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Author Topic: Do harvester upgrades now dominate econ command stations?  (Read 19192 times)

Offline Martyn van Buren

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Re: Do harvester upgrades now dominate econ command stations?
« Reply #90 on: August 01, 2012, 12:33:08 pm »
It would be preposterously OP if the Mk III logistics station gave all human fleet ships teleportation, right?
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Offline chemical_art

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Re: Do harvester upgrades now dominate econ command stations?
« Reply #91 on: August 01, 2012, 12:44:31 pm »
Quote from: Martyn van Buren on August 01, 2012, 12:33:08 pm
It would be preposterously OP if the Mk III logistics station gave all human fleet ships teleportation, right?

It would completely nullify the zenith space time manipulator.
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Offline Martyn van Buren

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Re: Do harvester upgrades now dominate econ command stations?
« Reply #92 on: August 01, 2012, 12:45:24 pm »
Oh that is true and should not be done.
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Offline KDR_11k

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Re: Do harvester upgrades now dominate econ command stations?
« Reply #93 on: August 01, 2012, 02:03:56 pm »
Isn't the bigger problem Log II? Log III has the benefit of denying teleportation to the AI but Log II adds nothing to the logistics function of the station IIRC. So besides a small increase in resource output there's no real benefit to Mk II.
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Offline Martyn van Buren

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Re: Do harvester upgrades now dominate econ command stations?
« Reply #94 on: August 01, 2012, 02:09:24 pm »
Any reason logistics shouldn't just have only two marks?
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Offline TechSY730

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Re: Do harvester upgrades now dominate econ command stations?
« Reply #95 on: August 01, 2012, 03:11:30 pm »
Quote from: Martyn van Buren on August 01, 2012, 02:09:24 pm
Any reason logistics shouldn't just have only two marks?

Well, it would break the symmetry thing we have going among the three basic command station types.


I would like to see some sort of increased speed reduction of enemy units as the Mk goes up. Kieth, you mentioned how the "what is the max speed I can have considering outside effects?" code is in a performance crititical loop, but how hard would it be to change it from (speedSoFor >> 1) to something like (speedSoFar >> 1) - N or (speedSoFar - N) >> 1? (Where N is 0 in most cases, but for Mk. II and up logistics stations, it would be higher) This would introduce issues with underflow and speeds being put at 0, which may require additional bounds checks, which you might not be able to afford in that code path.

If this sort of thing would not work, how about giving logistics stations Mk. II and up a gravity effect? That would require some balancing to figure out what good ranges and magnitudes for those gravity effects would be though.
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Offline Wingflier

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Re: Do harvester upgrades now dominate econ command stations?
« Reply #96 on: August 01, 2012, 03:19:27 pm »
What if MKIIs stopped teleportation within a certain radius of themselves?  That's kind of a good compromise.
« Last Edit: August 01, 2012, 03:38:52 pm by Wingflier »
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Offline Kahuna

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Re: Do harvester upgrades now dominate econ command stations?
« Reply #97 on: August 01, 2012, 03:27:20 pm »
Quote from: TechSY730 on August 01, 2012, 03:11:30 pm
Quote from: Martyn van Buren on August 01, 2012, 02:09:24 pm
Any reason logistics shouldn't just have only two marks?

Well, it would break the symmetry thing we have going among the three basic command station types.


I would like to see some sort of increased speed reduction of enemy units as the Mk goes up. Kieth, you mentioned how the "what is the max speed I can have considering outside effects?" code is in a performance crititical loop, but how hard would it be to change it from (speedSoFor >> 1) to something like (speedSoFar >> 1) - N or (speedSoFar - N) >> 1? (Where N is 0 in most cases, but for Mk. II and up logistics stations, it would be higher) This would introduce issues with underflow and speeds being put at 0, which may require additional bounds checks, which you might not be able to afford in that code path.

If this sort of thing would not work, how about giving logistics stations Mk. II and up a gravity effect? That would require some balancing to figure out what good ranges and magnitudes for those gravity effects would be though.
MarkI = Gravitional Turret with MarkII Military Stations range
MarkII = Logistics Command Station atm
MarkIII = GravDrill without movement speed penalty for friendly ships AND WITH a big movement speed boost for friendly ships
BOOM! Problem solved!
« Last Edit: August 01, 2012, 03:47:37 pm by Kahuna »
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Offline Wingflier

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Re: Do harvester upgrades now dominate econ command stations?
« Reply #98 on: August 01, 2012, 03:36:29 pm »
That would make MK3s way too powerful.  It would be impossible for the AI to ever assault your planet successfully.
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Offline Martyn van Buren

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Re: Do harvester upgrades now dominate econ command stations?
« Reply #99 on: August 01, 2012, 03:46:41 pm »
I am definitely against nerfing the current Mk I; it is in step with the other kinds for usefulness
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Offline PokerChen

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Re: Do harvester upgrades now dominate econ command stations?
« Reply #100 on: August 02, 2012, 02:03:39 am »
If the economic command station is named the logistics command station, I would suggest giving it a supply range of 2 planets instead of the usual 1 planet. Then the current logistics station can be named zenith ST station. :P
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Offline Coppermantis

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Re: Do harvester upgrades now dominate econ command stations?
« Reply #101 on: August 02, 2012, 02:18:41 am »
Quote from: zharmad on August 02, 2012, 02:03:39 am
If the economic command station is named the logistics command station, I would suggest giving it a supply range of 2 planets instead of the usual 1 planet. Then the current logistics station can be named zenith ST station. :P

That's actually a very interesting idea. Giving one of the command stations an increased supply reach would be a feature I would support.
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Offline Kahuna

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Re: Do harvester upgrades now dominate econ command stations?
« Reply #102 on: August 02, 2012, 02:58:09 am »
Quote from: zharmad on August 02, 2012, 02:03:39 am
If the economic command station is named the logistics command station, I would suggest giving it a supply range of 2 planets instead of the usual 1 planet.
Yay! My turrets would work even if the CS gets destroyed! I like this idea.
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Offline PokerChen

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Re: Do harvester upgrades now dominate econ command stations?
« Reply #103 on: August 02, 2012, 08:10:17 am »
A mantis issue has been created correspondiong to this increased supply radius idea. :D
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Offline KDR_11k

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Re: Do harvester upgrades now dominate econ command stations?
« Reply #104 on: August 02, 2012, 04:16:30 pm »
How about letting the MkII logistics block a wormhole when placed next to it, i.e. while the station is up no AI unit can pass through that wormhole from this side (entering the system is possible, just not leaving so you can get in to attack the station but not out).
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