Community Input - The State of Fortresses

[Wingflier]

Many players have mentioned their displeasure with the current state of Fortresses.  Fortresses are a powerful defense whose usefulness is offset by its high price and massive energy cost.  The Bomber's Polycrystal Hull, and its immunity to the Fortress is a rather boring and unintuitive mechanic, it doesn't seem to fit the Fortresses' role, and many players seem to think the solution to balancing it could be better (including Keith).

This particular thread is NOT for suggestions, this is just an acid test to see how many people are interested in changing the Fortress to be more interesting/dynamic than it currently is.

Please post if you think the Fortress should or should not be changed, and if you'd like, why or why not.

Thanks for your participation.

[LaughingThesaurus]

I think the fortress should be getting a pretty darned drastic change, so that it feels more like this 'game changer' structure you can only ever build a couple of.
I don't really think the Bomber vs. Fortress thing is unintuitive, but it's certainly boring to bring them up to the fortress and have em blast away while I just do other things. Fire and forget is kind of a boring mechanic, especially when it takes that long to actually kill off a Fortress in an unexciting battle. All in all, I think Fortresses should be more than just strong turrets.

[Varone]

I would enjoy seeing a different mechanic for fortresses. With the invention of polycrystal hulls for the zenith seige engines it just compounds the fortresses misery and we now have modular fortresses which are much more fun and fit the name fortress.

[Faulty Logic]

I don't think the fortresses need an overhaul. They define the battlefield of an entire system, adding to variety. And "fire and forget" is quite difficult now that there are hundreds of special forces fighters waiting for you to try.

[Wingflier]

I agree that Modular Fortresses are a hell of a lot more interesting and fun (though not nearly as practical because of the cap, but maybe that's the way Fortresses should be...).

[Varone]

I don't think the fortresses need an overhaul. They define the battlefield of an entire system, adding to variety. And "fire and forget" is quite difficult now that there are hundreds of special forces fighters waiting for you to try.

I do like how they define the battlefield but perhaps we can make it define the battlefield in a different way?

Humans have to use bombers so much because of the AI's heavy defences, i would be in favour of turning regular fortresses into more of an anti-bomber role just to have a change of pace. Would be nice to encounter a planet that you would need something besides bombers to crack.

[LaughingThesaurus]

I agree that Modular Fortresses are a hell of a lot more interesting and fun (though not nearly as practical because of the cap, but maybe that's the way Fortresses should be...).

What I was thinking was, low-cap, an amount of abilities, frontline utility, with some onboard weapons. Basically, a good staging area for attack, with no overly good or overly bad way to approach them... unlike the current model, where fortresses are just guaranteed death with not-bombers, and just fine with bombers.

[orzelek]

I agree that Modular Fortresses are a hell of a lot more interesting and fun (though not nearly as practical because of the cap, but maybe that's the way Fortresses should be...).

<cut> unlike the current model, where fortresses are just guaranteed death with not-bombers, and just fine with bombers.

I think that this is my main issue with them. I agree that it makes for a gameplay mechanic but it's not a good one.

To get rid of that - fortresses would need to get more universal. It maybe hard to build well balanced fortress that on one is fun to fight against in some way but doesn't require suiciding units against it because of it's power.

[Oralordos]

I've always found that fortresses function a lot like the AI Eyes in my games. They rather effectively keep my blob from going near them until they can be destroyed. Maybe I am just used to them.

[LaughingThesaurus]

I've always found that fortresses function a lot like the AI Eyes in my games. They rather effectively keep my blob from going near them until they can be destroyed. Maybe I am just used to them.

That's not really all that exciting though when you can just waypoint around them. I only directly steered my entire fleet into a fortress once on accident.

[Philo]

I think fortresses are just fine. When they spawn in the middle of a planet or near your wormhole where you're supposed to attack from it creates interesting scenarios to overcome. I'd at least keep the AI Fortresses as they are now unless there is some much better mechanic in mind. I haven't experimented enough with human Fortresses though to say anything concrete.

[KDR_11k]

It feels very odd that fortresses pretty much instakill anything that isn't a bomber but do nothing at all to bombers. While sending in the bombers or sniping them is quite different from what you do to the fleet ships I don't think it generates any cerebral challenge.

[Wingflier]

It feels very odd that fortresses pretty much instakill anything that isn't a bomber but do nothing at all to bombers. While sending in the bombers or sniping them is quite different from what you do to the fleet ships I don't think it generates any cerebral challenge.

This is my main objection with the current state of Fortresses, and the state of many other aspects of AI War.

This isn't a complaint of course, because the game already provides a decent cerebral challenge, I just think it could be better.

edit:  wording.

[zoutzakje]

hmmm this is a tricky one. I've been away for a while, but I've played this game plenty to know a lot about fortresses and what they're capable of.
I'd say I agree to come up with something more inventive for 75%. Killing fortresses is a grind most of the time and hardly any fun. However... I've experienced a few cases where even a simple mk I fort could be a hell to take out, bombers or not. Imagine an AI world with only 2 wormholes, both very close to the fort. The fort being protected by a forcefield, lots of shield bearers and anti bomber stuff (fighters and bulletproofs in particular). Oh and there were 3 ion cannons too, one of them being mk V. It took me at least 45 minutes to neuter that world and it was not a boring fight, it was a lot of fun actually. destroying that world was a real puzzle. I believe this was at an early-ish 7/7 game, though I'm not sure.
I guess I'm just worried a bit that if we change forts to much, rare-ish cases like this could be impossible to get by.

[Winge]

I too feel that the Fortress should be a bit better/more interesting.  The whole 'Bombers Only' thing is getting a bit old, and I'm not exactly a fan of the long grind either.  I'm thinking less overall damage, but with one or more special abilities that either helps it defend against swarms or against very large threats (eg Exo lead ships).  The Modular Fortresses seem like a step in the right direction, but I haven't played enough Ancient Shadows to say for sure...I'm waiting for AS to arrive on Steam.

Definitely looking forward to a brainstorming thread.