Do golems need self attrition back?

[TechSY730]

While golems seem to be at a good place now in terms of durability, it feel like they are a bit too "cheesy" right now without their self attrition. In our game, we can literally just send out our golems to do deep strikes for hours on end, with minimal maintenance needed, and almost no risk to the golems. I know they are supposed to be super weapons, but, right now, they are taking away a pretty sizable chunk of the strategy of the game. And yes, this is with golems hard.

Maybe give them some self attrition back. Maybe like 1/4 or even 1/8 of their former rate (after taking the rescaling into account) or something? Just something to make them less "win most of the game for you with your barely trying".

This is just how I feel right now.

Also, if self attrition is really that unpopular, can we think of another inherent counter-balance for them? One that will keeps them very strong and "superweapon" feeling, but also gives them some check from letting them dominate the game with little effort for hours on end without cost?

[Arc-3N-4B]

Self-attrition outside of supply?

[Shrugging Khan]

Self-attrition when powered-up was silly, I have to say. A lot of micromanagement to little effect.

Self-attrition when out of supply, regardless of power-up or power-down, might work. Or possibly a transport-esque damage-on-passing-unsupplied-wormhole.

[Shoat]

Any attempt to send golems through AI worlds usually sees them blown up VERY quickly (unless an entire spire fleet is with them), just like any AI golems instantly explode when they enter my systems.

I don't see how "deepstriking for hours on end" would ever work (especially with "minimal maintenance"), considering that even a huge 100k+ firepower fleet (with full I-IV cap of medics) cannot last that long when it's deep within AI territory.

Due to personal experiences I pretty much always leave golems at home as they're ALWAYS the first thing to die when they're not at home. To me, golems are fortresses that can cross wormholes but only work within my territory.




(Warning: This post may be influenced by the poster's personal playstyle and does not in any way contain a universal truth.)

[Aklyon]

If you're able to deepstrike with Golems, I'm wondering how many golems that involves. Because that always ends with a lost golem for me.

[tadrinth]

This sounds like a situation where an uploaded save file would be helpful, with an example of a deepstrike target. 

[vigilo confido]

I have 2 cursed golems so far and a widow golem combined with cloaking starships/engineers. Widow golems prevent a lot of AI ships from ever getting into range and the cursed golems devastate entire systems destroying any ships that can bypass the widow golem first. This results in very little damage to the golems as I just cloak and move to a new location if the AI ever gets anywhere near the golems. Then repair any damage done. I will get an abuse case in a save up soon.

I am using hard golems and I managed to take down the entire exo wave using only the golems.

[MaxAstro]

My experience with golems has been that they are comparatively fragile and can't be trusted very deep into AI territory.  They are great on the defense, but I always hesitate to risk them on the attack.

...I do feel like they should maybe be immune to cloaking, though.  If only as a matter of scale...

I am also very much against bringing back the self-attrition, both because of the constant micro it causes and because of the constant economy drain it imposes.  If golems are meant to have a constant economy drain they should have it built into their stats (like a warp jammer), IMO.

[TechSY730]

This thread was primarily in relation to the cursed golem (huge range, non-suck speed, good dps, ammo type that has very few resistances or immunities, decent survivability), whose biggest counterbalance previously was a higher than normal self attrition rate. Without that, well, they feel a bit OP. The other golems tend to have something else holding them back (artillery has low rate of fire + ammo type that some important things are immune too; armored golem has meh range; etc), but the cursed golem had no such thing other than higher self attrition.

[snelg]

If it's only the cursed golem perhaps the attrition out of supply or the damage when travelling through wormholes like the transport mentioned earlier would be fitting. Or even an increased energy cost? Something like requiring supply in general could be an alternative to the attrition out of supply. Would it be a bad idea to have it wake up ai ships on nearby planets?

I'm thinking if it's currently lacking a weakness except not being as durable as some of the other golems something fitting could be added based on it being "cursed" (which in my opinion seem to imply there's something weird about it).

[Gelatious Cube]

Any attempt to send golems through AI worlds usually sees them blown up VERY quickly (unless an entire spire fleet is with them), just like any AI golems instantly explode when they enter my systems.

I don't see how "deepstriking for hours on end" would ever work (especially with "minimal maintenance"), considering that even a huge 100k+ firepower fleet (with full I-IV cap of medics) cannot last that long when it's deep within AI territory.

Due to personal experiences I pretty much always leave golems at home as they're ALWAYS the first thing to die when they're not at home. To me, golems are fortresses that can cross wormholes but only work within my territory.




(Warning: This post may be influenced by the poster's personal playstyle and does not in any way contain a universal truth.)

This is more or less my take on it as well. Golems are costly to repair, even now, and the AI seems to target them first when you're using them as part of a big attack fleet. So, when I take a Golem, its usually more of a defensive move than an offensive one.