Author Topic: Tech II Engineers  (Read 2662 times)

Offline Draxis

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Tech II Engineers
« on: April 11, 2010, 03:58:22 am »
Tech I Engineers have an energy use of 4000, and an engineering rate of 1
Tech II Engineers have an energy used of 6000, and an engineering rate of 1.5
Tech III Engineers have an energy used of 8000, and an engineering rate of 2

Is there any reason to unlock tech II or III engineers (2K and 4K knowledge), unless you are at your engineer cap, or need engineers to work in a system with a hostile Ion Cannon?  I would have thought they would have a better 'engineering rate to energy use' ratio.  T3's do have cloaking, but unless there is something else I am missing, neither seem to be worth the knowledge cost.

Offline keith.lamothe

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Re: Tech II Engineers
« Reply #1 on: April 11, 2010, 07:45:38 am »
I tend to want more engineers than mk I will supply.  But I think the biggest distinction before was that mk Is did not have teleportation, which has changed.
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Offline Mánagarmr

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Re: Tech II Engineers
« Reply #2 on: April 11, 2010, 10:15:59 am »
I've been considering this as well. Energy really is a premium locked down not only by the amount of planets you have, but also on how much resources you produce. Having the same, or just slightly increased energy cost would perhaps be a better idea? I never unlock engineers, and I don't really see a reason for it either.
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Offline superking

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Re: Tech II Engineers
« Reply #3 on: April 11, 2010, 10:50:13 am »
maybe later engineers should be more efficient now mk1s can teleport

Offline Spikey00

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Re: Tech II Engineers
« Reply #4 on: April 11, 2010, 12:06:47 pm »
I also believe there has to be more incentive for the player in unlocking the higher tier engineers--while the III has cloaking, it isn't that incredibly helpful since engineers are low priority to the AI.

When T1 engineers didn't teleport, I was thinking of:
- I can travel to other planets.
- II can teleport but only in the same planet.
- III can teleport anywhere.

Though I generally prefer that T1 engineers be given the ability to teleport, given the 2K knowledge requirement early-mid game.

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Efficient as in:  a) energy cost, or b) assisting cost; decreasing the assisting cost slightly by a certain per cent (while being the same build rate) would be a possible solution.
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Offline RCIX

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Re: Tech II Engineers
« Reply #5 on: April 12, 2010, 12:35:15 am »
Higher tech engineers are much cheaper for a given amount of engineering rate...
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Offline FrostyThePyro

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Re: Tech II Engineers
« Reply #6 on: April 12, 2010, 04:27:14 am »
I will sometimes go to tech II for that engineering cap bit, but I dont think i have ever unlocked tech III (I will on ocasion capture them from the AI via leeches though)

Offline superking

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Re: Tech II Engineers
« Reply #7 on: April 12, 2010, 09:22:15 am »
Higher tech engineers are much cheaper for a given amount of engineering rate...

a 50% increase of engineering rate for a 50% increase in energy cost =/= cheaper

Offline Trezamere

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Re: Tech II Engineers
« Reply #8 on: April 12, 2010, 10:41:35 am »
Percentages don't really translate well into the savings you get, in this case you're comparing a relatively small amount of energy increase to a huge savings in resource costs (assuming I'm understanding engineers correctly) and speed.  Yes they're the same % wise but that doesn't really tell you anything.  Thought I agree they may be slightly to costly in knowledge.

Offline ShadowOTE

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Re: Tech II Engineers
« Reply #9 on: April 12, 2010, 11:59:26 am »
Hmm, if higher tech engineers are much more resource efficient (or speed efficient) it might not be a bad idea to highlight this a bit more. I haven't used many of the higher tier engineers, since tier 1s are more than capable of crashing my economy on their own thank you very much ;)

That said, could we get a better explaination of how engineers work, cost and time wise? I checked the wiki and all it seems to say is that they build faster and can migrate up to 15000 away from their current location to fix stuff. I haven't checked the in-game descriptions, but I'll take a look the next time I get the chance to see if anything gets clarified in the text blurb.

Offline Mánagarmr

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Re: Tech II Engineers
« Reply #10 on: April 12, 2010, 12:05:51 pm »
I always assumed Engineers Mk II just built 1,5 times faster, hence using up your resources 1,5 times faster. Not providing 50% free resources. That sounds absurd O.o
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Offline superking

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Re: Tech II Engineers
« Reply #11 on: April 12, 2010, 12:08:11 pm »
wait, seriously?

can someone confirm this?

1.5x engineering speed = 1.5x the work for 1.0x the cost?

surely not, that would be mental  :)

Offline Doddler

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Re: Tech II Engineers
« Reply #12 on: April 12, 2010, 12:45:31 pm »
When building something new, I'm pretty sure that an Mk II engineer builds 50% faster and consumes 50% more resources.  When repairing something, like ships, damaged turrets, or even a golem, you pay a fixed price per engineer, but still repair faster with higher engineering rate, so the engineer with the higher rate will save you both time and resources.  

Using say, experimental engineers (engineering rate 5) to construct ships or buildings will cause a huge drain on your resources, but you should see the suckers repair things, its practically free, stick 5 of those guys on a golem and repair it in 6 minutes flat with incredibly low cost.  I <3 experimental engineers.

Still, the primary role of engineers is to assist in construction of ships and structures (MRS takes the role of repairing), so in that ragard there is no real advantage to using higher tier engineers.  You pay the same amount to build ships, and you pay roughly the same maintenance (energy) for that engineering power.  Technically Mk III are cloaked but they become visible when repairing/building so I'm not sure how much of an advantage that is.  Perhaps if they just all had the same energy cost (4000), it would be more efficient to use the higher rank engineers over lower ones for all uses.
« Last Edit: April 12, 2010, 12:47:13 pm by Doddler »

Offline FrostyThePyro

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Re: Tech II Engineers
« Reply #13 on: April 12, 2010, 03:23:58 pm »
well my observation is that a constructor (such as a space dock) has an engineering rate of 1.  then each engineer adds its rate to that when constructing.  for example if ship x takes 10 min to build, adding a tech I engneer would make it take 5 minutes (10/(1+2)), if instead you added a tech II engineer would take 4 minutes (10/(1+1.5))

Offline Kryzite

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Re: Tech II Engineers
« Reply #14 on: April 12, 2010, 03:55:36 pm »
Took some ideas here and some of mine for my idea for a rebalance for the next poll.

http://arcengames.com/forums/index.php/topic,4666.0.html

Discuss!

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