Rebuilding is a big part of the "grind."

[zebramatt]

Sounds to me like losing a planet should be made more of a blow.

[Shrugging Khan]

More of a blow, strategically, but less of a bureaucratic hassle when the strategic impact has been taken care of by the player.

[Sunshine!]

It sounds like maybe all command stations need a pretty huge boost (couple million hitpoints each, basic defensive cannons - mk3 military should be very difficult to kill unless 100-200 mk3 bombers run into it or so), but also need to take something like 5 mins to build per mark and cost something like 100,000 metal/crystal per mark level.  That way they'll be lost less frequently, but losing one will be a pretty heavy blow economically.

Edit: While I'm at it, would a general boost to AI command stations to match the human boost be out of line?  Right now it's still relatively easy to trash a mk3 AI command station with a cap of mk1 fighters (maybe need mk1/mk2 cap depending on resistance).  Hitpoint boost, add in multi-shot short-range defensive cannons with bonuses against swarmer, ultra-light, and light maybe to discourage fighter spam as a means of targeting infrastructure.  Not sure how a lot of players would feel about this though, given previous complaints about bombers being too necessary.  Then again, if the defensive guns were short enough range, missile frigates would make a valid alternative to bombers for targeting command stations.

[Commiesalami]

It sounds like maybe all command stations need a pretty huge boost (couple million hitpoints each, basic defensive cannons - mk3 military should be very difficult to kill unless 100 mk3 bombers run into it or so), but also need to take something like 5 mins to build per mark and cost something like 100,000 metal/crystal per mark level.  That way they'll be lost less frequently, but losing one will be a pretty heavy blow economically.

That would make the beginning game so slow that you would have no players left.  The idea isn't bad but its taken too far in both directions.  It should be more of a (3m*1000)^1.05n Metal/Crystal cost for each command station you build.  m is the mark #, and n is the number of total command stations built, including ones that have already been destroyed.  I don't know command station costs off the top of my head so it equation may need a lot of jiggering, but it would impose an increasing economic penalty for loosing command stations.  Secondly thats simply way too powerful for command stations with it edging up into the fortress levels.  I think a form of researchable command station exo-field would work instead: large amounts of added health, but the passive logistical/economical/military bonuses would be reduced

[Sunshine!]

It would be more like 1/4 similar mark fortress hitpoints at most, with far fewer shots, damage per shot, and range.

I was intentionally going for that kind of power to reduce the number of times players will actually have to rebuild, but to allow for enough incentive in building things for there to be a significant associated penalty in losing a command station.

I'm not sure how much it would slow down the early game if we're talking 5 minute build time for mk1.  That would be 20k metal/crystal per minute, ~333 per second which, okay, may be a bit much drain per second, but the numbers can be fiddled with to make them more okay.  From what I've seen in player reports though, most players are not taking any planets in the first 10 minutes of the game (destroying, maybe, but taking?), and if they play like X they're taking 1 planet every 40 mins or so.  That's completely doable, I think.

An alternative, though one that wouldn't really fix the main issue being discussed here (how to reduce the number of times one has to build command stations) would be to leave mk1 as is (cheap, throwaway command station) and have an exponential type increase in power.  Not a solution that I think would be desirable though.

Increasing cost to build for every additional command station would end up being ridiculous if command stations are still being lost at the same rate, because it'll run players out of resources extremely quickly.  Again, I think the point of this discussion is "how to make it so we don't have to rebuild command stations manually so often."  Automation is one way (which I don't think will happen), and making it so command stations don't have to be replaced as often is another.  The numbers can, of course, be fiddled with if I've taken the idea too far in both directions.  Straight up penalizing players for rebuilding command stations too often will end up driving players away though.

Edit: Thoughts on command station weapons
Military: Leave as translocate, but boost number of shots(probably not) or damage(would need to be a very large boost to make it noticeable, though a mk3 military wouldn't necessarily need to be under a forcefield if it had the 15 million hitpoints suggested by 1/4 fortress mk3 health)

Logistics: 1x/2x/3x spider-style shots (depending on mk level).  Sticks with the theme of slowing enemy ships down/causing mobility problems, and won't be so ridiculous that it's disabling entire fleets super quickly.

Economy: Large number of short range (7000 or less), low damage armor rotting shots.  Makes it clear that economy station is not there to deal damage, but it can provide a minor bonus to friendly ships operating on the same planet.

All of these shot types follow under the idea that they should be useful even while a command station is under a forcefield, which means that pure damage will never be useful.  The economy station defensive guns in particular are a last ditch defensive measure, since they can't really do anything by themselves.  In addition, with only one command station per planet, there shouldn't be too much of a problem with any of these weaponry changes making them overpowered.

Edit2: Command station health could run as something like:

Military = 1/4 same mark fortress.  Mk1 = 5 million, mk2 = 10 million (?), mk3 = 15 million (assuming I'm correct in remembering fortresses have 20/40/60 million hp each).

Logistics: 1/2 military station health.

Economy: 1/5 military station health.

Econ will still be relatively easy to kill, but military will require a concerted bomber assault.

[Shrugging Khan]

I like the idea, but that would require a lot of rebalancing and testing that I strongly doubt the X-man is willing to do at the time...or at all, if we're unlucky.

[BobTheJanitor]

I also like this as an alternative. Right now a command station is just that thing you have to get planted so you can start harvesting resources and really utilizing the planet. If it's perceived as an annoyance that blows up and has to be replaced often (which this thread wouldn't exist without that perception) then maybe trying to fix it from the other direction is the right way to go. I do foresee a lot of balancing needed to make it possible to still take planets in the early game though. If every comm station cost 500k m/c then we'd have a real problem.

[Shrugging Khan]

That's what mk Levels are for.

Make them scale a little more steeply, with the mkI versions not TOO tough. And increase the caps on the higher ones. Then implement the suggestion.