Arcen Games

Games => AI War II => AI War II - Gameplay Ideas => Topic started by: kasnavada on September 16, 2016, 02:17:53 AM

Title: Design question / inquiry: why isn't metal maintenance cost in the game ?
Post by: kasnavada on September 16, 2016, 02:17:53 AM
I would have thought it would help with refleeting, since dead ships would cost less maintenance (being dead and all), therefore helping with rebuilding the fleet faster. I know there was a link between energy & metal in the earliest version of AI War (possibly, exactly to do that ?) but it kind of disappeared with the latest versions of AI War.

Any idea, why not ?
Title: Re: Design question / inquiry: why isn't metal maintenance cost in the game ?
Post by: Mánagarmr on September 16, 2016, 03:00:18 AM
I've always liked maintenance as a gameplay mechanic, because it makes you think about what you field in battle. But from a lore standpoint it makes nada sense. How are you "maintaining" ships that are on the other side of the galaxy, far away from any docks? ^^
Title: Re: Design question / inquiry: why isn't metal maintenance cost in the game ?
Post by: kasnavada on September 16, 2016, 03:17:01 AM
Invisible supply lanes / reserves on ships, not shown for the sake of not making the interface melt.

Still it's a good point on the lore standpoint.
That said... firing doesn't take ammo, and energy works without limitation of range (through wormholes) so... from a lore point of view...
Title: Re: Design question / inquiry: why isn't metal maintenance cost in the game ?
Post by: Tridus on September 16, 2016, 07:40:29 AM
It seems like it'd actually *hurt* refleeting, because as you rebuild your fleet, each subsequent ship will be a bit slower than the last one. For a large fleet, it's going to get very, very expensive.
Title: Re: Design question / inquiry: why isn't metal maintenance cost in the game ?
Post by: kasnavada on September 16, 2016, 07:48:43 AM
Depends where the metal costs are compared to now.

If the total metal income does not change and the maintenance is flat-out taken from it... yes, but it will cause issues. So, this would have to come with rebalancing... Example: if "current metal income" is "100%", balanced could be changed so:
- full fleet cost = 75%.
- no fleet cost = 250%.

Overall refleeting is faster with those numbers. Of course, if you go this way:
- full fleet cost = 25%.
- no fleet cost = 100%.

This last way won't work. Of course, simply adding metal could also work on its own. Maintenance costs have the "advantage" of limiting income when there is a full fleet, which I generally see as a good thing (from a balance point of view). That said I'm neutral toward having metal as maintenance in the game, or not.
Title: Re: Design question / inquiry: why isn't metal maintenance cost in the game ?
Post by: x4000 on September 16, 2016, 09:18:20 AM
In general it also really complicates the math of what you can build, since your income is so dependent on what you already have.
Title: Re: Design question / inquiry: why isn't metal maintenance cost in the game ?
Post by: Cinth on September 16, 2016, 10:37:28 AM
In general it also really complicates the math of what you can build, since your income is so dependent on what you already have.

It's also a cap on top of a cap.
Title: Re: Design question / inquiry: why isn't metal maintenance cost in the game ?
Post by: Pumpkin on September 16, 2016, 01:19:53 PM
Hey I just imagined a game (not AI War II) with no cap but only an upkeep paid with the building cost. Few ships, fast rebuilds or big armies and big crashes. It could also be possible to stash a lot of resource and overbuild but the army won't be sustainable for long.

Yeah, random passing idea.
Title: Re: Design question / inquiry: why isn't metal maintenance cost in the game ?
Post by: ptarth on September 24, 2016, 08:57:50 PM
You could combine the two economic models, in the sense that you don't track stored resources (see below for alternative), but instead only net income (i.e., income and expenditures). So a scout doesn't have a 10 metal one time cost, but instead has a 1 metal/second cost. Furthermore, the upkeep calculations are straight forward and simple. On construction (or queuing) the cost of a thing is removed from the net income. On death it is added back to the budget. So you don't bother updating changes in income, unless something dies or you build a new economic source. So you just have a running total of: How much resources do I have left to spend on things.