Author Topic: Legends of Pegasus  (Read 11708 times)

Offline Mánagarmr

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Re: Legends of Pegasus
« Reply #15 on: July 08, 2012, 03:59:19 pm »
Yeah, I didn't get that either.
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Offline dlcooper

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Re: Legends of Pegasus
« Reply #16 on: July 08, 2012, 04:20:36 pm »
One of the Kalypso people on their forums said they're going to be releasing some gameplay videos before the game comes out.  Looks very interesting though

The problem is those folks, and no offense in general, have no success story with this genre. I'm optimistic, but how likely is it that the folks who produce Tropico know a damn thing about 4x? I'll be waiting for the demo.

Apparently this is their first game....maybe they have some experience.


 ???


What I meant was that as a studio it's their first game but they could employ people who've worked on other games.  Similar to Endless Space.   It's the studio's first game but they have people who've worked on some bigger games in the past.

Offline Mánagarmr

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Re: Legends of Pegasus
« Reply #17 on: July 09, 2012, 05:17:30 am »
Ah, makes more sense.
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Offline eRe4s3r

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Re: Legends of Pegasus
« Reply #18 on: August 10, 2012, 09:14:08 pm »
And the epic story of failed 4x games continues, or to quote Baleur from the Steam Forums (whose opinion on 4x games I can always, 100% share and same applies for LoE)


Quote from: Baleur
This game is in a similar state to what SoTS2 was at release.
Yeah, no joke.
Heck even in SoTS2, even though it had almost no gameplay, at least the sliders and buttons worked properly.
In this, while it HAS some interesting gameplay, the interface simply doesn't work.

I had an absolutely abysmal first impression of this game, even worse than SoTS2 because there at least there was eyecandy to look at in the main menu.
I adore the procedural planets with their slow morph to terraforming or urbanisation. I also adore the music and general feel of the game, the different user interface designs and even sounds depending on the species you play as.
I love the Aliens / H.R. Giger feel some icons and artwork has.
The galaxy really is huge on max size, and there are a good number of planets and solar systems within it.
Feels very Imperium Galactica, feels like i wished Endless Space was like (in terms of zooming down to the solar systems, having proper planetary simulations and ship control).

But by god it is buggy beyond belief.. I can deal with it crashing every 50 turns, because it autosaves every turn. But i can not deal with basic industry-standard control methods NOT WORKING. Why the hell can i not double click on 1 to jump to my control group? Why can i not shift click to make waypoints or DESELECT that pesky colony ship in my group? Why can i not shift to SELECT the ships around my colony ship? I have to bloody manually move it out, then drag select the remaining ships. Jesus christ, this is 2012, not 1991...
No wait, even in Command & Conquer 1 you could shift select units....

Overall i'm very torn. I feel ripped off that i just wasted 40 bucks on this mess. I've bought 10 euro games that are ten times as polished, deep and complex as this game. This is the same overpriced piece of incomplete nonsense that was Sword of The Stars 2. And I'm sure this game will also continue being sold at FULL price without as much as a notice on the store page that it is woefully incomplete.


Why? Why devs? Why do you decieve your customers, your lifeblood?
Why do you treat us like pieces of ???? in the gutter?
We're human beings dammit, we deserve to be treated with some respect after we pay your bloody salaries, don't we?!

--- This is what you both should have done ---
If you (and Sword of The Stars 2, as well) were just HONEST with us, none of this would have happened..
If you would just have been honest and done what other incomplete games do, we would not have had a problem. Sell the game as a pre-beta game. Label it as "pre-release, pay now - play now!"
I would not have a problem, i would gladly have reported all the bugs and helped polish it up for release.

But no, you couldn't do that could you? You had to be like Kerberos Productions. You had to hush-hush the game, not release any footage, and decieve every single one of us.
You could not just be honest and open and say, "here's the game, it is not complete, it is not polished, but we really need your support to finish it. if you buy it now, you get the beta version until it's polished enough for release".

SO many games do that, and it works great in every case. Why did you opt for the ???????? option?
Jerks. If you would have been honest about it, i would have bought it anyway, and happily supported it until it was polished. But if you decieve us don't expect any support, you literally stole my money. I paid for a full finished game, that is what you advertised it as.
Give me my money back.

Here is my list of immediate problems.


1. You can not double-press control groups to jump to them.
2. You can not shift or ctrl click to select or deselect units, make waypoints, queue anything, etc.
3. You can not load a campaign game, it will count your click on the load menu as clicking on Skirmish "behind" the menu, and stat a new skirmish game instead of loading your save, lol.
4. The ship design UI works once you learn that you must DRAG and drop stuff onto the main view, nothing in the game tells you this, no buttons or category buttons have any tooltips what so ever.
5. Zooming in the galaxy map is odd, if your mouse is not hovering directly over a start it refuses to zoom in.
6. You can not focus on a selected unit or group unless you directly double click ON the unit, which is impossible if it is moving.
7. You can not skip out of dialogue in the campaign, or the interface elements will 'stick' forever.
8. Jumping out of the planet build screen sometimes warps you halfway across the solar system for no reason.
9. Scrolling the view is RIDICULOUSLY slow, with no way to change it.
10. The mouse pointer itself is slow in an odd way, i think the "enhanced accuracy" setting in windows which adds a tiny bit of acceleration is not working in this game, yet every other game i've played simply uses the mouse speed / whatever that you have set in your OS. Not this one..
11. There are no graphics option. Zero. Set your resolution, that's it.
12. No anti-aliasing in a 2012 game. Again!! What are these developers these days smoking? Anti-aliasing CAN be forced via FXAA in your nvidia control panel, and it is desperately needed. The text ain't blurred too much.
13. There is again NO explanation of certain game systems, colony ships persist after colonizing a planet, one assumes you 'repair' them at a repair dock to refill them. But no such function exists.. Self-destruct tally hooo!
14. Some military ship designs take 1 turn to build, while others with the exact same complexity and modules take 12 turns.
15. You can not zoom while holding the right mouse button to rotate the camera. Complicated to code that i guess?
16. Fleets do not work, at all. You can form a fleet, but it does NOT appear in the galaxy map where you select it, and when you click on the fleet in the solar system view, guess what happens? It does NOT select the ships in the fleet!!! It merely opens the list to show you what ships are in it.
Brilliant genious design choice. Why would i want to select the ships in my fleet by clicking on the fleet?
Don't be preposterous!

17. You can only play against 1 single AI, regardless how huge you make the galaxy.

That say all there is. But I have to admit through not entirely legal means (Did I ever mention a friend of mine knows a friend who for some reason always has all games when they come out ;p) I played this trainwreck too.

First thoughts from me, remember.. not bought it, just played it (And I promise I deleted it again and gave that friend a solid scolding, with cake)

1) The story makes you immediately think someone else should have written it. Someone who read Ender Saga.
2) The story is beyond stupid, and with stupid I don't mean just childish, it is simply executed very very badly.
3) The camera focus and scroll/zoom problem is a game-stopper, on anything but the postcard size, the scroll is terribad.
4) Terrible GUI issues (Sots2 was not this bad on release, that's how bad)
5) This game has no balance. So it can't be imbalanced. It is simply "not balanced and tuned at all" yes, 2% research.... opaque information flow. To this day I still have no idea what the bars on ships even mean. (I can guess but seriously? A tutorial does not mention that!!?)

It has some good things, the graphics are very nice. I love the module and weapon placement system, the procedural planet changes. But that is all.

This is the game we have not been waiting for.

And again. The only hope is Arcengames takes it upon themselves to make a 4x game. Because it seems anyone else simply has absolutely no god damn clue what they are doing. It makes me sick people with no clue get funding for games that are on a simple craftsman level TERRIBLE quality. Features you think are standard don't exist here. And again as Baleur writes, a hush hush policy. And that at 45€

Thank you Kalypso Entertainment .. wow, terrible. Sots 2 was bad, this is worse. 1 AI, Baleur was not kidding. 1 AI enemy is all you get. If you even get that far, the game loves to crash randomly, and even starting a game is twilight zone material, because there is no loading bar... lmao.

And yeah, absolutely 0 graphics options. Doesn't run smooth for you? Sucks to be you! Runs too fast and needs AA? Sucks to be you, unless you force AA, which you should. the Font and GUI is already terrible and FXAA doesn't ruin it any more ;p This is a "could have been" not a "Will be" not a "is" .. this game is not even worth to get on a steam sale for 5$

The judgement is spoken. My verdict for Legends of Pegasus. Fail of the year.

Also if you think I am too harsh, remember.. 45€ that is full price. This is essentially a scam.
« Last Edit: August 10, 2012, 09:21:17 pm by eRe4s3r »
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Offline keith.lamothe

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Re: Legends of Pegasus
« Reply #19 on: August 10, 2012, 09:48:46 pm »
I'm beginning to suspect there's some kind of contest for the fifth X: eXecrable.

Seriously, what is going on?

Endless Space is actually the best one I've seen lately... and that's saying something.  Not bashing ES, but it's not the best thing since sliced bread by a long shot.

Anyway, thanks for letting me know to not get any hopes up for LoP.  I do at least look at any space 4X that comes out, but I wanted some kind of eval/demo before springing for that price tag.
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Offline Wingflier

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Re: Legends of Pegasus
« Reply #20 on: August 10, 2012, 09:55:10 pm »
Lol awesome Keith <3
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Offline eRe4s3r

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Re: Legends of Pegasus
« Reply #21 on: August 10, 2012, 10:11:59 pm »
What's going is people with no clue about making 4x games making 4x games and then wondering why they get bashed for it. If you are only developing games, maybe you didn't have the pleasure of experiencing SOTS2 on launch. Or maybe you never played MOO3 and MOO2 or MOO, Homeworld, fragile allegiance, CIV, Distant Worlds etc. read Ender Saga watched LoGH.. whatever the case, you need a strong background to make a 4x game or else you have no idea what NEVER to do, and what is a great idea that needs expanding and what you absolutely have to deliver in terms of basic controls, feature sets for camera etc, if you don't have that, you won't even GET to 4x (like this game, which has real time combat for some absolutely inane reason that absolutely destroys ANY tactics in combat, like there are literally only 2, attack or run) completely shallow research, broken planet management that seems to literally copy MOO2 and still fails to even get THAT right.

It makes me sad. These developers may have made a great game, but they just had to go and try to make a 4x game with 0 preparing and 0 historical knowledge, with 0 experience and 0 curiosity. And obviously they did not ask me or Baleur for Input on how to do it (even then, with this obvious lack of completeness I wouldn't even be sure there'd be a difference visible...).

For 45€ I just hope nobody buys this. Because any sale for this game is a sale any other better game did not get.

I am actually pretty stumped some developer/Publisher still is stupid enough to pull something like this, after Sots2 and what a PR nightmare that was, only saved so-so by Kerberos who even I have to admit, are still actively pushing Sots2 to completion (still a while away that is ,p) and I know that SOTS2 can still get extremely good at some point, if they actually do some major expansions like SOTS1 had them. I am actually sad to say that LoP even if it were "polished as it is right now" does not even come close to SOTS2 on release. Gameplay wise.
« Last Edit: August 10, 2012, 10:34:04 pm by eRe4s3r »
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Offline chemical_art

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Re: Legends of Pegasus
« Reply #22 on: August 10, 2012, 11:11:19 pm »
Rejoice, it is not all bad!

I am loading up MOO now upon reading this; so there is pleasure to be had!
Life is short. Have fun.

Offline keith.lamothe

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Re: Legends of Pegasus
« Reply #23 on: August 10, 2012, 11:39:13 pm »
Rejoice, it is not all bad!

I am loading up MOO now upon reading this; so there is pleasure to be had!
You're interrupting our moaning and lamentation!

...

MOO ...
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Offline chemical_art

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Re: Legends of Pegasus
« Reply #24 on: August 10, 2012, 11:44:19 pm »
Rejoice, it is not all bad!

I am loading up MOO now upon reading this; so there is pleasure to be had!
You're interrupting our moaning and lamentation!

...

MOO ...

Fine then!


...I also forgot how in Master Of Orion the spy race who should be inferior to you in almost every way can be triple your empire when you first met them as your first neighbor...and have 3/4ths of the galaxy allied to them...and then promptly declare war on you in about 20 turns...on normal difficulty.

[To make it explict: I lost a game of normal difficulty moo on a large map between my first post of moo and this one (~30 minutes). Game is so random and rapid that sometimes you can't stop your defeat. Thankfully, the randomness is the selling point.]
« Last Edit: August 10, 2012, 11:52:42 pm by chemical_art »
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Offline keith.lamothe

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Re: Legends of Pegasus
« Reply #25 on: August 10, 2012, 11:45:54 pm »
I hear barbeque'd Darlock is fantastic

Just bring a fork and a tachyon emitter.
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Offline chemical_art

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Re: Legends of Pegasus
« Reply #26 on: August 11, 2012, 12:19:02 am »
MOO randomness strikes again.

Using the same tactics I'm now the technological / industrial juggernaut holding back the silicon / insect hordes.
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Offline eRe4s3r

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Re: Legends of Pegasus
« Reply #27 on: August 11, 2012, 01:36:40 am »
This is imo one of the many failings of current generation 4x games, they simply take way too damn long to get started at all (depth and complexity does not have to mean slowness or sluggish control or slow turn cycles)..  in 30 minutes you wouldn't even have met an enemy in SOTS2 and you would have crashed twice or more in that time in LoP.

Even MOo3 played smoother. And that was really a hell-hole of complexity in places...
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Offline chemical_art

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Re: Legends of Pegasus
« Reply #28 on: August 11, 2012, 02:12:56 am »
Biggest complaint I have had between MOO 1 and 2 is the pace of the game.

In 2 its like most 4x games where you individually select the buildings you want to build...which is great in allowing flexibility...but greatly slows down the game and hinders fun in its repetitiveness.

In 1...you don't select individual things. You get sliders. You want more ships? Increase sliders. Want more defenses? Increase sliders. Sometimes it kicks your but (wanting to make missiles before upgrading the shield for example) but on the whole it greatly increases the pace of the game both in less time taking turns and less time waiting for the ai to do its thing.


That's the other great thing about MOO. It's fast, but not shallow. If you want to deeply think you can. But after you get into the grove you can do several turns quickly if no great change occurs.
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Offline orzelek

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Re: Legends of Pegasus
« Reply #29 on: August 11, 2012, 06:36:57 am »
I actually preordered LoP... so I will do same as with SOTS2 and wait while they finish it.
And hope they will actually finish it...

With SOTS2 I was able to play a bit at least and here it's a bit difficult with things like ships not wanting to move when ordered. And game not loading or requiring tricks to load...