Author Topic: Prerelease/Expans 2.001ZA (2 New Mines, Remains Rebuilder, Cleanup Drone, Perf+)  (Read 10924 times)

Offline x4000

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Note:  This prerelease is intended for both customers of the expansion AND customers of the base game.  Please see below for details.

The latest prerelease is available at http://www.arcengames.com/share/AIWar2001ZA.zip

That version is an upgrade from version 2.000, so you have to already have 2.000 (or greater) installed. Just unzip it into your game folder (usually C:\Program Files\Arcen Games\AI War\ unless you specified something else). Please make sure that your unzip process keeps the folder structure from the zip file, rather than just unpacking all of the files into the base target directory.

Expansion F.A.Q. Answers:
1. If you have the base game, and install this, you will go into trial mode of the expansion.  Feel free to explore the expansion that way, but if you want to go back to full mode without buying the expansion, simply go into Settings, Expansions, and turn off the expansion.
2. All upcoming prereleases for the next few months (until the expansion fully releases) will have a mix of both expansion and non-expansion content.  If you just want the latest non-expansion content, see #1.
3. If you want to preorder the expansion (and get your full license key), see this page.  It's $9.99 USD (or equivalent), and requires a valid copy of the base game to play.
4. If you want to know all about the expansion in general, see that same page.
5. PLEASE NOTE:  The new ships for the expansion are extremely preliminary at this stage.  They are fully functional when added, but they are not well balanced at all just yet.  The balance takes time, playtesting, and a fuller view of more of the ships.  So certain expansion ships are currently underpowered, while others are overpowered.  Your feedback on this is extremely valuable, as this is something we are adjusting at present based on community feedback as well as our own testing, but we don't expect to have things even close to perfectly tuned until sometime in December.  Our first priority is to get everything working and implemented, while honing the balance as much as possible, then to really heavily polish the balance once all the ships are in place.  Just FYI!
6. If you want to update an old savegame to the expansion, simply type "cmd:activate expansion 1" (without quotes).  This includes enabling the expansion ship classes, as well as enabling golems and other new capturables, although the population of those capturables is likely to be different from what it would have been if the expansion had been turned on from the start of the campaign given the same seed and other settings.  There is no way to disable the expansion for an existing game, however, so be sure not to save over your existing file if you want to go back to the non-expansion version of the game.

Steam/Impulse/GamersGate/Direct2Drive/etc F.A.Q. Answers:
1. This prerelease version is compatible with any other version of the game -- Steam, Impulse, whatever.
2. If you use this with your Steam copy of the game, however, you will be asked to enter your AI War CD key (which Steam provides, but normally you do not have to enter), and also the integration with Steamworks leaderboards and achievements may be disabled.  So you may want to make a separate install of the preorder version if you use Steam, at least for the moment.
3. If you have preordered through Impulse, you should now have access to your beta key (as of 12/9).  They also provide direct beta downloads through their Impulse Client.
4. Steam will carry the expansion later on, and will have (probably beta-less) preorders, but they don't yet have that online.
5. GamersGate is also currently offering the expansion on preorder, and you do get a beta key, but you'll have to download the beta versions from our forums here.
6. Direct2Drive will be offering the expansion on preorder in a manner very similar to GamersGate, but they are not doing so quite yet.

What's new since 2.001Y:
(Cumulative release notes since 2.000 are attached at the bottom)

-------------------

-New expansion-only ship: EMP Mine.  Enemy ships coming too close to these invisible traps will incur heavy damage. If the ship triggering the mine survives, it will also be paralyzed for 60 seconds. The mine is also destroyed in the process. These are particularly useful for stalling out large incoming vesseles that don't have mine avoidance.

-New expansion-only ship: Area Mine.  Enemy ships coming too close to these invisible traps will incur heavy damage. The explosions from these mines also effect other enemy ships that are close by. The mine is also destroyed in the process. These are obviously useful for taking out groups of ships, but they are also useful for hitting ships that have Mine Avoidance -- those ships can still get caught in the blasts of area mines that are triggered by another ship.

-Some internal performance improvements have been made to the simulation logic in a variety of areas.

-Mine remains are now practically invincible to conventional attacks, since those were far too micromangement-intensive in the past to be a valid way to play.  Additionally, this prevents remains from accidentally being destroyed by area attacks or other means.

-New ship: Cleanup Drone.  Removes exploded enemy mines and turrets, to prevent them from being rebuilt by enemy mine/turret layers.  Previously this was accomplished with engineers (once those engineers had finished with anything else that they considered a higher priority, which caused some challenges), or via manual targeted.  Now, having a specialized unit dedicated to cleanup makes it much simpler to clear exploded enemy mines without any micromanagement.

-The following ships now drop remains on their destruction in the same manner that mines always have: advanced warp sensors, tachyon beam emitters and stealth tachyon beam emitters, and all turrets.  Consequently, all of these ship types are also now immune to reclamation.

-Mine Layers have been renamed to Remains Rebuilders, and now are a general purpose rebuilder for any ship types that leave remains.  They also now only will rebuild ships that were owned by the player who controls the rebuilder, rather than also working on allied ships.  These have been moved to the Economy tab, instead of the Defensive tab, along with Cleanup Drones.

-Remains Rebuilders now have cloaking, making them easier for players to keep alive (and more devious for when the AI has them, incidentally).  They also now have 100k more health.  They also no longer require unlocking, and thus no longer have any associated knowledge cost now that they are more of a general-purpose ship.  Their ship cap has also been raised about 3x.

-Ship Remains that belong to AI players, but which are not on AI planets, now automatically explode -- thus saving players the trouble of creating cleanup drones to clean them up manually.

-Previously it was possible for Remains Rebuilders to send a player into negative energy through their rebuilding.  In recent prereleases, they were also doing their rebuilding for free.  All fixed, and now they are not instantly rebuilt, either, but rather are kicked off so that they then construct themselves over time for an ongoing resource cost as with every other aspect of the new economy.  For the first time ever, this also applies to the AI when it is rebuilding ships -- thus the AI Remains Rebuilders are not nearly so threatening as mine builders used to be, since they can't just instantly respawn large numbers of ships.

-Previously, large numbers of mines and remains (as in, 50,000+) in the game could cause significant slowdown.  This has now been fixed so that they cause almost no performance impact whatsoever, except right after the game is loaded (since there are extra messages being sent to the AI, and the save files themselves are larger).

-Ships that are self-building are no longer cloaked while under construction (if they have the cloaking ability, previously that would be engaged while they were still under construction, which was erroneous).

Changes from prior prereleases.
------------------------------

-In the last prerelease, the niche text overlays for ship icons were showing incorrectly offset to the side.

-In 2.001 prereleases, there have been a number of internal math errors that affected the precision of collisions for things such as mines.  These are now fixed, which makes mines vastly more likely to be triggered than they were in recent prereleases.


Updates in 2.001Z:

-Since remains and their cleanup and rebuilding are now so important, when Cloaking is disabled in the lobby options here is now a non-cloaked version of the Remains Rebuilder that players and AIs will use, and a non-cloaked version of the Cleanup Drone that players can use.

-All ships that are immune to reclamation now have a strong attack penalty against the Raid Starship line, and Parasites.

-The movement speed of all parasites has been nearly doubled.

-EMPs and Area Mines now cost 4k knowledge instead of 3k as in the past prerelease.

Updates in 2.001ZA:

-Infiltrators no longer absorb dark matter (and that ability has now been entirely removed as redudnant with the counter-dark-matter flares).

-When lasers are fired into the area around a deflector drone, their power is now reduced to 1/4 of normal, but otherwise they are no longer redirected or absorbed or anything of that nature.  That also means that deflector drones are no longer immune to lasers, though they are quite resistant to them.

-Several bugs from the last prerelease have been fixed relating to remains.

-Fixed a multiplayer desync bug from the last prerelease.
« Last Edit: December 20, 2009, 04:15:19 pm by x4000 »
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Offline eRe4s3r

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Mhh, did we just go from 2.001Y to 2.001B ?  ??? ;D (i must have confused you with bumping an really old prerelease topic up again...

i am loving all those new capturables ;) Hope i am not annoying you too much x4000 when i am going to use AI War for my "alternate" sprite tests for a little while longer ;p
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Offline Velox

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     This is an awesome update - very happy with the remains changes and the cleanup drone!

Offline quickstix

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I like these changes. The Cleanup and Rebuilder units are a great idea, along with the new remains system.

Those new mines look positively dangerous. Good thing I've learned my lesson about minefields, because it would suck to find out the hard way with these new ones (especially Starships and the new EMP mines). Still brings a smile to my face when an AI fleet flies into one. :D

Offline I-KP

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Yet another incremental bundle of joy.
 :D
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Offline Fiskbit

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Quote
-The following ships now drop remains on their destruction in the same manner that mines always have: advanced warp sensors, tachyon beam emitters and stealth tachyon beam emitters, and all turrets.  Consequently, all of these ship types are also now immune to reclamation.

Turrets being immune to reclamation seems like a problem to me. In particular, with the Raid starship line now only being useful against turrets because of their massive penalty against non-turret ships, Leech Starships are now worthless. They can't kill enemy ships at any reasonable rate, so they can't capture those ships, and they can't capture turrets anymore (which I found to be a fantastic way to defend wormholes against the additional ships that were later warped in). This makes their reclamation ability basically worthless unless paired with a fleet that can actually damage enemy ships, and thus essentially removes the only definite way to have reclamation in a game unless you chose parasites as your starter. Even paired with a fleet, though, the amount of damage they get in is so low that unless paired with a mobile repair station, those ships are going to die immediately, anyway (and that's more knowledge down the drain if you didn't intend to get a MRS).

Perhaps making leech starships not be part of the raid line is the solution, since then they could actually be able to reclaim enemy ships and would have a purpose. These used to be my favorite ships in the game, but at this point I'm struggling to think up a scenario in which they'd be anywhere near the knowledge cost.

Talking with this about Rev, we realized that the Raid line doesn't even have much of a use anymore. They can't fight, so they should be able to get in, do a job, and get out, but they can't do worthwhile damage to warp gates nor command stations, so what, then? They can do decently against turrets, but doing a turret raid is worthless because the AI will just bring in more later; that's not worth the resources nor construction time. These ships should be incredibly powerful against important targets -- command stations, data centers, warp gates, attritioners, planetary cloakers, ion cannons, and similar. Likely not the greatest health around, though, so you can't just set it and forget it; a raid, then, would be clearing out the wormhole with standard ships and then guiding your starship to its target, where it might get close enough to take a shot, but won't necessarily do that or get away. *shrugs* There are a lot of ways this can go, but right now, it's not quite right. I'm going to go to bed now, but will give this more thought tomorrow. Right now, I recommend leeches no longer being in the raid line and losing their weakness against non-turrets, and the raid line having lower health, but high bonuses against important targets. That may change with more testing and thought, but I like the sounds of it right now. :)
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Offline keith.lamothe

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The new killer mines and the massive broadening of the rebuilding role sound great :)

Does sound like the Raid line is in a bit of a mid-life crisis, but I'm sure a couple good adjustments will set that to rights.
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Offline x4000

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Mhh, did we just go from 2.001Y to 2.001B ?  ??? ;D (i must have confused you with bumping an really old prerelease topic up again...

Whoops, my mistake.  Was more a factor of my being up at 5am than anything else. :)

i am loving all those new capturables ;) Hope i am not annoying you too much x4000 when i am going to use AI War for my "alternate" sprite tests for a little while longer ;p

Glad you're all enjoying the new capturables!  And, no problems on the alternate sprite tests.
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Offline FFLaguna

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I think you should TRIPLE the number of allowable "normal mines"... maybe even increase it more. You can only lightly mine three systems, or moderately mine one system, before you completely run out of normal mines. It's frustrating when you can basically only choose one system to defend with mines.

Offline x4000

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For the Raid Starship line, I definitely have no intention of splitting out the Leech variants -- it's too good a fit there.  Rather, I'd prefer to reconceptualize raid starships in a way that makes more sense for the entire line.  For the time being, what I'm doing in version Z is this:

-All ships that are immune to reclamation now have a strong attack penalty against the Raid Starship line, and Parasites.

This should allow for both parasites and raid starships to operate with more safety around turrets as well as large heavy-defense type ships.  In other words, it will make them better at raiding in general, and should increase their survivability.  The penalty is around 1/5, so turrets can still take them town, but it takes 5x more effort to do so.

Hopefully those changes (plus a few others in Y) will make parasites and the raid line more popular again, since they are both fun and have been popular in the past, without them being ridiculously overpowered as they once were.
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Offline x4000

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The latest prerelease is available at http://www.arcengames.com/share/AIWar2001Z.zip

Updates in 2.001Z:

-Since remains and their cleanup and rebuilding are now so important, when Cloaking is disabled in the lobby options here is now a non-cloaked version of the Remains Rebuilder that players and AIs will use, and a non-cloaked version of the Cleanup Drone that players can use.

-All ships that are immune to reclamation now have a strong attack penalty against the Raid Starship line, and Parasites.

-The movement speed of all parasites has been nearly doubled.

-EMPs and Area Mines now cost 4k knowledge instead of 3k as in the past prerelease.
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Offline x4000

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I think you should TRIPLE the number of allowable "normal mines"... maybe even increase it more. You can only lightly mine three systems, or moderately mine one system, before you completely run out of normal mines. It's frustrating when you can basically only choose one system to defend with mines.

To be honest, with all the new mines in the game, I was almost thinking of reducing the cap on all of them.  The scenario you describe above is entirely by design -- having too many minefields is quite overpowerful.  I already increased the number of mines 5x from what they had been in the past in recent times.

If you mine strategically, you can protect many more systems than you are suggesting there.  Simply put mines in a filled-in V pattern on the side of each wormhole that has stuff the AI will want to run at; if you surround the wormhole with mines, most likely all of the ones on the back sides (the sides where the AI is not going to travel) are simply wasted.

I won't reduce the number of basic mines, but I have concerns about the new mines being too overpowered rather than too weak, and that's an extension about my feeling with the mines in general.
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Offline Revenantus

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-All ships that are immune to reclamation now have a strong attack penalty against the Raid Starship line, and Parasites.

This should allow for both parasites and raid starships to operate with more safety around turrets as well as large heavy-defense type ships.  In other words, it will make them better at raiding in general, and should increase their survivability.  The penalty is around 1/5, so turrets can still take them town, but it takes 5x more effort to do so.

You've lumped raid starships in with reclamation units there, and given them the same bonuses, despite the fact that they don't have the same relationship with units that are immune to reclamation, hence I think the role is the raid starship is becoming somewhat blurred.

Considering the raid starship as a single unit, and ignoring the rest of the raid line for the moment, it only excels (soon even more so, it seems) at the destruction of turrets. Clearing turrets is of no direct benefit however, so this is only useful as a supporting action. I may well use the raid starship for that purpose, certainly. No starships in the raid line excel at fighting mobile military ships of any kind. So;

1. The raid starship has a primary role of clearing turrets in preparation for an assault.
2. The raid starship has a secondary role of fleet support, inflicting additional damage, but is trumped by the fleet line in this role because of their superior firepower and munitions boosting ability.

Now, moving up to the leech starship;

1. It can also clear turrets, but switches to shell type ammo.
2. It functions far better as a fleet support unit because it inflicts damage, but also (significantly, giving a reason to use these over the fleet line) reclaims some units during battle.

This is conceptually inconsistent because the only purpose they share involves using a, supposedly, different weapon to perform the same task (1). So, my thinking is;

The raid starship only has any similarities with the leech starship because the share the same line, and hence has been given the same bonuses. There is nothing in their appearance, description, or weapon type setup that ties them together. My suggestion is therefore to split the raid starships out from the leech line, and to start a new raid line with different bonuses. I think this is a cleaner solution than trying to reconceptualize the raid starship because reclamation is such a significant ability, and the change in ammo type is conspicuous.

The lines can then be distinct by allowing the raid starships to retain their turret clearing, somewhat more independent role, perhaps upgrading them to make them slightly better against targets such as warp gates and data centers. Leech starships can drop their turret clearing ability and move further into the largely fleet orientated role they have anyway.

The slight loss of generality would be countered by the fact that the player could choose to immediately unlock the leech starship without having to go through the raid starship.




Offline FFLaguna

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When will the "absorption targeting" behavior be fixed? I wish ships would attack my manual targets instead of ALWAYS being drawn to the ONE laser deflector unit that only has 2,500... it makes my Raider units 100% useless as anything other than a normal fighter. :( It was my understand that their behavior would be changed due to consensus. In my current game, I've been using Raiders to pull of gate raids, but after I moved past my initial few planets, EVERY system has at least some of these laser deflector units, making raids done by Raiders 100% impossible. The Raiders just attack the laser deflector (causing no damage) until I order them to retreat or they die. They ignore my manual targeting.

Thanks, x4000!!

Also, about the mines... I used up basically all my mines protecting my Zenith Power Generator thingy. All the wormholes are in one 45-degree arc from the Z generator, and I put all the mines there in a fan shape... and then I ran out. Also, how can I tell how much damage mines do? The description just says "heavy damage". :)

Offline FFLaguna

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Also, about the mines... I used up basically all my mines protecting my Zenith Power Generator thingy. All the wormholes are in one 45-degree arc from the Z generator, and I put all the mines there in a fan shape... and then I ran out. Also, how can I tell how much damage mines do? The description just says "heavy damage". :)

Since you helped me change AI type, I had a massive cross-planet attack, and the security of this system was tested for the first time (Z generator is worth a LOT of mineral/metal per second). The enemy did not breach to the minefield, so I don't know how it will work yet. Also, if you take out all the warp gates, then there is no penalty for holding the Z generator. I imagine Golems suffer from the same issue (capturing one is my next SHORT-term goal :D) Anyway, here's the picture: