Map generation weirdness

[Vinraith]

Is this... supposed to happen? This is an 80 planet map, but 25 of the worlds on the map are behind one of the AI homeworlds.

 

[vigilo confido]

Maybe I am blind but I see only one AI homeworld.

[Vinraith]

Maybe I am blind but I see only one AI homeworld.

Yes, and only 55 worlds in front of it. The others are behind it (note the only unexplored wormhole on the map), I can't get past it to get to them...

[Coppermantis]

Maybe I am blind but I see only one AI homeworld.

Looks like he's got the setting on where the map only shows planets you've been to.

[Vinraith]

Maybe I am blind but I see only one AI homeworld.

Looks like he's got the setting on where the map only shows planets you've been to.

Ah, now I understand the confusion. It's been so long since I played with the map revealed I forgot that was a thing.

[keith.lamothe]

Mapgen places the first AI HW as far from your starting planets as possible.  It then places the second AI HW so as to maximize its distance from both your starting planets AND the first AI HW.  It makes no attempt to have this second choice not cut the graph

[Toranth]

Mapgen places the first AI HW as far from your starting planets as possible.  It then places the second AI HW so as to maximize its distance from both your starting planets AND the first AI HW.  It makes no attempt to have this second choice not cut the graph

Does the AI always use a specific player slot in determining the mapgen?  I ask because in this case, the visible AI Homeworld is 9 hops from the Purple human homeworld.  The planet way off in the upper right is also 9 hops away from the purple homeworld, and a lot farther from the other unseen AI Homeworld.
But the planet in the upper right is also only 9 hops from the Blue human homeworld, while the current AI location is 10 hops away.

It looks like the mapgen decided to use the Blue player's position in placing stuff, and didn't include the Purple player's homeworld in that computation.

[keith.lamothe]

Iirc it has a small amount of wiggle room in that it doesn't necessarily have to pick a spot the maximum distance away from the first AI HW but can instead pick a spot 1 hop closer or something like that.  If it tries to be too strict the positioning gets very predictable.

[Vinraith]

Mapgen places the first AI HW as far from your starting planets as possible.  It then places the second AI HW so as to maximize its distance from both your starting planets AND the first AI HW.  It makes no attempt to have this second choice not cut the graph

Fair enough, I'd just never seen that before. In this particular case that first AI homeworld has a Core Raid and a Core CPA, so there's clearly no getting past it without bringing down the core shields first. There are 4 ARS's on our side of that homeworld, so that's doable, but if there weren't I don't think the game would be playable at all.

[keith.lamothe]

You could do a transport run (probably assault transports) through the first HW and colonize a planet on the other side (probably 3 hops from the HW, to avoid alerting a core permanently).

[Vinraith]

You could do a transport run (probably assault transports) through the first HW and colonize a planet on the other side (probably 3 hops from the HW, to avoid alerting a core permanently).

Yes, but then you'd have to somehow survive the core raid and core CPA that were triggered by the hop.

I suppose it's not impossible, but it'd certainly raise the difficulty very, very sharply due to an incredibly bad map draw. That's the nature of random, of course, but I'm quite certain I'd go generate a new map seed rather than play the rest of a game on those terms. It's just not the kind of "harder" I want .

[keith.lamothe]

Yes, but then you'd have to somehow survive the core raid and core CPA that were triggered by the hop.

I'm quite confident in your ability to cheese any one set of attacks

[Vinraith]

Yes, but then you'd have to somehow survive the core raid and core CPA that were triggered by the hop.

I'm quite confident in your ability to cheese any one set of attacks

I'm not.

[keith.lamothe]

Yes, but then you'd have to somehow survive the core raid and core CPA that were triggered by the hop.

I'm quite confident in your ability to cheese any one set of attacks

I'm not.

Come then, and consult the Cheesemasters.  You'll be neutralizing 2000-MkIV-Bomber waves with a single damaged Riot Starship and some grav turrets, mines, and shoestring you found at a thrift store in no time.

[vigilo confido]

My best guess is to raid the taychon scanner on the wormhole you enter the AI homeworld in. Then you retreat, build as many stealth transports as possible, power them down so they do not fire, and then bring them next to key structures on the AI homeworld you need to kill. This should allow you to weaken the homeworld and escape with minimal losses. Also, the CPA guardpost can not generate ships from thin air; it needs ships from the planets and strategic reserve. I recommend doing that last.