Cost/Benefit Ratio?

[Hearteater]

The MRS makes cloaking strike forces stronger, since it can safely repair at system edge without drawing any attention.  Engineer IIIs will pull attention, and can make it impossible to use them safely in systems with longer range units such as Bombards.

[TechSY730]

Probably could kill the delay and add some beams to the MRS.

Right now I only get them if I am using a bunch of parasites or I feel like taking the Champ out to "harvest" AI ships.

I doubt the delay will be removed entirely. Originally, the MRSs had no delay, and could repair while moving. This made them quite OP. Thus the first nerf, which brought the timeout to 30 seconds with no cloaking or radar dampening. As that made them so bad no one wanted to use them, they were (eventually) buffed to where they are now. Considering where they were before, 10 or so seconds with these now seems pretty nice.

I would agree that they could use some more beams though. Or a knowledge cost nerf. Or maybe a little bit of both.

[Cinth]

Probably could kill the delay and add some beams to the MRS.

Right now I only get them if I am using a bunch of parasites or I feel like taking the Champ out to "harvest" AI ships.

I doubt the delay will be removed entirely. Originally, the MRSs had no delay, and could repair while moving. This made them quite OP. Thus the first nerf, which brought the timeout to 30 seconds with no cloaking or radar dampening. As that made them so bad no one wanted to use them, they were (eventually) buffed to where they are now. Considering where they were before, 10 or so seconds with these now seems pretty nice.

I would agree that they could use some more beams though. Or a knowledge cost nerf. Or maybe a little bit of both.

The repair on the move thing we can get with the medic frigate. It's probably the thing I like the most about them.
So either the MRS could get it back or the frigate could lose the ability.

[Diazo]

The frigate is a bonus ship though, it should be better then the base MRS in some way.

Maybe remove the delay but keep it so the MRS has to be stationary to repair while the Medic Frigate can repair on the move as its special ability?

D.

[Cinth]

The medic can fight. That is a bonus in itself.

[TechSY730]

The frigate is a bonus ship though, it should be better then the base MRS in some way.

Maybe remove the delay but keep it so the MRS has to be stationary to repair while the Medic Frigate can repair on the move as its special ability?

D.

That, and the frigate does not have innate cloaking, each individual ship has far fewer repair beams (not sure about cap repair beam count though), and it can't repair without losing any externally provided cloak. And as mentioned, it is a bonus ship type.

Not sure if a "delay" of 0 seconds would prevent cheesy abuse though, even if it couldn't repair while moving. A delay of 1 second maybe? That would be enough to stop cheesy "move, stop, repair a tad, move, stop, etc" type tactics from making the MRS almost as OP as it was before.

And it may very well be that the Z medic frigates, as they are now, are OP for similar reasons that the old MRS was, and the current MRS is closer to what the intended balance target for offensive repair capabilities are supposed to be.

[chemical_art]

I don't remember ever hearing in the current game that medical frigates or current MLRS are OP, probably because its just so hard to use repairs mid battle without winning the battle first.

I still find it easier to get engineers III and enclaves II and just make the needed units on the fly if I am deepstriking. I get the flexibility of recovering most of my losses and still being able to repair with engineers III (I don't use mk III or starship for deepstrikes, I keep them on defense / short raids).

Of course I don't get bent out of shape if my engineers III die...since I can make more at home and teleport them silently to my fleet.

[TechSY730]

I don't remember ever hearing in the current game that medical frigates or current MLRS are OP, probably because its just so hard to use repairs mid battle without winning the battle first.

I still find it easier to get engineers III and enclaves II and just make the needed units on the fly if I am deepstriking. I get the flexibility of recovering most of my losses and still being able to repair with engineers III (I don't use mk III or starship for deepstrikes, I keep them on defense / short raids).

Of course I don't get bent out of shape if my engineers III die...since I can make more at home and teleport them silently to my fleet.

If any thing, it sounds like Mk. III engineers are OP for their cost. High cap, low-ish unlock cost, cloaking, teleportation, and cheap to build.
Seems like something needs to go, or unlock costs should go up.

[Faulty Logic]

I emphatically oppose nerfing engi IIIs. I love the unit, but even in their current state, I can rarely justify unlocking them. Fleet repair can be accomplished by lower mark engineers in transports, though with some micro. And engineers can't fight.

I would like MRSs to either have a cost of 2000, planetwide coverage, or unlimited beams in their current range.

Transport IIs should have either a higher operational range, or a lower k cost.

[Martyn van Buren]

I haven't used MLRS since about the time the delay got added but I remember thinking it was pretty good --- I do think it's a good force multiplier in a knock-down fight, especially for allowing your fleet to get another guardpost or so down in a homeworld raid.  I don't recall the k cost but 2000 sounds reasonable to me; if it's currently more I would support a reduction.  Have they always had cloaking?  I don't remember that --- I always did a lot of micro to keep them safe but I might have just not noticed cloaking.  Anyway I do think that having a repair station that you can safely group-move with the fleet sounds pretty valuable.

I have never unlocked transports II but I do think that wanting to be able to get farther across AI space would be the most likely reason for me wanting to do so.  So I'd support their having less self-attrition.

[TechSY730]

I emphatically oppose nerfing engi IIIs. I love the unit, but even in their current state, I can rarely justify unlocking them. Fleet repair can be accomplished by lower mark engineers in transports, though with some micro. And engineers can't fight.

I would like MRSs to either have a cost of 2000, planetwide coverage, or unlimited beams in their current range.

Transport IIs should have either a higher operational range, or a lower k cost.

I vote for mobile repair stations go to 2k knowledge cost, or from 20 -> 40 beams with 3k knowledge cost.
I don't think they will gain their ability to move-repair back unless they get a pretty chunky nerf in number of beams.

For transports Mk. II, I would vote for 1 more planet out with 3k knowledge, or 2 more planets out for 4k knowledge.

[chemical_art]

I emphatically oppose nerfing engi IIIs. I love the unit, but even in their current state, I can rarely justify unlocking them. Fleet repair can be accomplished by lower mark engineers in transports, though with some micro. And engineers can't fight.

I would like MRSs to either have a cost of 2000, planetwide coverage, or unlimited beams in their current range.

Transport IIs should have either a higher operational range, or a lower k cost.

I vote for mobile repair stations go to 2k knowledge cost, or from 20 -> 40 beams with 3k knowledge cost.
I don't think they will gain their ability to move-repair back unless they get a pretty chunky nerf in number of beams.

For transports Mk. II, I would vote for 1 more planet out with 3k knowledge, or 2 more planets out for 4k knowledge.

I'd support all of this.

[Winge]

I emphatically oppose nerfing engi IIIs. I love the unit, but even in their current state, I can rarely justify unlocking them. Fleet repair can be accomplished by lower mark engineers in transports, though with some micro. And engineers can't fight.

I would like MRSs to either have a cost of 2000, planetwide coverage, or unlimited beams in their current range.

Transport IIs should have either a higher operational range, or a lower k cost.

I vote for mobile repair stations go to 2k knowledge cost, or from 20 -> 40 beams with 3k knowledge cost.
I don't think they will gain their ability to move-repair back unless they get a pretty chunky nerf in number of beams.

For transports Mk. II, I would vote for 1 more planet out with 3k knowledge, or 2 more planets out for 4k knowledge.

I'd support all of this.

I second all of it.  Mantis/poll?

[keith.lamothe]

I haven't used MLRS since

It's spreading, so fyi: it's MRS, not MLRS   There are units in the game called MLRS, and they do something totally different and far more rocket-y

[Martyn van Buren]

I was trying to figure out what the L was for.