Author Topic: Controls  (Read 3786 times)

Offline FroBodine

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Controls
« on: March 08, 2013, 09:20:31 PM »
I'm trying to decide what controls I like the best.  Straight keyboard is ok, but my hand gets tired after a short while, and I tend to keep getting stuck on corners of obstacles.  You have to find the exact middle when walking between things. 

Mouse movement is decent, but I don't feel like I have as much fine control and quick reactions that I have with keyboard.  I haven't tried the gamepad yet.  Is this a good way to play?

I'm interested in what others prefer, and what setups you're using.

Offline x4000

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Re: Controls
« Reply #1 on: March 08, 2013, 09:23:05 PM »
In terms of sliding around objects, that's on my list of tweaks to add. :)
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Offline Aklyon

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Re: Controls
« Reply #2 on: March 08, 2013, 09:47:11 PM »
Well, I shifted things around slightly to fit my lefthanded play (well I was using my right hand but its on the left of the keyboard and my left was busy with the mouse), thoguh I'm not entirely sure it was a great way to set it up yet (Shift action key over to R, Q/E for items, add wasd as alternate movement controls and then ignore it a few minutes later and go back to mouse control >.>)

I too also haven't tried gamepad controls though.

Offline Professor Paul1290

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Re: Controls
« Reply #3 on: March 08, 2013, 09:54:52 PM »
If your using arrow keys or keyboard for movement don't forget the "walk" key. Seriously, there a lot of narrow spots where that can really save your bacon.  :P

Offline madcow

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Re: Controls
« Reply #4 on: March 08, 2013, 09:58:14 PM »
My own thoughts on controls is well - not pretty but has to be said. Character movement is fine, inventory on the other hand.

I realize the two active item load out is a throwback to Zelda. But just from the few levels I've played, it's rather a nuisance to have to juggle your active inventory, and I cannot see a gameplay reason that's it like this - except for limiting the game buttons, opening inventory seemed to pause the game as far as I can tell, so no draw back there. I can only imagine how bad the juggling can get later on.

I'm sure changes to that are off the table, but inventory juggling is the worst in games. If I'm finding it an annoyance, I can bet others will too.

Offline x4000

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Re: Controls
« Reply #5 on: March 08, 2013, 10:46:12 PM »
It used to be that there were four active inventory buttons. The result? Unplayable for most people who tried it. So it was shifted to something with one active item and you could cycle through items quickly based on other buttons. The result? Incredibly annoying and fiddly. The new system was implemented last September or so, and it's worked out the best by far.

Bear in mind with something like valley 1, there were 10 slots but you changed what was in which slot pretty rarely. Here items are coming and going pretty rapidly, making that not really the most feasible. One key thing that was found in older versions of this game was that if the game didn't pause during inventory management, players would get killed unless there was a safe zone to retreat to.

Or if you go waaay back to 2008, this controlled more like Lode Runner The Legend Returns, where you had two slots period (or one at one point), and you had to use your items before picking up new ones. That was simple, but annoying, and made for lots of backtracking. At one point items didn't even stack!

And there were other iterations, too.

All in all, I'm extremely happy with how this is working out at the moment, and goodness knows we've been through tons of iterations. I don't expect everyone to love it, but Zelda does do I this way for a reason. This isn't something I'm particularly keen to revisit, nor do I think it really needs it. I suppose if we wanted to try the current system but with 3 or 4 active item slots rather than 2, that wouldn't be the worst thing. Those who don't want to use the extra buttons can just skip them. But that's more the level of change I'd be open to; a refinement rather than a whole sale course correction.
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Offline Aklyon

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Re: Controls
« Reply #6 on: March 08, 2013, 10:55:27 PM »
Technically Zelda goes up to 3 items + sword, but if you're only talking about the handheld games... ;)
« Last Edit: March 08, 2013, 10:57:04 PM by Aklyon »

Offline madcow

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Re: Controls
« Reply #7 on: March 08, 2013, 11:02:09 PM »
Technically Zelda goes up to 3 items + sword, but if you're only talking about the handheld games... ;)

And not if you're talking about Link's Awakening ;)  (the only handheld zelda I played)

On topic, I find it fiddly switching between 4 items, but I'll deal. I find inventory juggling in games to be in general unfun. It's an issue probably because there's no good answer to it. AVWW's inventory was fairly bad as well, I think I only actually used the first few spell slots in it anyways.

Offline mrhanman

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Re: Controls
« Reply #8 on: March 08, 2013, 11:03:24 PM »
I think the controls work great the way they are, but I wouldn't mind having 1 or 2 more active slots.  Excessive inventory switching hasn't been much of a problem for me so far, but I can see how it could wear one down.

The only control refinement I would like would be to enlarge the analog stick deadzone.  Even at the highest setting, the character goes running off to the left a lot.  In Xpadder, for example, the -X axis will sometimes come to rest as much as 32% off center.  I'm using the control pad for now, but the 360's pad is pretty awful and makes my thumb sore after a while.  A very minor problem, certainly.

If nothing else, I'll just use Xpadder to take care of it.  ;D

Offline Teal_Blue

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Re: Controls
« Reply #9 on: March 08, 2013, 11:56:53 PM »
i also wouldn't mind 1 or 2 more slots, i have only used 1 or 2 items at a time, but one time i was carrying health jewels, and picked up a bear trap and was going for the tacks. I did have to change out the bear trap to get to the tacks, but to be honest, it really wasn't that big a deal. It is pretty workable as is, but if you do add 2 more slots, it might be cool.
Thank you,

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Offline x4000

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Re: Controls
« Reply #10 on: March 09, 2013, 08:19:02 AM »
New version with 4 active inventory slots and improved deadzones: http://arcengames.com/mediawiki/index.php?title=Shattered_Haven_-_Beta_Release_Notes#Beta_.802

Enjoy!
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Offline mrhanman

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Re: Controls
« Reply #11 on: March 09, 2013, 09:31:56 AM »
Awesome! I can use the control stick again!

I think the inventory is perfect now.  The extra slots are a really nice refinement.

Thanks!

Here are the controls I'm using with my 360 pad, if anyone is interested.



Also, any chance we can get 360 icons in game instead of "GP3", etc.?
« Last Edit: March 09, 2013, 10:01:54 AM by mrhanman »

Offline Penumbra

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Re: Controls
« Reply #12 on: March 09, 2013, 10:01:56 AM »
Having the two buttons is great! I am now much less likely to waste my consumables!

I have been trying to write a suggestion about "preserving" your inventory between levels. But, I can't figure it out!

Picking up a brand new item in a puzzle and always having it go to the first slot breaks the "muscle memory."  I have no idea what would work better, though!  ;)

Just remembering where items were previously breaks many more things, I don't know.... This is pretty minor though, I think.

Offline Aklyon

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Re: Controls
« Reply #13 on: March 09, 2013, 11:38:21 AM »
We could get 360 icons, but not everyone has a 360 controller.
For example, I have everything but a 360 controller. (logitech controller, ps3 controller, ps2/gcn-to-usb adapter, keyboard, laptop keyboard, mouse with finicky middle mouse click)

Offline x4000

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Re: Controls
« Reply #14 on: March 09, 2013, 11:50:58 AM »
Glad that works! As for the 360 icons, that's not something we could technically support anyhow. It should be showing Xbox A and so forth with that kind of controller connected, though.
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