New stuff on the wiki

[Bognor]

I'm sure Diazo will believe you about the Plasma Sieges Modules without demanding a save

Initially I'd made a single compatibility table for both champion and mod fort modules on the Ships and Structures page, which you can see in this old version.  But there were so many niggling differences between the two systems I decided combining wasn't worth the confusion.  I guess there's no reason we couldn't just have two separate (though quite similar) tables. 

[Diazo]

@Bognor: I copy pasted your stuff from the Ships and Structures page and then made a few tweaks, not sure how much that counts as duplication. I had intended to leave it as a summary kind of thing on the Ships and Structures page.

@Aeson: The Plamsa Siege Module does not fire on small ships? Odd, the Plasma Siege Starship is quite happy to fire on a lone fighter sitting all off by itself these days. I assume the module worked the same as I've never unlocked it. Will update.

Combine the compatiblity and module listing? Hmmm. Sounds reasonable, I'll check it out, no promises.

Linking the name to the module stats should be possible, I'll have to check the help files.

D.

edit: How about that, the new large modules table? Did not do small modules yet.

[Aeson]

The new large modules table looks good to me. The reason that I suggested that something like that be done is that the module listing and the tables essentially repeated the same information, except that the tables lacked module descriptions but had sorting options.

As for the plasma siege modules, I only checked against Missile Frigates, but I can't think of any reason why they wouldn't fire on Missile Frigates other than an inability to fire on small targets. I had a pre-built Spire Modular Fortress with three plasma siege modules and 8 laser cannon modules sitting on the entry wormhole, with no other active defenses in system, but I never saw the siege modules fire, nor did I see the lightning bursts that other plasma siege cannon-type weapons cause when they hit a target.

[Diazo]

I'm assuming it was a tweak that did not carry over.

Originally all Plasma Siege weaponry could not fire on small targets, including Plasma Siege Starships.

Then there was a balance pass to all starships a bit ago and Plasma Siege Starships could fire on small ships. (Or about the same time? Might not have been the same patch.)

That change did not carry over to the Plasma Siege Modules I guess. Not a big deal, the fort modules will engage large targets a lot more often then the Starships so I dont' think it is a big deal.

D.

[Bognor]

Plasma Siege Starships could target small ships since 5.024, long before the first beta of Ancient Shadows in 5.052.  So I'd be surprised if this was unintentional, unless these modules were drafted long before the Ancient Shadows beta.

[Aeson]

True, but I suspect that the Plasma Siege Cannon for champions and modular fortresses is based on the Fallen Spire Plasma Siege Cannon, which also does not fire on small vessels (tested the Mark I Spire Cruiser-mounted version against a combined group of about Bombers, Missile Frigates, Zenith Paralyzers, and maybe a few other things; I don't have a current game with higher-mark plasma siege cannons to play with, but I suspect they have the same limitations). Since Fallen Spire games have plenty of big things for a weapon like this to shoot at, it isn't really a weakness for the Fallen Spire version. For the champion and modular fortress, it makes the Plasma Siege Cannon a bit more of a specialist weapon. And the Fallen Spire version of the Plasma Siege Cannon is old enough to have been based on the pre-5.024 version of the Plasma Siege Starship.

So yes, I'd say that this particular module was drafted long before the first beta of Ancient Shadows came out. The hull bonuses, attack range, and ammunition types are identical, and the reload speed is the same for Spire Cities, Spire Cruisers, and Champions; the only difference between the modules is the base damage (the Spire Cruiser Plasma Siege Module Mark I is equivalent to a Mark V champion version, and slightly worse than a Mark I Modular Fortress version, if normal mark scaling is used for champions) and the cost, and the Modular Fortress version fires four times more quickly. All of them even have the relatively useless 10X bonus to turret hulls (currently useless for the player, anyways; not something I want in the AI's hands).

[keith.lamothe]

All of them even have the relatively useless 10X bonus to turret hulls (currently useless for the player, anyways; not something I want in the AI's hands).

Say it with me now: Nemesis

Edit: and the Heroic AI.  And the Fortress King, actually.

[Aeson]

Do the Nemesis, the Heroic AI, and the Fortress King AI have turret-type hulls somewhere (other than modules)? Or did modules become vulnerable to destruction independently of the ship again?

Otherwise I stand by my comment that the turret bonus is useless for the player. Certainly a bonus against turrets is good for the AI if the ship with it is used in an attack or if the player builds a beachhead, but I don't know of anything in AI hands that has a turret hull aside from a few modules.

Edit: One more thing - while looking at the wiki to check and see if the Fortress Baron and Heroic AIs received a special bonus that had turret hulls, I noticed that there is a grammatical error on the AI Opponent Types page.

"AI-types below this line are red in-game to represent that they are considered more difficult then the Harder AI types"

In the above sentence, "then" should be "than". This sentence is found near the bottom of the AI types table, just above the description for the Crafty Spire AI.

[keith.lamothe]

Do the Nemesis, the Heroic AI, and the Fortress King AI have turret-type hulls somewhere (other than modules)?

No, but they can mount the plasma siege cannon modules

[Bognor]

I noticed that there is a grammatical error on the AI Opponent Types page.

Fixed.

[Diazo]

Okay.

Feedback is requested on the AstroTrains page: http://arcengames.com/mediawiki/index.php?title=Astrotrain

I'm doubling up some but I wanted a description section at the top and then a stats section below.

Thoughts?


Also have the Economic Structures Section updated.

D.

[Vyndicu]

I don't meant to derail the topic a bit. I saw a bit piece that was interesting and most likely outdated.

At this link: http://arcengames.com/mediawiki/index.php?title=AI_War_Expansion_2:_Children_of_Neinzul

I noticed this particular bit "Neinzul Youngling Mimic (I-IV and Core variants)". I have been playing with all 4 expansion enabled. I can't seem to find anything on it. Has it been removed or something? If true, then you might want to edit that part to reflect the obsolete nature of the unit.

Also keep up the good work on the wiki.

[Aeson]

The description for the Tachyon Train should say either "provides planetary tachyon coverage" or "provides planet-wide tachyon coverage" instead of "provides planetary-wide tachyon coverage".

If certain trains only show up above a certain intensity, I would want this noted somewhere. The list is here: http://www.arcengames.com/forums/index.php/topic,11977.15.html - see reply #25 by Keith.

Maybe mention that killing a Nuclear Train doesn't trigger planet destruction.

The Speed Booster train has a quotation mark instead of a colon in the Train Types section.

[Dichotomy]

The speed booster train has the regen train description.

[Diazo]

@Aeson: Tachyon changed to "planet-wide" and note about nuke's not going off when killed added. Also added the intensity, although that may need to be displayed differently.

@Dichotomy: Description fixed. Note made that I'm not sure on exact mechanics of the speed boost.

@Keith: There is an "Anti-Supply" astrotrain in that previous post of yours Aeson linked to, but I don't see that in game anywhere? Removed unit?

@Vyndicu: Odd. I can not remember a unit named the Mimic in the game ever and nothing in the patch notes about it. I've pulled it off the page for now.

D.