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Author Topic: Impossible and cool Dual AI combos  (Read 6108 times)

Offline Kahuna

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Impossible and cool Dual AI combos
« on: May 30, 2013, 08:02:38 am »
This is going to be a list of impossible and cool AI combos. Now that we have the Dual AI system we can basically take the difficulty.. and double it (lululul). This Dual AI system is the definition of awesomeness.

Before Vengeance of the Machine AI1: Raid Engine / AI2: One-Way Doormaster was probably the hardest combo.. now.. you can put both of those in one AI.

I'd like to know what's the highest difficulty these combos can be defeated on.
Impossible combos:
AI1: Raid Engine/One-way Doormaster / AI2: Alarmist/Special Forces Captain
AI1: Zenith Descendant/Speed Racer / AI2: Thief/The Core
AI1: Everything/The Core / AI2: Technologist Homeworlder/Scorched Earth
AI1: Mad Bomer/Backdoor Hacker / AI2: Extreme Raider/Warp Jumper
AI1: Spire Hammer/The Core / AI2: Raid Engine/Shadow Master
AI1: Starfleet Commander/Technologist Parasite / AI2: Peacemaker/Grav Driller
AI1: Speed Racer/Vengeful / AI2: Alarmist/Retaliatory
AI1: Neinzul Youngster/Technologist Turtle / AI2: Artillerist/Special Forces Captain
AI1: / / AI2: /

Hard and cool but (probably) not impossible combos:
AI1: The Tank/Shield Ninny / AI2: The Tank/Shield Ninny
AI1: Experimentalist/Support Corps / AI2: Experimentalist/Support Corps

Leave your impossible and cool combos below.
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Offline keith.lamothe

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Re: Impossible and cool Dual AI combos
« Reply #1 on: May 30, 2013, 08:27:50 am »
Glad you're enjoying this :)

It's cheesy, but I think even with single-type AIs a 2xScorched-earth game on single-HW and diff 7 or higher is going to be unwinnable in most setups (I'm sure you could work out some map where it would work, but it would practically need to be purpose-built).

So ViciousExotic/ScorchedEarth // Heroic/ScorchedEarth would probably be... pretty nasty.
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Offline Kahuna

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Re: Impossible and cool Dual AI combos
« Reply #2 on: May 30, 2013, 09:13:17 am »
Quote from: keith.lamothe on May 30, 2013, 08:27:50 am
Glad you're enjoying this :)

It's cheesy, but I think even with single-type AIs a 2xScorched-earth game on single-HW and diff 7 or higher is going to be unwinnable in most setups (I'm sure you could work out some map where it would work, but it would practically need to be purpose-built).

So ViciousExotic/ScorchedEarth // Heroic/ScorchedEarth would probably be... pretty nasty.
Yep Scorched Earth is one of the nastiest AIs.. in fact it's much nastier than Crafty Spire which is a red AI :o
And about that Heroic^^ Heroic alone is like SpireHammer/TheCore.. or at least it was when I last tried it. Not sure if the AI Champions have been tuned down. The first AI Champion killed me (almost?) every time.. just like the.. big Spire ship.. thing.. when I tried SpireHammer/Technologist x.
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set /A diff=10
if %diff%==max (
   set /A me=:)
) else (
   set /A me=SadPanda
)
echo Check out my AI War strategy guide and find your inner Super Cat!
echo 2592 hours of AI War and counting!
echo Kahuna matata!

Offline TechSY730

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Re: Impossible and cool Dual AI combos
« Reply #3 on: May 30, 2013, 10:44:30 am »
Someone made a good point that the reason scorched earth isn't a red AI is because when there is only one of them, it isn't all that bad. However, if both of them are scorched earth, then it be becomes worse than even crafty spire, technologist, or "the core" AIs.

Also, has the "try to avoid repeated AI types" logic take into consideration the now up to two types per AI player?

Also, does having one of the types be "vanilla" basically act the same as if there was no secondary type?

Also,
Thief/Raid Engine

Golemite / Backdoor Hacker

Technologist Raider / The Core

Extreme Raider / Backdoor Hacker

Starfleet Commander / Spire Hammer

Backdoor Hacker / Exotic

EDIT:

Speed Racer / Artillerist

Tag Teamer / Artillerist

Starfleet Commander / Speed Racer

Neinzul Youngster / Mad Bomber

Extreme Raider / Warp Jumper

Golemite / Warp Jumper

Attritioner / One Way Door Master

EDIT2:

Fortress King / Shield Ninny

Fortress King / Technologist Turtle (or any turtle type really)

Thief / Speed Racer

Thief / Mine Enthusiast

One Way Door Master / Shadow Master
« Last Edit: May 30, 2013, 11:35:23 am by TechSY730 »
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Offline Vyndicu

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Re: Impossible and cool Dual AI combos
« Reply #4 on: May 30, 2013, 12:05:51 pm »
Quote from: TechSY730 on May 30, 2013, 10:44:30 am
Also, does having one of the types be "vanilla" basically act the same as if there was no secondary type?

I think that would not be true because with tank (no exo-wave recessive trait) combined with vanilla which does have exo-wave would result in a tank that can sent waves.
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Offline doomlord52

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Re: Impossible and cool Dual AI combos
« Reply #5 on: May 30, 2013, 03:38:50 pm »
I had serious problems with these two.
2x Raid Engine
Raid Engine + Fortress King

The first simply rushes you to oblivion and the 2nd makes expanding stupidly hard. It's possible, yes (managed the 2nd with a friend vs. 7.3 + 7.6). Note, neither of us are that good at the game...

Impossible:
Defense 15 minute, 10-20 planets, pretty much any AI level, 2x Raid Engine. Seriously it's not possible. 3 minutes in you get hit by 3,000 ships.
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Offline ZaneWolfe

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Re: Impossible and cool Dual AI combos
« Reply #6 on: May 30, 2013, 04:12:50 pm »
Quote from: Kahuna on May 30, 2013, 08:02:38 am
Now that we have the Dual AI system we can basically take the difficulty.. and double it (lululul). This Dual AI system is the definition of awesomeness.


So what you're saying is... The !Fun! has been doubled?


Yeah yeah I know. I couldn't help it.
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Offline Tridus

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Re: Impossible and cool Dual AI combos
« Reply #7 on: May 30, 2013, 04:27:04 pm »
Quote from: ZaneWolfe on May 30, 2013, 04:12:50 pm
So what you're saying is... The !Fun! has been doubled?


Yeah yeah I know. I couldn't help it.

Me neither. <_<
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Offline LaughingThesaurus

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Re: Impossible and cool Dual AI combos
« Reply #8 on: May 30, 2013, 04:35:57 pm »
I thought The Core/Everything would be hard, but it just leads to unfocused silly waves and defenses and stuff.
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Offline Coppermantis

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Re: Impossible and cool Dual AI combos
« Reply #9 on: May 30, 2013, 07:01:41 pm »
Does Spire Hammer+The Core lead to high-level Imperial Spire ships right at the start?
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Offline MaxAstro

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Re: Impossible and cool Dual AI combos
« Reply #10 on: May 30, 2013, 09:29:10 pm »
Bouncer/Vengeful seems nasty, because it's kinda hard to ~not~ kill the guard posts when you enter a planet.

But I don't think anything comes close to the nasty of Raid Engine/One-Way Doormaster.  o.O
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Offline Bognor

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Re: Impossible and cool Dual AI combos
« Reply #11 on: May 30, 2013, 11:45:02 pm »
Quote from: LaughingThesaurus on May 30, 2013, 04:35:57 pm
I thought The Core/Everything would be hard, but it just leads to unfocused silly waves and defenses and stuff.
What does that do?  I thought The Core was intrinsically an "Everything" type of AI, with access to all ships (at Mark V).
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Offline Coppermantis

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Re: Impossible and cool Dual AI combos
« Reply #12 on: May 30, 2013, 11:48:39 pm »
Quote from: Bognor on May 30, 2013, 11:45:02 pm
Quote from: LaughingThesaurus on May 30, 2013, 04:35:57 pm
I thought The Core/Everything would be hard, but it just leads to unfocused silly waves and defenses and stuff.
What does that do?  I thought The Core was intrinsically an "Everything" type of AI, with access to all ships (at Mark V).

The Core just gets the usual AI Stuff, just at Mk. V
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Offline LaughingThesaurus

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Re: Impossible and cool Dual AI combos
« Reply #13 on: May 31, 2013, 12:10:34 am »
All I remember is I sat around waiting for the AI to kill me but like... it didn't happen and any attacks I got were really underwhelming or had odd ships that I could easily counter. I think the Core also has this thing where it gets weaker waves because all the ships are Mark V, but I was kind of expecting to instantly lose.
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Offline MaxAstro

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Re: Impossible and cool Dual AI combos
« Reply #14 on: May 31, 2013, 02:15:40 am »
Honestly the Core has always been surprisingly kinda weak.  I always thought of it as the "final boss" AI, but testing has revealed it to be a pushover compared to the technologists.

IMO, the Core should get a serious power upgrade.  I want there to be a "AI type that is harder than all others, period", and Core seems the natural fit.
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