Author Topic: Golems not raising AI progress properly?  (Read 1920 times)

Offline Vinraith

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Golems not raising AI progress properly?
« on: July 30, 2010, 01:56:24 pm »
From the wiki:

Broken Black Widow Golem +1 AI Progress For Every 750,000 Health Repaired

I found one of these and have been repairing it, AI progress is not increasing at anything near the rate indicated. After about 10,000,000 health healed I believe I've seen the AI progress tick up by 1. I'm attaching a save file with the repairs in progress, the system in question is Aeyae in the upper right. I repaired a regenerator golem earlier in the same game and I don't think it was raising AI progress either, but I haven't got a convenient save and can't say for sure about that one.

I'm running the beta, version 3.1.7.2, with Zenith Remnant installed and active.

Offline x4000

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Re: Golems not raising AI progress properly?
« Reply #1 on: July 30, 2010, 01:57:29 pm »
The wiki is current as of the last official release, but in the latest betas golems don't cause any AI Progress changes by design.  It's in the release notes, but the wiki has not yet been updated because an official new version hasn't come out.  So, no worries, it's doing what it should be doing. :)
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Offline Vinraith

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Re: Golems not raising AI progress properly?
« Reply #2 on: July 30, 2010, 01:59:42 pm »
Sorry, I must have missed it in the release notes.  :-[

Doesn't that make golems insanely powerful with no drawbacks?  ??? I see that they've been limited in the patch notes to only be "front line" usable rather than deep raiders or deep defenders, but still... Don't get me wrong, I know you guys know how to balance your game far better than a newbie like me, I'm just trying to figure out the logic. :)
« Last Edit: July 30, 2010, 02:10:35 pm by Vinraith »

Offline Vinraith

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Re: Golems not raising AI progress properly?
« Reply #3 on: July 30, 2010, 03:12:23 pm »
I didn't see it in the patch notes (but I may have missed it), but is that "3X waves while humans hold" rule across the board, rather than restricted to the system the golem is in? If so I'm starting to get the picture...

Offline x4000

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Re: Golems not raising AI progress properly?
« Reply #4 on: July 30, 2010, 03:24:29 pm »
Check out the release notes, it explains the thinking in great detail -- there should also be some very long topics about that in this forum if you search for golems. They definitely aren't overpowered, if anything people are still somewhat thinking they are too expensive to be worth their time strategically.  But you are correct in that they don't come with permanent ongoing costs anymore (the AI Progress), which was a goal.  Almost no one used golems in the past, and this has been a continual reminiscing to get our risk-averse commanders to use them. ;)

The effects of the golem on waves, like the 3X waves, etc, are just on the planet they are on, not global.  The main drawback of the golems are that they are insanely expensive both to build and then to maintain.  For the equivalent firepower with convention ships, you could spend a lot less metal and crystal.  That actually is also by design at this stage, so that golems are not obvious go-to things to capture, but if you are already capped out on your regular fleets, etc, they make an excellent secondary investment (though some people still prefer mercenaries, it varies).
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Offline Vinraith

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Re: Golems not raising AI progress properly?
« Reply #5 on: July 30, 2010, 03:33:09 pm »
There are so many patch notes it's difficult to find what one's looking for (not that this is a bad thing, the level of support you're showing this game is outstanding :)) but I did finally locate the section in question. Yeah, with the increased waves, the instant and increased reinforcements, and the overwhelming expense I can see now that they're decidedly not overpowered. Essentially they're a strategic option, each filling a particular niche, and outside that niche you're probably better off spending the resources elsewhere.

Thanks for putting up with me on this, I just really liked the idea of something very powerful that freaked the AI out something awful, so on discovering that had been changed (sort of) I was momentarily disappointed and confused. I'm over it.  ;D

Offline x4000

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Re: Golems not raising AI progress properly?
« Reply #6 on: July 30, 2010, 03:37:16 pm »
All good! :)
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Offline Vinraith

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Re: Golems not raising AI progress properly?
« Reply #7 on: July 30, 2010, 04:06:14 pm »
While I'm asking stupid questions, the patch notes mention that engineers shouldn't be auto-repairing golems. Does FRD mode override that? I can't seem to keep my engineers off of the darn things...
« Last Edit: July 30, 2010, 04:18:11 pm by Vinraith »

Offline x4000

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Re: Golems not raising AI progress properly?
« Reply #8 on: July 30, 2010, 05:00:37 pm »
That's actually a known bug at the moment, it's on our fix-list.  Not sure why they started doing that. :)
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Offline Vinraith

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Re: Golems not raising AI progress properly?
« Reply #9 on: July 30, 2010, 05:11:55 pm »
Gotcha. If I want to keep them from coming online, does "powering them down" before they've gotten enough power to turn on in the first place work?

Offline x4000

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Re: Golems not raising AI progress properly?
« Reply #10 on: July 30, 2010, 05:23:32 pm »
I should, but I think that's part of what is not working at the moment.
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Offline Vinraith

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Re: Golems not raising AI progress properly?
« Reply #11 on: July 31, 2010, 05:27:21 pm »
One more question. If I have a golem in a system deep in my territory, does the "3X wave" rule cause stronger waves against my borders, or is it negated by the fact that the golem's not in an accessible system for waves?

Offline Fox Soul

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Re: Golems not raising AI progress properly?
« Reply #12 on: August 01, 2010, 03:19:22 am »
I've observed the golem making a planet with accessible waves making x3 ship count.
Then when the golem leaves on the next wave the ship count is reduced back to normal average.

Some have said that it still affects cross planet attacks, but I do not believe so.
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Offline x4000

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Re: Golems not raising AI progress properly?
« Reply #13 on: August 01, 2010, 09:09:42 am »
The 3x wave only affects the planet the golem is on. So it would never affect ANY planet the golem is not on, in any circumstances. Also, waves != cpas, so it doesn't affect those.
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Offline Vinraith

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Re: Golems not raising AI progress properly?
« Reply #14 on: August 01, 2010, 01:27:12 pm »
The 3x wave only affects the planet the golem is on. So it would never affect ANY planet the golem is not on, in any circumstances. Also, waves != cpas, so it doesn't affect those.

OK, so when not in use it's best to hide it in a non-border system and power it down. Good to know! :)