Science Labs

[corfe83]

Has it ever been considered to make command centers *all* come with functionality as though they contain a built-in science lab? _{And also to make the "s" key a global key, solely for getting the "spend knowledge" menu (not about selecting labs)?}

Too often, I lose my only science lab due to an AI attack, and have to go manually build it again (and I usually set it to auto-gather knowledge). If they left remains this would be a slight improvement, but I think still annoying because I they probably wouldn't remember the auto-gather knowledge orders from before the unit was destroyed.

<sub>Also too often, I decide to spend some knowledge, and have to go hunt for the planet where my lab is so I can hit the "s" key and get the menu to tech up. In fact, I wish you could hit the "s" key to get the tech up menu even on hostile planets. Sometimes it'd be nice to look at available techs and their costs while I'm monitoring an assault.

It's also simpler to teach a newb "to tech up, you hit s", rather than "if there's a science lab here hit s, if not hit tab, set filter for science labs to find where your lab went, and if they are all destroyed build a new one on one of your planets and then when it's done, go there and hit s"</sub>

Edit: striking out the 2nd scenario, because the lower-left bar makes finding a science lab pretty easy. I stand by the first suggestion.

[Aklyon]

Why did you only build one science lab? You can make as many as you like (i tend to make a group of five IIs if I have the energy at the beginning), and the Lab IIs even get an extra bit of survivability the I's don't via cloaking.

[Cinth]

hit tab, set filter for science labs to find where your lab went

I think that's a bit unnecessary really.  How hard is it to build a spare lab and have it sit on your HW so you know where it is?  Also, you can do what I quoted to find lost science.

[corfe83]

Why did you only build one science lab? You can make as many as you like (i tend to make a group of five IIs if I have the energy at the beginning), and the Lab IIs even get an extra bit of survivability the I's don't via cloaking.

I don't usually build more than one because I just don't consider it worthwhile to spend energy on a faster knowledge gain rate - I'd rather spend it on more fleetships or turrets (especially now that turrets are per-planet cap). I think in future games I will start maintaining a small fleet of Mk II science labs when I have a comfortable energy surplus, at least until I'm done with major colonization operations.

That being said, I think it would be an improvement if command stations all gathered knowledge (at a modest rate) on their own.

[corfe83]

hit tab, set filter for science labs to find where your lab went

I think that's a bit unnecessary really.  How hard is it to build a spare lab and have it sit on your HW so you know where it is?  Also, you can do what I quoted to find lost science.

It's true just keeping a spare at my HW is not difficult, and I will probably do that in future games too (build a new one/several to be my auto harvesters). But I still question whether this is actually the best design for the current version of the game, or if we're all just used to it.

(also I didn't see your quote - is there an easier way to find wandering science labs?)

[chemical_art]

Keith has mentioned that a major focus for 9.0 will be on the UI side, to try to streamline it.

I could imagine that it would be a change from the current model of:

select object -----> interact with thing of said object (for example select a command station, then build structures or select research station to conduct research.)

To a more streamlined model. Such as a research tab. Unit construction tab. Structure tab.  Or maybe not this at all!

But he did say he was going to improve UI, and I'm sure this would be part of it.

[Cinth]

There is a filter for them (or was before they were messed with) on the galaxy map.

[corfe83]

hit tab, set filter for science labs to find where your lab went

I think that's a bit unnecessary really.  How hard is it to build a spare lab and have it sit on your HW so you know where it is?  Also, you can do what I quoted to find lost science.

There is a filter for them (or was before they were messed with) on the galaxy map.

That's what I was talking about in my quote. I haven't checked recently, but AFAIK the filter is still there.

[corfe83]

Keith has mentioned that a major focus for 9.0 will be on the UI side, to try to streamline it.

I could imagine that it would be a change from the current model of:

select object -----> interact with thing of said object (for example select a command station, then build structures or select research station to conduct research.)

To a more streamlined model. Such as a research tab. Unit construction tab. Structure tab.  Or maybe not this at all!

But he did say he was going to improve UI, and I'm sure this would be part of it.

Yeah, everything is very object based right now. I'm glad it's improved since the days of the little control node structures you used to build, the CTRL tab is a huge win over those, and I'd love to see even more movement in this direction.

[Alex Heartnet]

I don't even see the point in the science labs honestly.  Why can't the command stations themselves collect the science and do the researching?

So +1 from me.

[Cinth]

That's what I was talking about in my quote. I haven't checked recently, but AFAIK the filter is still there.

Another method would be to stick them in a control group so you could double tap the number to go to them.

[Cinth]

I don't even see the point in the science labs honestly.  Why can't the command stations themselves collect the science and do the researching?

So +1 from me.

Science Labs offer the one and only way to scope out what you can acquire from an ARS.
Science Labs offer the one and only way to gather K from planets uncontrolled planets in supply.

[keith.lamothe]

There's actually a special keybind (unbound by default) for "find a science lab somewhere and select it", for this purpose, though it's not ideal.

As for command stations: a single unit cannot have both a build menu and a science menu.

But yes, one aspect of the UI I want to overhaul is the whole "all (or at least most) menus have to come from an object" thing.

[Vyndicu]

I don't even see the point in the science labs honestly.  Why can't the command stations themselves collect the science and do the researching?

So +1 from me.

If command stations did all of the harvesting of knowledge then what are ARS's 5+ knowledge collecting rate for?

Furthermore, other have said but it bear repeating, you need a normal or mk 2 science lab to see what ARS unlock before hacking and/or take ARSs' system over.

[Toranth]

I don't even see the point in the science labs honestly.  Why can't the command stations themselves collect the science and do the researching?

So +1 from me.

Science labs can also do stuff like gather knowledge from neutral planets, reveal the ARS unlock options, and require a minor amount of protection, so you can't always just unlock anything at any time without any preparation.

All in all, I like science labs as they are.  I just wish all the hacking stuff would show up under the science labs filter on the galaxy map.