Kickstarter is live!

[Misery]

Tigris, your concern and the effort you've put into expressing it are appreciated, but the addition of caps, vulgarity, and general shrillness will not improve the impact of what you say.

Suffice it to say you're not saying anything we haven't thought, in one form or another.

This isn't the last move in the chess game.

I hope nobody minds, but I removed that last bit, in Tigris's post up there... seems like the sort of thing that shouldn't be here.  We don't normally get that in this place, which I think is part of the forum's appeal...

Please let me know if that was the wrong move though.




Anyway, about the Kickstarter, hmm, it is a bit worrying, but nobody should give up on it yet.  Yes, I understand the irony of a "be positive" message coming from me, but still.  There is still 22 days left... it's not like we're down to just 5.

That being said, I'd like to agree with the stuff eRe4s3r said up above.  When I think about it, the trailer doesn't show much.  And while I tend to buy into things like early-access games pretty often, one thing I *never* do is buy into anything that doesn't show enough actual gameplay, or at least some sort of demonstration of what the gameplay will be like... getting an idea for how things move about and function is important.   Granted, this case is an exception for me, since I know you guys and I have an idea as to where you're going with this, but still.   Normally, I'd never do it, and I'd bet that applies to some others as well.

Though I have no idea wether you're ABLE to show anything like that right now.  Might be just way too early, development-wise, for all I know.   But still, that's my thoughts on that.

I wish I could help with something here but I don't think there's really anything I could do.

[Matruchus]

Anyway, about the Kickstarter, hmm, it is a bit worrying, but nobody should give up on it yet.  Yes, I understand the irony of a "be positive" message coming from me, but still.  There is still 22 days left... it's not like we're down to just 5.

That being said, I'd like to agree with the stuff eRe4s3r said up above.  When I think about it, the trailer doesn't show much.  And while I tend to buy into things like early-access games pretty often, one thing I *never* do is buy into anything that doesn't show enough actual gameplay, or at least some sort of demonstration of what the gameplay will be like... getting an idea for how things move about and function is important.   Granted, this case is an exception for me, since I know you guys and I have an idea as to where you're going with this, but still.   Normally, I'd never do it, and I'd bet that applies to some others as well.

Though I have no idea wether you're ABLE to show anything like that right now.  Might be just way too early, development-wise, for all I know.   But still, that's my thoughts on that.

I wish I could help with something here but I don't think there's really anything I could do.

It would be something if they showed the difference between Ai War Classic and Ai War 2 units, how they move, behave - I mean they have some animations there for Ai War 2 units but it doesn't show what the difference is in comparison to AI War. At the moment in the kickstarter trailer it seems as if Arcen is a bit afraid of showing original AI War there. That's the impression I got from the trailer. Plus it doesn't help that there is a media blackout on this Kickstarter, besides posting short news notices about it. They definitely need to make some interviews with explorminate, etc. They just need more marketing but that is one thing where Arcen has always lacked in my personal opinion. The word of mouth concept doesn't work anymore in this day and era.

[eRe4s3r]

What surprised me even more is that there isn't any (all-systems) prototype footage of AI War 2 to show, I can't think of a single KS that made any cash without at least SOME gameplay render or prototype footage. I mean do you remember PoE and their "tech" demonstration with that 1 scene that showed what is possible with this design approach? The scene looked pretty amazing and when they showed how it was "built" you realized they have what it takes to make the game this way and imaginations sprung wild from this (And at least graphically, PoE served what it had promised, I can't think of any pre-rendered tile game that looked as good, although nostalgia will always draw me to BG2 and how amazing that really was for the time it was made...) anyway PoE had Chris Sawyer as writer, so that is maybe a moot point. There are enough fans of his writing alone to back any project ;P

Thing is X4000 and crew are by no means slacking here, the design document is incredible, it may be the largest most comprehensive thing I've ever seen and I've seen some of a few 4x games! But a design document makes for bad bedtime reading and nobody who isn't already committed (financially or personally) would read it, or even click on it. I mean that one polygon news post certainly showed that.

So what we got left when we think about it? A video that doesn't really show what AI War 2 could be, and instead shows what "is" right now. And a design document that is comprehensive but ultimately probably only interests backers.

I think you gonna have to put out some amazing stuff and content, at the very least a rudimentary gameplay example of the things players do 99% of the time, that's buildy and shooty ;p

[Tigris]

Tigris, your concern and the effort you've put into expressing it are appreciated, but the addition of caps, vulgarity, and general shrillness will not improve the impact of what you say.

Suffice it to say you're not saying anything we haven't thought, in one form or another.

This isn't the last move in the chess game.

I hope nobody minds, but I removed that last bit, in Tigris's post up there... seems like the sort of thing that shouldn't be here.  We don't normally get that in this place, which I think is part of the forum's appeal...

Please let me know if that was the wrong move though.

Well the last part was the important part. The first part is stuff allready know.
The problem isn't that no one is aware of some ideas, but that the people involved still are too arrogant and too nice (and not desperate enough) to use the methods!

"I am glad we do not use such methods on our kickstarter"
"A SMALL notification is added"
"I am sure we can make the kickstarter"
"A sequel to the award-winning, genre breaking, asymmetric strategy cult classic"
"We do not need the extra 600 for 300 000"
etc.

all this quotes show arrogance...


I now that this may be unfriendly. But what the people in charge need is not idea, but a punch in the face, such that they wake up and do what is necessary and not what is nice, and not what the "fans want".

Also thinking that someone actually reads a design document and preparing that instead of some nice (made up) graphics etc....

[Wingflier]

At risk of feeding the trolls, or attempting intellectual debate with a mentally handicapped person, I don't think the problem is that Arcen is being quote "too nice".

I'm sure they've already considered everything you're saying. Using expletives or claiming that the people in change need 'a punch in the face' for not doing things the way you would do them is well, disingenuous to say the least. If you want to create your own game and your own Kickstarter then you're free to go about things however you would like.

If you have some positive criticism, or at least criticism that you can convey in a constructive way (without cussing, all caps, or physical threats), then by all means, let us know. Otherwise, it's probably better to say nothing at all because trust me when I say you aren't helping.

[garion333]

Yeah, I agree with some of the points being made but all I'm hearing is angry Internet dude (or dudette).

[Aklyon]

As much as Tigris has made good points, he also is rather good at sounding like Guy Who Is Clearly Right And Will Say So.

[Cinth]

Enough is enough guys.  It doesn't matter what you think of Tigris, we don't need to vocalize it.