Author Topic: So about those nemeses...  (Read 5004 times)

Offline LaughingThesaurus

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Re: So about those nemeses...
« Reply #15 on: April 11, 2013, 06:54:19 pm »
Oh I have modules installed. It's just the modules I have aren't really bells and whistles. They're rusty copper rings and broken wind chimes.

I guess I can go on a gratuitous turret scrapping spree if I need them elsewhere. I've got plenty of energy for it now.

Offline Cinth

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Re: So about those nemeses...
« Reply #16 on: April 11, 2013, 08:00:20 pm »
@ Toranth: I was mostly joking around when I said that about the BBs :)
Glad you were joking, but to get rid of that "Mostly", try this saved game.  Just play for an hour or so, and tell me what you think.

Not as bad as 4000 Raids, but close.

I've played against a 10 Heroic AI.  It is down in the reds for a reason, it is nasty, and it is supposed to be nasty.

Just a "the hell did you do" type of moment, when I saw the locations of your HWs.  Then I checked the bonus ships, which you grabbed two that would work decently against champs.

Anyway, Heroic AI uses Champions (Yup, same stuff we get access to with our champs).  Nemesis ships are the global AI response to the player having champions.  Nemesis ships are locked in at the FF level.

So while I didn't actually play your save, I know the pain that AI brings.  There were just to many planets I would need to gate raid and neuter while setting up initial defenses to get the waves to come in from one direction (11 systems?!!).
Quote from: keith.lamothe
Opened your save. My computer wept. Switched to the ST planet and ship icons filled my screen, so I zoomed out. Game told me that it _was_ totally zoomed out. You could seriously walk from one end of the inner grav well to the other without getting your feet cold.

Offline Toranth

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Re: So about those nemeses...
« Reply #17 on: April 11, 2013, 08:34:44 pm »
@ Toranth: I was mostly joking around when I said that about the BBs :)
Glad you were joking, but to get rid of that "Mostly", try this saved game.  Just play for an hour or so, and tell me what you think.

Not as bad as 4000 Raids, but close.

I've played against a 10 Heroic AI.  It is down in the reds for a reason, it is nasty, and it is supposed to be nasty.

Just a "the hell did you do" type of moment, when I saw the locations of your HWs.  Then I checked the bonus ships, which you grabbed two that would work decently against champs.

Anyway, Heroic AI uses Champions (Yup, same stuff we get access to with our champs).  Nemesis ships are the global AI response to the player having champions.  Nemesis ships are locked in at the FF level.

So while I didn't actually play your save, I know the pain that AI brings.  There were just to many planets I would need to gate raid and neuter while setting up initial defenses to get the waves to come in from one direction (11 systems?!!).
It was a surprisingly good start.  I just made it, based on an older game I've been trying to win for months, mostly to demonstrate what happens when 100 destroyers/hour come flooding in.  In the game there, I was able to survive the first 3 groups of Nemesis, but when a wave and a Nemesis group coincided, that was it.
Gate raiding only took the AIP up enough that wave size was about 15000 normal ships.  Not too bad for a 5 HW game, it was just bad timing.
I may come back and try to win that one seriously at some point.

Did you ever beat a diff 10 Heroic AI?  I was unable to do so without serious cheese (+300%/-300% handicaps, for example).
The concept the AI getting bigger hulled ships in those same quantities... I've seem what 8 BBs can do to 5000 fleetships and it ain't pretty.  50 BBs?  Might as well rename your Homeworld "GG" and be done with it.  (Kind of want to see it once, though - you know, like the "so THAT'S what 100 motherships looks like" moment.)

Offline LaughingThesaurus

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Re: So about those nemeses...
« Reply #18 on: April 11, 2013, 08:57:59 pm »
The nemesis champions stay completely static then? I kind of figured they got better when you did.

Offline Cinth

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Re: So about those nemeses...
« Reply #19 on: April 11, 2013, 09:46:51 pm »
It was a surprisingly good start.  I just made it, based on an older game I've been trying to win for months, mostly to demonstrate what happens when 100 destroyers/hour come flooding in.  In the game there, I was able to survive the first 3 groups of Nemesis, but when a wave and a Nemesis group coincided, that was it.
Gate raiding only took the AIP up enough that wave size was about 15000 normal ships.  Not too bad for a 5 HW game, it was just bad timing.
I may come back and try to win that one seriously at some point.
 
Did you ever beat a diff 10 Heroic AI?  I was unable to do so without serious cheese (+300%/-300% handicaps, for example).
The concept the AI getting bigger hulled ships in those same quantities... I've seem what 8 BBs can do to 5000 fleetships and it ain't pretty.  50 BBs?  Might as well rename your Homeworld "GG" and be done with it.  (Kind of want to see it once, though - you know, like the "so THAT'S what 100 motherships looks like" moment.)

Last time I tried, I couldn't get my defenses up before the first wave of champions hit my line.

Quote
"so THAT'S what 100 motherships looks like"


I can do you one better :D
First post in an epic thread.  Had to reread for old times.  Just have to say, This community = Win
http://www.arcengames.com/forums/index.php/topic,11683.0.html

Quote from: keith.lamothe
Opened your save. My computer wept. Switched to the ST planet and ship icons filled my screen, so I zoomed out. Game told me that it _was_ totally zoomed out. You could seriously walk from one end of the inner grav well to the other without getting your feet cold.

Offline Toranth

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Re: So about those nemeses...
« Reply #20 on: April 11, 2013, 10:11:57 pm »
The nemesis champions stay completely static then? I kind of figured they got better when you did.
This is somewhat correct.  The Nemesis champions (both the AI Homeworld defense units, and the threatfleet/SF units spawned over time) are always Frigates.  They never get to a larger hull size.
However, the number of units spawned goes up as you increase your Champion's hull-size.  The AI Homeworld defense goes up as your hull-size does, but down as AIP increases.  The roaming Nemesis units just get more numerous.

Which reminds me:  Mantis suggestion:  0011054: Compress Nemesis frigates into larger hulls


Did you ever beat a diff 10 Heroic AI?  I was unable to do so without serious cheese (+300%/-300% handicaps, for example).
Last time I tried, I couldn't get my defenses up before the first wave of champions hit my line.
Glad to see it's not just me that has so much difficulty with those settings.  But I swear that one of these days I WILL beat the Difficulty 10 Heroic AI in a fair(-ish) game!


Quote
"so THAT'S what 100 motherships looks like"

I can do you one better :D
First post in an epic thread.  Had to reread for old times.  Just have to say, This community = Win
http://www.arcengames.com/forums/index.php/topic,11683.0.html
You know, I never noticed before, but doesn't the Mothership look a little silly with that "V" hanging off the bottom?  (Looking again, it is still an impressive picture.  Do we need a 'Best Of' images thread stickied somewhere?)
« Last Edit: April 11, 2013, 10:14:38 pm by Toranth »

Offline Cinth

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Re: So about those nemeses...
« Reply #21 on: April 11, 2013, 10:41:05 pm »
The nemesis champions stay completely static then? I kind of figured they got better when you did.
This is somewhat correct.  The Nemesis champions (both the AI Homeworld defense units, and the threatfleet/SF units spawned over time) are always Frigates.  They never get to a larger hull size.
However, the number of units spawned goes up as you increase your Champion's hull-size.  The AI Homeworld defense goes up as your hull-size does, but down as AIP increases.  The roaming Nemesis units just get more numerous.

Which reminds me:  Mantis suggestion:  0011054: Compress Nemesis frigates into larger hulls
Mostly correct here.  AI HW nemesis ship cap goes down with AIP progress, but ships already spawned will stay until destroyed.

Quote
Did you ever beat a diff 10 Heroic AI?  I was unable to do so without serious cheese (+300%/-300% handicaps, for example).
Last time I tried, I couldn't get my defenses up before the first wave of champions hit my line.
Glad to see it's not just me that has so much difficulty with those settings.  But I swear that one of these days I WILL beat the Difficulty 10 Heroic AI in a fair(-ish) game!


Quote
"so THAT'S what 100 motherships looks like"

I can do you one better :D
First post in an epic thread.  Had to reread for old times.  Just have to say, This community = Win
http://www.arcengames.com/forums/index.php/topic,11683.0.html
You know, I never noticed before, but doesn't the Mothership look a little silly with that "V" hanging off the bottom?  (Looking again, it is still an impressive picture.  Do we need a 'Best Of' images thread stickied somewhere?)
It's supposed to be a floating planetoid, it looks fine :)

'Best of' or 'Most Shocking'?   8)
Quote from: keith.lamothe
Opened your save. My computer wept. Switched to the ST planet and ship icons filled my screen, so I zoomed out. Game told me that it _was_ totally zoomed out. You could seriously walk from one end of the inner grav well to the other without getting your feet cold.

Offline LaughingThesaurus

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Re: So about those nemeses...
« Reply #22 on: April 11, 2013, 11:34:31 pm »
Let's just stick with "Coolest". I think the warhead death star falls in that category.

Offline Cinth

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Re: So about those nemeses...
« Reply #23 on: April 12, 2013, 12:08:33 am »
Let's just stick with "Coolest". I think the warhead death star falls in that category.

Works for me  8)
Quote from: keith.lamothe
Opened your save. My computer wept. Switched to the ST planet and ship icons filled my screen, so I zoomed out. Game told me that it _was_ totally zoomed out. You could seriously walk from one end of the inner grav well to the other without getting your feet cold.