Author Topic: Champion Units Idea  (Read 4049 times)

Offline Hearteater

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Re: Champion Units Idea
« Reply #15 on: August 01, 2012, 03:41:12 pm »
Changing the target of the wave is more deadly than having the wave hit the normal target.  And at high difficulties, the warning is around 1:40.  So by the time you get the warning, you need defenses in place already or you won't get there in time.  It is actually more dangerous to lower difficulties were a player doesn't normally need as solid a defense.  Which would be why there is a cut-off based on difficulty.  Because no one needs to see those at Difficulty 5.  And again, it could be 1/2 warning, or something.  Try playing with No Wave Warnings for a bit.  You'll find it isn't as challenging as you thought.  It gets old pretty quickly in my opinion, which is why this would happen only once every 8 hours or so.

@Minotaar:
Unannounced Waves are far less punishing than Beachheads, and much more rare.  On the invisible upgrades front, these are single, large, unique units that have a visible indicator on their icon.  These are units players are already paying attention to.  They would be rare enough you could get an alert when one is present in a wave (or attacking your systems in general).  Adding more Guardian types is good, but adding 16 Champion types multiplies the existing Guardians by 16 in terms of creating diversity.  You get a ton of additional content for some one-time setup of the internal Champion code.  Then as more Guardians or Champions get added, the number of combinations grows.  At the same time, since each piece (the ship type and Champion type) is separate and understandable, the player is very easily able to identify the capabilities of each dynamic Champion.

For reference, there are 20 Guardians.  With 16 Champion types, you get 320 possible Champion Guardians.  There isn't even a chance 20 new Guardian types will get added anytime soon, much less 300.

Offline Kahuna

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Re: Champion Units Idea
« Reply #16 on: August 01, 2012, 03:46:38 pm »
Funny about the timing of this suggestion...
What's so funny?
set /A diff=10
if %diff%==max (
   set /A me=:)
) else (
   set /A me=SadPanda
)
echo Check out my AI War strategy guide and find your inner Super Cat!
echo 2592 hours of AI War and counting!
echo Kahuna matata!

Offline Volatar

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Re: Champion Units Idea
« Reply #17 on: August 01, 2012, 03:56:19 pm »
Funny about the timing of this suggestion...

Awwwww snap.  8)

Offline Minotaar

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Re: Champion Units Idea
« Reply #18 on: August 01, 2012, 04:30:29 pm »
Changing the target of the wave is more deadly than having the wave hit the normal target.  And at high difficulties, the warning is around 1:40.  So by the time you get the warning, you need defenses in place already or you won't get there in time.  It is actually more dangerous to lower difficulties were a player doesn't normally need as solid a defense.  Which would be why there is a cut-off based on difficulty.  Because no one needs to see those at Difficulty 5.  And again, it could be 1/2 warning, or something.  Try playing with No Wave Warnings for a bit.  You'll find it isn't as challenging as you thought.  It gets old pretty quickly in my opinion, which is why this would happen only once every 8 hours or so.

@Minotaar:
Unannounced Waves are far less punishing than Beachheads, and much more rare.  On the invisible upgrades front, these are single, large, unique units that have a visible indicator on their icon.  These are units players are already paying attention to.  They would be rare enough you could get an alert when one is present in a wave (or attacking your systems in general).  Adding more Guardian types is good, but adding 16 Champion types multiplies the existing Guardians by 16 in terms of creating diversity.  You get a ton of additional content for some one-time setup of the internal Champion code.  Then as more Guardians or Champions get added, the number of combinations grows.  At the same time, since each piece (the ship type and Champion type) is separate and understandable, the player is very easily able to identify the capabilities of each dynamic Champion.

For reference, there are 20 Guardians.  With 16 Champion types, you get 320 possible Champion Guardians.  There isn't even a chance 20 new Guardian types will get added anytime soon, much less 300.

Playing when 100% waves are unannounced is one thing. When it's 1%, you cannot reasonably prepare for it. If such a thing was in the game and there was no way to turn it off, I would just reload every time that happened, because that's just completely unfair. Having them bypass normal wave rules is obviously out of the question, too.
On diff 10 the warning is 1:30. You can get your whole fleet home from 4-5 hops away in that time.
The worst thing is even if all of your other champion options are somehow perfectly balanced and tons of fun, this one thing would be enough for me to never turn them on.
And having all these combinations is a balancing nightmare. A lot of them would just be broken, and even if caught during development, exceptions have to be added.. don't think this is worth it.

Offline LaughingThesaurus

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Re: Champion Units Idea
« Reply #19 on: August 01, 2012, 06:36:08 pm »
Okay, I actually didn't know the timer went down as difficulty grew higher.
Here's the thing. I'm reasonably terrible enough at RTS that I end up just sorta sitting around planning stuff out. While the pause button is awesome for that... I prefer the great deal of leeway I get on lower difficulties. Probably gonna dive into a setting far higher sometime soon though, because... y'know, builds character.
I don't really have anything else to say about the unannounced waves thing. If it ended up being a huge deal, it could just be its own separate plot, assuming this DID get implemented.

Offline zoutzakje

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Re: Champion Units Idea
« Reply #20 on: August 01, 2012, 09:08:48 pm »
I like your idea a lot Hearteater and I don't think any of them are overpowered at all. Besides, they would only appear on the difficulties above normal, that's where games are supposed to be hard. I agree it should be an AI plot, but I know I would play with it turned on a lot.