Net Neutrality

[Misery]

I find it predictable and amusing that some people in the gaming community allegedly don't like politics but are instantly passionate about anyone affecting their Internet.

"People living and dying over healthcare, the environment, who gives a crap? But goddamnit, we need our Netflix!"

Depressing.

I'm aware he isnt reading a bloody thing I say, but I can imagine certain potential responses to this from various people, so from a moderator point of view here I'm just going to say to everyone:  PLEASE don't bring politics further into this. 

I realize that there's a political aspect to this issue, but at the very least let's keep this strictly on the neutrality topic itself.  It is at least the thing least likely to cause another blazing argument.  Let's just not stray into other political topics of any sort.

Maybe I'm being paranoid, but I just wanted to say that.  I really, really don't want a repeat of last time.

[x4000]

I and my wife have also been involved in a variety of political things, increasingly recently.  However, I don't speak about that sort of thing here, because I expect for this forum to mostly be a respite from that.  Generally that seems to be the mood of everyone here.

I know for a fact that there are people on the forums, and even on the staff, who have political opinions that differ from mine -- either slightly, or largely.  Very little would be accomplished by debate or accusations, however; people rarely change their minds on either side, and that's just human nature.

Net neutrality is the sort of political argument that IS useful for this forum, though, because likely most of us are on a similar footing -- similar enough that argument or discussion might actually yield some useful result.  Someone changing their opinion slightly, or at least refining their opinion, when discussing a topic with their peers, is definitely a lot more likely.  And a lot less stressful.

Incidentally, I don't discuss politics with my direct neighbors, either.  As the saying goes, "don't sh*t where you eat."   I do engage in political discourse, as I'm sure many others here do, but isn't it preferable to have a haven from that in a few places?

[Misery]

but isn't it preferable to have a haven from that in a few places?

Yeah, definitely agreeing on that one.

So far, this is the ONLY forum I go to where I get to avoid that stuff, and the inevitable arguments that always go with it.  Even the freaking Steam forums, which are supposed to be about individual games, sometimes randomly devolve into political arguments.   I've never quite figured out just how/why.

In all honesty this place has been a bit of a haven in relation to a whole bunch of different things.   A general lack of trolls, for instance, that's a good one.  I cant avoid THAT anywhere else, either.

I cant imagine just what sort of dark rituals must have been involved in the creation of this site to actually manage to prevent trolls from appearing.

[x4000]

Yeah, I'm not sure how that happened either, but knock on wood so far so good.

[Cyborg]

"People living and dying over healthcare, the environment, who gives a crap? But goddamnit, we need our Netflix!"

You're assuming I haven't also been calling my representatives about healthcare.
(I just don't talk about it on the internet)

I thought my statement was generic enough. I didn't put your name on it. Although I'm sure there are people here to whom it applies. I make no apologies for it but neither will I get specific. It will just turn into the other thread, to which there's no need because we already had that thread.

I was actually watching "Chasing Coral" tonight. One of the lessons you get from it, people care about what's at their door. Interestingly, about net neutrality, people care about what it's going to do to *their* online experience. There is very little thought or emotional involvement into the scholastic impact, economic development, or cultural consequences of what it means to have corporations exert such control over our ability to communicate and what is essentially our hivemind. Instead, when people see "net neutrality," there's that reflex reaction of what it's going to do to *them.*

So, staying on topic, it's actually the same character trait as the other post.

[x4000]

Indeed, there's quite a lot there I can agree with.

[Draco18s]

I thought my statement was generic enough. I didn't put your name on it. Although I'm sure there are people here to whom it applies. I make no apologies for it but neither will I get specific. It will just turn into the other thread, to which there's no need because we already had that thread.

No I recognize you weren't addressing me specifically, but my comment could have come from anyone.
Here is on the internet.
Politics involving the internet are relevant to here because of that.
Other topics, less so.

[TheVampire100]

I find it predictable and amusing that some people in the gaming community allegedly don't like politics but are instantly passionate about anyone affecting their Internet.

"People living and dying over healthcare, the environment, who gives a crap? But goddamnit, we need our Netflix!"

Depressing.

I wasn't interested into this discussion but then I read they are taking away Netflix. Goddammit, I need my Netflix!

Jokes aside, I'm curious how in any way would this affect me considering I'm living in Germany. As it sounds, this is something decided by US law in the US and has something to do with the US internet providers. Sooooo... basically it couldn't affect me, right?
Or am I wrong on this part? Or might it change the way, that hosted sites work (in other countries as well) that these sites hosted on US servers can get blocked in other countries or getting slowed down?

Also, I love Netflix.

[Aklyon]

The us isp have to connect to somewhere to get to you in germany, if the site you're accessing is in the us. It'll affect you in the end if things like this don't do so first and muck with the connection on your end.

[Draco18s]

The us isp have to connect to somewhere to get to you in germany, if the site you're accessing is in the us. It'll affect you in the end if things like this don't do so first and muck with the connection on your end.

...or if it routes through the US (which it can and probably will: for me, I've done some traceroutes where it bounced through the midUS before taking a jump out to Ireland before landing in Silicon Valley).

[Cyborg]

I thought my statement was generic enough. I didn't put your name on it. Although I'm sure there are people here to whom it applies. I make no apologies for it but neither will I get specific. It will just turn into the other thread, to which there's no need because we already had that thread.

No I recognize you weren't addressing me specifically, but my comment could have come from anyone.
Here is on the internet.
Politics involving the internet are relevant to here because of that.
Other topics, less so.

 
This is the off-topic forum.

I think the honest way of saying it is that, net neutrality political discussion is okay because it won't be controversial. We will all be on the same side, so nobody is going to be asking for a moderator.

Back on topic, let's look at other countries where net neutrality at the corporate level is actually the same as at the political level. A country like China has government-sponsored entities that control online communication.
The way we want to do it, is have corporate sponsored entities- politicians, our Supreme Court, and lobbying companies fall under that category- control online communication.

How do we fix it? By voting. I did a quick Google, 126 million people voted in the US. 190 million people use Facebook in the US. Draw your own conclusions, but here's mine:

Basically, unless governance is able to tap into the inherent narcissism of the average American digital citizen, we are likely to see the complete sale of the Internet to corporate America. Bought and sold.

How do you "Like" that?  Hey, but at least we can know what our neighbor's dog looks like!

[Misery]

Let's NOT get back into that voting argument.  I mean it.

It wont end well, it never does, so I'm going to encourage everyone to just... not go there, despite his comments.

I *will* lock this topic if this even so much as looks like it might go bad again.  And a comment like that one is already pushing it.


Ugh, I hate having to say stuff like that.  I'm really glad that this forum overall is generally as peaceful as it is.

[WolfWhiteFire]

Actually Misery, I don't think he can even see a single post you have made, I am pretty sure that during that Trump discussion that started up a while back and that you eventually locked he said that he blocked you, and then there was a discussion a bit later where it was mentioned and he said it should be unlocked even though it devolved into a flamefest like I predicted closer to the beginning. So the reason he is ignoring what you are saying is because he isn't seeing what you are saying.

[TheVampire100]

That's exactly what he does, he is kinda bipolar on this front. On one side he wants his "fellow Americans" to wake up and participate on voting to keep something like Trump out (because that would've worked, right? Yeah, no, not really...).
On the other side he does not want to see other opinions that aren't his own, so pretty much he himself closes his eyes for that kidn of thing.

Because of this reason alone I cannot take anything he ever says seriously.

Besides that, voting on that topic is like... useless. If not this politician woudl do it, another woudl do it. The whole lovably political/voting system is so old fasioned and out to daze that I wonder why no one stands up and says what has to be said. This system isn't functional with the new era anymore. And how can people int he slightest believe it would?
Most stuff was designed back when new technology, new social ideas and other new stuff wasn't even developed. Humanity has "evolved" farther, political systems not.
No, don't ask me how we shoudl change it because I have no goddamn clue but THSI is not how it should be, that's clear. There is a reason why more and more people loose interest in it and it's not beause Facebook is more interesting. It's simpl because the political system does not work in their interest anymore.

[Misery]

Yeah, I know he cant read anything I say here.  My post above was actually mostly directed at everyone else.  Mainly saying, "please don't even start talking about that stuff, even if someone is trying to start it".  Just because I know full well it never ends well.

So, yeah.... please, everyone, just let it drop. The whole topic on voting or whatever.  Let's not go into any other political topics, and no negative comments made towards Cyborg either, please. 

Just trying to keep things civil.  The whole incident last time was just.... silly, is what it was.  There's no reason to have it repeat at all.  I'm sure there's plenty to discuss just on the neutrality topic itself anyway.