Author Topic: DOTA invitational and rampant racism  (Read 8835 times)

Offline TheVampire100

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Re: DOTA invitational and rampant racism
« Reply #15 on: August 10, 2015, 04:19:50 pm »
Just some other question: Who of you owns a compendium?
I still don't have the "play with 4 other compendium owners" challenge.

Offline crazyroosterman

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Re: DOTA invitational and rampant racism
« Reply #16 on: August 10, 2015, 05:31:33 pm »
Just some other question: Who of you owns a compendium?
I still don't have the "play with 4 other compendium owners" challenge.
I'm not actually a dota player I was just interested in the allegations of racism and general hatred now I have played dota but I was never able to get into it mainly because you cant lock the camera onto watching your character.(extremely petty I know but I really cant deal with not being to do that in mobas which is probably why the only mobas I've played are league and heroes)
c.r

Offline Cyborg

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Re: DOTA invitational and rampant racism
« Reply #17 on: August 10, 2015, 09:13:44 pm »
I am an expert at league, and that community has a huge issue, also. Maybe it's just competitive gaming in general. People are messed up.
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Offline Mánagarmr

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Re: DOTA invitational and rampant racism
« Reply #18 on: August 11, 2015, 04:06:50 am »
Oh, we were talking about Twitch chat. Well then, there's your problem. You read Twitch chat.


Also, Misery, I'm curious how the fighting game genre can be worse than the MOBA genre. I mean, in MOBAs you do have teammates to "blame", but in fighting games you really have no one to blame but yourself, so how the balls does the flaming get worse there?
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Offline Misery

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Re: DOTA invitational and rampant racism
« Reply #19 on: August 11, 2015, 01:10:42 pm »
Oh, we were talking about Twitch chat. Well then, there's your problem. You read Twitch chat.


Also, Misery, I'm curious how the fighting game genre can be worse than the MOBA genre. I mean, in MOBAs you do have teammates to "blame", but in fighting games you really have no one to blame but yourself, so how the balls does the flaming get worse there?

That's part of why, actually.   They have nobody to blame but themselves.  So they'll blame everyone around them.  There's no REASON to shout at anyone else... but they'll do it anyway.  In team games, you usually also see people insulting the skills of others because they're on the same team, and thus, of COURSE those low-skilled guys are the reason the jerk lost, yeah?  Aint any of that in fighting games.  Insult your opponents, insult whoever's watching you, insult the new guy that just sat down to watch, insult someone that just appeared on the forum (whichever one it is) and asked like ONE question...  all of these, of course, peppered with f-bombs and the word "scrub" repeated 2 billion times.  Not even playing the game at the time, havent touched it for a month?  Find someone to talk to about it.  Then call them a scrub and throw every conceivable insult at them.   Someone lost to you?  CLEARLY they're a scrub and they suck at the game.  Someone beat you?  HOLY CRAP are they ever a scrub, they suck EVEN WORSE AT IT.  No, I dont know how that last one makes sense.  But they'll scream it in your ear, if you give them the chance.   Or how about teaching new players how to play?  It happens in mobas.  Pretty frequently; it's not at all hard to find people willing to teach.  Fighting games?  Yeah NOPE.  If you have to ask for help, you're a scrub.  And a n00b, and a loser, and all sorts of other things.  Most new players end up just going and watching/copying high ranked players that they see online instead.

I think one of the dumbest parts though is how the insulting of ABSOLUTELY EVERYONE IN THE VICINITY doesnt just happen when things arent going so well (which is when it happens in team games, for the most part), but happens PERPETUALLY.   You're totally kicking ass and taking names?  Scream at your opponent.  That guy that just sat down in your field of view 20 feet away, he almost distracted you maybe, so PROFANITIES AT MAX VOLUME!  And be sure to ask others that may be around if they play the game; then tell them how much you'd destroy them, like the scrubbish little n00bwads they are. 

And never forget:  If you win, it was PURE SKILL, but if you lose, it's never, ever your fault, or the opponent's skill.  They got lucky.  It was a glitch.  Your controller had a .0001 second delay.  They just plain picked an OP character.  Or whatever. 


To some degree, it's easy enough to understand at least some of the frustration in team games; you have to rely on others that might not be very reliable.   It's very easy to get angered when you are quite pleased with your own performance.... but some guy on your team suddenly leads a bazillion ninjas over to your hiding place, or something like that.  Nobody likes it when that sort of thing happens.   But fighting games.... there's no teammates to get angry over, but holy hell, they'll MAKE new things to get angry over in order to fill that void.


Obviously not EVERYONE is like that, but just like in the moba communities, far too many of them really are.  Similar ratio.  It just... ugh.  It just baffles me, really.  This crap happens either in local matches, or online.  Though obviously it's more.... intense... when it's a local match.  It's one thing to hear someone online scream at their cat for distracting them and causing a loss.  It's a whole other thing to actually watch them jump up and ricochet the controller (which may not be theirs) off the wall.

Offline Mánagarmr

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Re: DOTA invitational and rampant racism
« Reply #20 on: August 12, 2015, 10:45:50 am »
...now my head hurts. Sounds like the fighting game community is made up of very angry children. O_o
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Offline Cyborg

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Re: DOTA invitational and rampant racism
« Reply #21 on: August 12, 2015, 10:29:49 pm »
...now my head hurts. Sounds like the fighting game community is made up of very angry children. O_o


My cousin used to throw controllers back in the Street fighter 2 days. I was always confused why he was so angry.
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Offline Misery

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Re: DOTA invitational and rampant racism
« Reply #22 on: August 14, 2015, 10:58:55 am »
...now my head hurts. Sounds like the fighting game community is made up of very angry children. O_o

Frankly, alot of them dont even reach that high of a maturity level.

I simply refuse to interact with them these days, for the most part.  I'm irritable enough as it is without that sort of crap.

Offline TheVampire100

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Re: DOTA invitational and rampant racism
« Reply #23 on: August 18, 2015, 10:58:04 pm »
I always end up tellign the other players "relax, it's just a game". A lot of players want to prove themself and others something. In Dota is MMR which shows your "player value". Actually it shows the value of how good you play and where you belong as a player. But since Valve decided to show it openly, players think this is a leaderboard like in many other games. The value determined in what region of players you belong (after all, it's called matchmaking rating) and if you have found your perfect rating, you won't go very far up or if you go up you will find stronger players that stomp you back to where you belong. Some acknowledge this, most other players however think that there has to be a steady uprise on your value since you "are better than all your teammates". This results very often in cursing other players even if you have only around 50 points more (~2 games).
Like I said before, there is a big misunderstandin of what MMR actually is. People think it's a leaderboard and like in any leaderboard you can improve yourself. This is true and false at the same time. They are blinded by the performance of professional players that play in the higher ranks. However, these players play and train an entire year with the same team and therefor have a better understanding of the game. A normal player plays around 5 games per day or less. And of course not every day. And to be honest, there is a limit on what you can do and learn in Dota and if there is a player that is better in it you will never beat him. "Skill" like most casual players want to explain, plays actually a very little role in the game. Luck plays a bigger role than most people think. Last hitting is, to an amount, a luck based system. Of course you can try to train the rythm to get a better result on getting gold but in the end it comes down to luck: Are you fast enough before a creep or another hero beats you to it? Beacuse everyone wants this last hit, you, your fellow tem mates, even the enemy team wants it. And all these factiors play allong at the same time. You can train yourself to a better understanding how much HP the enemy must have left for a last hit. That's all. Bit you cannot speed up your hero or stop others from doing the same thing.
Then there are kill steals. Players like to shout at others that "steal" their rightful kills. In my opinion in a team game there cannot be a "stolen kill". It's unimportant who get's the kill, it's important THAT the team get's a kill since that's what you want, the enemy team dead so you have some time to push.
But people really want to show of how many people they killed and they have more gold in their pockets than they can spend. Still they deny that you deserve also a kill just because they did the main portion of the fight. Some roles will end up with really low money in the end game and will struggle to survive but the carries, that don't need any money anymore, still deny them the gold because they think they are not worthy of it. In the endgame the support is mostlly picked a starget of the enemy team because he is the easiest target or even the only target they can kill. And than your team cries "What a lousy support, dies all the time. Buy this, buy that". Yeah, with what money? And, to make it clear, the main portion of a kill goes anyway to the guy who dealt the most damage to a kill. The only thing that changes is if you get a digit in kill or assist and players think that kills are more important than assists (it's irrelevant in my opinion, I always count both together).
The new Dota Reborn player profile shows in my opinion a better understanding of player roles. It does not only shows your victories or how many kills you had, it shows if you did support, push, kills, are a flexible player (plays with more than one or two heroes) and shows perfectly what role you fil. In my profile for example it shows that I'm an very flexible play, playing with a lot of dofferent heroes and playing mostly support with less farm and kills. It gives a perfect example of what I am: Support, not carry.
I think this should show up at the beginning of the game for every player since it's important. Otherwise your team tries to fit you in a role that you cannot play.


Another thing I want to mention: The International is over, EG has won. And directly after they've won there pops up messages that EG has thrown out AUI_2000, the player that provided the victory.
The reasons are mentioned on different sites, mainly it seems that one of the members has to step down his role because he get's a hand surgery and cannot play as fast as before. AUI has to make free that spot because of that. Than they take in another (exmember) player in the team that takes the role o the carry. Some people think it's backstabbing, other think it's okay.
I'm not very sure what to think of it. I think it's a bit hard to throw out someone who had a big impact on obtaining the victory on the other side it's still a team game and the rest of the team did also their part. It's not like that AUI won't get his cut from the prize money anyway, he get'shis share and will move along, goung into another team and probably raging against his former team on the next international. Or not, we will see. For now we can probalby see some changes on how Dota will be played because int he aftermath of the TI everyone tries to do the stuff they've seen in the torunament. And I think that's actually the part that annoys me the most because those players think their strategy is the best but in the end they didn't even invent it nor do they really understand how it works. They just take it out of the context and don't try to adapt to the situation. Very toxic for the game.

Offline Misery

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Re: DOTA invitational and rampant racism
« Reply #24 on: August 20, 2015, 09:27:46 pm »
On the note of the whole fighting game community and the way they act....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CsJfLKtGlfw

I'd like to come up with something witty to say about that one, but this speaks for itself.  I've seen similar things happen, in person, and NOT at tournaments.  Tournaments though are the most volatile, for obvious reasons.  But it still happens outside of those.



Also, that bit about the International, I did read about that Aui guy getting tossed off of his team AFTER THEY FREAKING WON. 

I mean, just.... what.   WHY did that happen, exactly?  Nobody seemed specific about the actual reason for it.

Offline Wingflier

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Re: DOTA invitational and rampant racism
« Reply #25 on: August 21, 2015, 01:11:39 am »
Quote
On the note of the whole fighting game community and the way they act....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CsJfLKtGlfw

I'd like to come up with something witty to say about that one, but this speaks for itself.  I've seen similar things happen, in person, and NOT at tournaments.  Tournaments though are the most volatile, for obvious reasons.  But it still happens outside of those.
Just came here to say - that video was AWESOME!
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Offline Misery

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Re: DOTA invitational and rampant racism
« Reply #26 on: August 21, 2015, 02:16:09 am »
Quote
On the note of the whole fighting game community and the way they act....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CsJfLKtGlfw

I'd like to come up with something witty to say about that one, but this speaks for itself.  I've seen similar things happen, in person, and NOT at tournaments.  Tournaments though are the most volatile, for obvious reasons.  But it still happens outside of those.
Just came here to say - that video was AWESOME!


Wasnt it?

Absolutely hilarious.   I was laughing pretty hard at most of that.

So stupid though.  Whatever happened to sportsmanship? Died in a fire, apparently.  And they dont seem to know what "fun" is anymore either.

But at least it produces hilarious moments like that.

Offline crazyroosterman

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Re: DOTA invitational and rampant racism
« Reply #27 on: August 24, 2015, 07:20:18 pm »
On the note of the whole fighting game community and the way they act....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CsJfLKtGlfw

I'd like to come up with something witty to say about that one, but this speaks for itself.  I've seen similar things happen, in person, and NOT at tournaments.  Tournaments though are the most volatile, for obvious reasons.  But it still happens outside of those.



Also, that bit about the International, I did read about that Aui guy getting tossed off of his team AFTER THEY FREAKING WON. 

I mean, just.... what.   WHY did that happen, exactly?  Nobody seemed specific about the actual reason for it.
well....I watched about 50 seconds of that and stopped sweet Jesus hearthstone tournaments may be boring as sin but at least the people participating in it act like bloody adults( disclaimer that's stemming from my limited experience really) also sorry if I sound like an idiot but I don't get that guy being thrown I mean couldn't they just have a temporary replacement and then let him back in when its healed? isn't that what they do in other sports?.(disclaimer I don't actually watch psychical sports for lack of a better word my knowledge there is purely academic)
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Offline TheVampire100

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Re: DOTA invitational and rampant racism
« Reply #28 on: August 24, 2015, 08:14:39 pm »
On the note of the whole fighting game community and the way they act....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CsJfLKtGlfw

I'd like to come up with something witty to say about that one, but this speaks for itself.  I've seen similar things happen, in person, and NOT at tournaments.  Tournaments though are the most volatile, for obvious reasons.  But it still happens outside of those.



Also, that bit about the International, I did read about that Aui guy getting tossed off of his team AFTER THEY FREAKING WON. 

I mean, just.... what.   WHY did that happen, exactly?  Nobody seemed specific about the actual reason for it.
Wow, you would think in a professional zournament they would act at least professional but that's really sick. The mnost disgusting part was when this one guy totally lost his temper and started to beat up the guy in real life. Still won't give him a victory.

At least the Dota professionals ACT as professionals. But seeing this I have the feeling they are all immature teenagers on the inside.

Offline Mánagarmr

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Re: DOTA invitational and rampant racism
« Reply #29 on: August 25, 2015, 03:14:25 am »
On the note of the whole fighting game community and the way they act....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CsJfLKtGlfw
...


...
I mean, just.... what.   WHY did that happen, exactly?  Nobody seemed specific about the actual reason for it.
...I...am at a lack of words. The words "penis envy" and "epeen" come to mind. These guys must have SERIOUS self-image issues to act with that kind of hostility. Wow...I...wow. Just wow. I hope these guys get to grow up and see this videos in 10 years time and shame their EYES out of their sockets. Christ....
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