
Oh my, I have been looking forward to them :-\.
For some wonky reason I like them :).
But on the other hand their aesthetics are fairly similar to the Andors, so there's that...
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I'm also taking out humans, because if the timeline is TLF -> This Game -> AI War, as makes sense, then humans would not exist yet.
I am ok with this. Humans as a race in a space 4X is just kind of "eh."
They end up being the race to which every other race is compared. On the other hand, they can be used to compare every other race during balancing.
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I'm also taking out humans, because if the timeline is TLF -> This Game -> AI War, as makes sense, then humans would not exist yet.
I am ok with this. Humans as a race in a space 4X is just kind of "eh."
They end up being the race to which every other race is compared. On the other hand, they can be used to compare every other race during balancing.
Yep on both counts. They are also anatomically hard to draw in a pleasing fashion. Personally the animated ones in Civ actually bug me.
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If there's a race of ghosts, how do you kill them? Is there going to be a competing race of ghostbusters? Maybe another race feeds on the ghosts, or maybe the ghosts are captured and used as a source of energy for the galaxy.
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Hydral Ghosts
Isn't it plausible that a race of superpowered psychic space monsters could continue to exist on a spectal plane after their planets destruction? :P Or is it bad to have Hydrals be the key race in two different games?
Obscura will be part of your game lore by then too ;D edit: (oh, i see it there now)
Also, what about the Greys (call it Greys Horde?) from Shattered Haven? Maybe it does not make the most logical sense, but you can at least pull in more lore. You have so many unique sounding races, having one with normal english words adds just as much variety.
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If there's a race of ghosts, how do you kill them? Is there going to be a competing race of ghostbusters? Maybe another race feeds on the ghosts, or maybe the ghosts are captured and used as a source of energy for the galaxy.
I like the 'capture and use' ghost annihilation idea. Being ghosts I don't suppose they'd be building much themselves, but they could haunt/infiltrate/take over other races buildings or ruins. Could they be nomadic? That would put them well apart from most strategy races. As far as crash landing goes, they could have sneaked on board some other races ship and wiped out the other crew members.
For tying the game into TLF, how about making it a Hydral prison planet, far away from the TLF system (the cutting edge of Hydral space tech could have got quite sophisticated before they were destroyed). That could make non-TLF races a pain to justify though.
And lastly: Some kind of sentient plant race, literally growing across the map?
Also, what about the Greys (call it Greys Horde?) from Shattered Haven? Maybe it does not make the most logical sense, but you can at least pull in more lore. You have so many unique sounding races, having one with normal english words adds just as much variety.
Weren't the Greys like infected humans? (Haven't played SH for ages, meaning to go back). There could be a race which spreads by converting bits of other races (with the same source as SH).
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True, I'm not the biggest fan of the Skelebots. I've taken them out. Having a race of ghosts, as mentioned in another thread, would be really fun and interesting. Could be a super different way to play the game, we'll see. That might have to be expansion material, or an NPC race, not sure.
The guys from Tidalis would definitely be fun, but they don't really have names or a consistent style of being, and are quite cartoony. I thought a lot about ways to tie that in but couldn't think of anything.
Just for the sake of argument: Skelebots can be like barbarians from Civ, these fairly weak and pesky things that form small collectives that end up just getting absorbed as the game progresses. Something to knock over, or in some mods, something that could be a real menace if they got roots in your territory, because then they could form a new civilization.
I remember there was this Star Trek: Deep Space Nine game (a plot-driven TPS) where the starting enemies were these robots that were like a primitive Borg. They weren't particularly intelligent, and were 100% cybernetic, but got along through a combination of piracy and scavenging. They would attack ships and use the raw materials to build more of themselves. That's basically all they did.
The Tidalians, maybe they'd be like the Zot-Fot-Pik, or better yet, the Orz, from Star Control II. The latter were kind of weird, silly, interdimensional beings, but later you find out that they completely annihilated another competing race for poking their nose too far in their dimension.
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Probably the Zot-Fok-Pik would fit better, unless the Tidalians have some sort of cryptic background of potential doom.
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For something unorthodox, I think a slime mold race would be cool. Or amoebas, although Endless Space did that one already.
Sophocos
Sapient slime mold / fungi with a collective intelligence. Tool use has historically been one of their biggest challenges.
- Rapid reproduction and increased population growth.
- Their diminished energy requirements and ability to metabolize most things reduces their food requirements.
- Diminished industrial production. Fortunately, the effect on their research is counteracted by the benefits of their networked intelligence.
Etymology: Sophia (wisdom) + mycos (fungi).
Or maybe even... kudzu! Yeah, do a sapient kudzu race. That would be awesome.
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There's a book called "Interstellar Pig" that had a sentient slime as a race.
Also the 'pig' was sentient, but had a problem making friends, so it created the idea of the titular game...
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Could we have the robots from Bionic Dues or the AI from AI War as a playable faction? I think the Grays from Shattered Haven would be really cool to play as too. I can't think of many other games that let you play as the hordes of zombies/undead, and most treat them the same as any other faction.
P.S. While we are on the topic of crossovers, is Bionic Dues set during AVVW's Modern Era (Pre-Apocalypse), a prequel to AI War, both, or am I completely wrong about the whole thing.
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Could we have the robots from Bionic Dues or the AI from AI War as a playable faction?
If we assume:
I'm also taking out humans, because if the timeline is TLF -> This Game -> AI War, as makes sense, then humans would not exist yet.
Then the AI is also as-of-yet non-existent.
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I like the idea of Ghosts In Space. Maybe they're ruins / derelict spaceships that have embedded psi receivers, and with the psi energy of nearby sentient minds they can create and maintain nearly invisible, autonomous, highly damage resistant "bodies" of gas and dust bound together by some sort of energy field, even forming them into spaceships. Very difficult to kill directly since their ships and troops are non-corporeal, but the psi receivers are vulnerable, and they will go dormant if there aren't any other races around for them to get psi energy from. Since their stuff is scattered around, the other races' expansion will invariably expand the Ghosts In Space.
Sounds like there's a lot of backstory potential there (who built the first psi receivers and why were they abandoned?), and I like the idea of the Ghosts being a playable race with a totally different playstyle.
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I like the idea of Ghosts In Space. Maybe they're ruins / derelict spaceships that have embedded psi receivers, and with the psi energy of nearby sentient minds they can create and maintain nearly invisible, autonomous, highly damage resistant "bodies" of gas and dust bound together by some sort of energy field, even forming them into spaceships. Very difficult to kill directly since their ships and troops are non-corporeal, but the psi receivers are vulnerable, and they will go dormant if there aren't any other races around for them to get psi energy from. Since their stuff is scattered around, the other races' expansion will invariably expand the Ghosts In Space.
Sounds like there's a lot of backstory potential there (who built the first psi receivers and why were they abandoned?), and I like the idea of the Ghosts being a playable race with a totally different playstyle.
I think they have said the game is "terrestrial", i.e. not in space, but on a planet's surface.
but I like the general ideas.
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I think they have said the game is "terrestrial", i.e. not in space, but on a planet's surface.
but I like the general ideas.
Apparently I missed that post. Even so, they'd be Ghosts in Space in the sense that they function through science instead of magic.
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I'm also taking out humans, because if the timeline is TLF -> This Game -> AI War, as makes sense, then humans would not exist yet.
So no greeks or nords?
What about the Creator(s)? ;-) You do like asymmetry in your game design. . .
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Given virtually no technology constraints (recall that tLF has time travel), then cloning or just genetically re-engineering the Hydrals back into existence is very plausible. A larger question might be where did the tLF races come from? They certainly didn't reasonably evolve on the planets in tLF. Therefore, they most logically were imported (possibly by the Hydrals, although it would be more plausible that the entire system was constructed by an unknown race) as an experimental plot. That is to say, the entire system is just an experiment. This also would explain why none of them developed any FTL or pseudo-FTL travel and get the heck out of dodge (who wants to be neighbors with these crazy sun exploding guys? Or these warmongers? Or this race who will drop an entire planet's worth of toxic waste on your planet for $? Or this race that won't negotiate and just does what they feel like?). Given this, and the ability to abscond with a population, wipe their tech basis and drop them on a new planet, you can do anything you want with the time lines.
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i was going to ask how many races are in the game, then i thought, well... what if 'all' the races are in the game, even the tidalis and the shattered haven, the valley games, bionic dues, skyward collapse, tlf and ai war. so that the player could have two races in game if they like, or all of them, resulting in like 28 or so? :) which would be way hectic and crazy and hard as heck to win, but probably if the player put 'em in they want that craziness :)
So yeah, that is my suggestion, don't limit yourself, just because you feel the 'history' has to flow a certain way. If you have check to add races for the 4x, then it seems to me, a win - win for everyone! :)
-Teal
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I like the idea of Ghosts In Space. Maybe they're ruins / derelict spaceships that have embedded psi receivers, and with the psi energy of nearby sentient minds they can create and maintain nearly invisible, autonomous, highly damage resistant "bodies" of gas and dust bound together by some sort of energy field, even forming them into spaceships. Very difficult to kill directly since their ships and troops are non-corporeal, but the psi receivers are vulnerable, and they will go dormant if there aren't any other races around for them to get psi energy from. Since their stuff is scattered around, the other races' expansion will invariably expand the Ghosts In Space.
Sounds like there's a lot of backstory potential there (who built the first psi receivers and why were they abandoned?), and I like the idea of the Ghosts being a playable race with a totally different playstyle.
this souinds wonderfully fun! :)
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I'm also taking out humans, because if the timeline is TLF -> This Game -> AI War, as makes sense, then humans would not exist yet.
So no greeks or nords?
What about the Creator(s)? ;-) You do like asymmetry in your game design. . .
if you use a
tidalis --> shattered haven --> skyward collapse --> valley 1 & 2 --> bionic dues --> tlf --> air war --> spectral empire timeline
then, actually i believe we could have any and all of the races, including human (several versions of humans from the different games), including the greeks and the nords and the demi-gods and the creator, and the grays and humans (call them SH humans) among the AIWar Humans, and the Valley Humans. You could even, if you wanted, keep the same animations and character sprites from all the older games and put them into the new game ( to save money and because the fans would love it anyway). :)
just put check off boxes in the setup area to add them to a game. From 2 to 54? (i can't remember how many characters there are across all the games, probably a lot.) :)
of course if you wanted you could create new character sprites, in a new style, where all the sprites sort of have a uniform or similar look to them, if that is what you prefer instead. but if you do re-use the older sprites, then its almost like a nostalgic send back, you know?
for 'serious' games the old sprites don't have to be used where everything is like super intense (use the new uniform look style for the new game for those games instead) ...
but then if you wanted you could add the tidalis and grays and the SH humans (who are kind of cartoony, but who cares?) for a free for all, pull out all the stops! i am doing all of this now! game of hectic and hardcore and lore-laden Arcen 4x Mayhem!!! :)
-teal
p.s. of course if you used all 54 races in a super-maxed out total blow my mind game, then you would have to have randomly generated maps to accommodate all of the races. :) but hey, i'm not complaining, i'm just trying to convince everyone this is the way to go! :)
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Actually... why are all these different people stranded on the same planet, anyway? Is this more of the TLF Zookeeper's shenanigans, or did reality implode AVWW-style?
Or are both acts... the work of the same hand?
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but then if you wanted you could add the tidalis and grays and the SH humans (who are kind of cartoony, but who cares?) for a free for all, pull out all the stops! i am doing all of this now! game of hectic and hardcore and lore-laden Arcen 4x Mayhem!!! :)
Super Smash Bros. Arcen Style
The world's greatest party 4x
The 4x sounds like it's at normal seriosity levels, but I'd like to see what would happen if Arcen decided to go completely ridiculous.
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Oooh, we get to make suggestions? And yay for skelebo- Oh crap they got removed? Awww...
Skelebots and draconians are my favourite A Valley Without Wind playable characters(which made A Valley Without Wind 2 kinda disappointing for me since it removed those two time periods) D: Which is impressive since i never actually unlocked draconians(*coughcoughIsuckinavwwcoughcough*) so I don't have idea are they cool ones or lame ones like ones in Age of Wonders 3 :P Yeah, they are by nature of being not human like(assuming, I haven't seen draconians <-< I really have to get on with trying to unlock them) my favourites. Humans are "normal" hence boring in my opinion, so any race that doesn't look like human(assuming they don't look too silly or stupid) is automatically more interesting to play as than them. Only thing that is cooler than non human like playable characters is masks, but apparently I'm only mask enthusiast since faceless helmets are apparently unheroic or something.
And speaking about that weird tangent, yay for humans not being playable! Since in 99.99% of all games you play as humans! Which gets boring, games can be fantastical so why there aren't more games where you don't play as humans?! Like all RPG race choices are basically just humans but with sharp ears or small stature, etc, but you can never play as lizardman or humanoid insect or anything. Yeah, I'm ranting here, I don't really MIND playing as humans, duh, its just that for some reason only genre that consistently allows that is strategy games. And platformers, but thats because most of platformers go for cartoonish style and that style allows for much more variety than just cartoony humans. Its kinda weird, strategy games and fps and what ever don't actually need the playable character to be human, yet strategy games without an option to play as humans are incredibly rare(I guess they are really easy and cheap race to design though :P Since they are usually the "basic" race) and in action games does it really matter what the playable character is? In rpgs I can understand that non humanlike playable characters might require writing to incorporate xenofiction elements into it, but the games where plot doesn't matter much? Yeah, they are still rare. I guess non human playable characters don't allow for escapism or hero fantasies or something?*shrugs* Eh, pity that xeno fiction is unpopular genre.
So uh, besides my weird sidetracks... If not skelebots, can we draconians or some other reptile race?(That preferably actually has reptile face structure and not scaly human face with nose and all that other mammal stuff that reptiles lack. Stupid Age of Wonders 3 draconians) Or more insect races. Or reptile/insect hybrids/chimeras/combination. Huh, I was making just "Bread, eggs, breaded eggs" joke, but now that I think of it... In scifi/fantasy, there sometimes are mammals that look like reptiles, reptiles that look like mammals, birds that look like reptiles, etc, but there aren't insects that look like mammals, birds that look like insects or etc. I guess its just unintuitive to imagine insects combined with other type of animals huh. Its not really hard though, its just about mixing animal traits together and being weirded out by results.
(But yeah, current list is already cool even though no lizards in it, since all of those aliens from arcen games are already nothing like humans), but hey, this IS suggestion thread)
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+1 for lizard race
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My vote is for evil snowmen.
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I don't think there is ANY races on the list currently that can be a sorta Hive Mind.
Thoraxians comes close I will grant with the Hive queen however individual aren't linked.
So I suggest a MorningLightMountain (actual name not a mistypo) Alien in here which can mental communicate with their lowly soldier etc... Even the Hydra can't really touch on how evil those aliens can be (3k nuclear warhead detonating in a solar-wide skirmish over first contact in 37 min span). For those who are not familiar with this type of Alien, I am referring to commonwealth saga by Peter Hamilton.
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I don't think there is ANY races on the list currently that can be a sorta Hive Mind.
Thoraxians comes close I will grant with the Hive queen however individual aren't linked.
So I suggest a MorningLightMountain (actual name not a mistypo) Alien in here which can mental communicate with their lowly soldier etc... Even the Hydra can't really touch on how evil those aliens can be (3k nuclear warhead detonating in a solar-wide skirmish over first contact in 37 min span). For those who are not familiar with this type of Alien, I am referring to commonwealth saga by Peter Hamilton.
Umm, apparently Thoraxians ARE a hive mind <_< The text for assassinating the queen has them being horrified for killing their "mind" and they go bonkers when the queen is killed until new one is born.
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Umm, apparently Thoraxians ARE a hive mind <_< The text for assassinating the queen has them being horrified for killing their "mind" and they go bonkers when the queen is killed until new one is born.
Even if that were true. MorningLightMountain (MLM for short) takes it to a whole another level (Hive mind that is).
One major difference between Thoraxians and MLM is that when individual dies their memories are lost in Thoraxians due to killing queen. When you kill the individual MLM "brain" you don't even scratch it. Because the brain's conscience, if you will, and memories are shared across hundred of thousand individual brains. At worst all you did was reduce their total thinking capacity and reproduction rate temporarily.
To kill MLM for real you would have to commit nothing less than total genocide to stop them.
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My first thought on seeing the original post was excitement at getting to play as AI 1 (or at least as AI 2 :) ). Would be sad if we can't.