Author Topic: Been away started playing again with a couple of questions  (Read 2323 times)

Offline Salamander

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Been away started playing again with a couple of questions
« on: December 13, 2013, 10:11:54 am »
Hi folks.

I haven't played AI War in some time, not since Light of the Spire. Other things came up including other games I was playing with friends like SWTOR. I started playing again last night with all the expansions and I was curious about a couple of things:

1) How exactly does hacking work? It either didn't exist or was still in its infancy when I last played and I did not see much on how to go about it on the Wiki.

2) I am trying out the champions and have a Shadow Frigate, found a gray Spire enclave in a cul-de-sac only that ship can get into due to the shadow drive. Reading the journal I need to weather the storm of gatlings or find and neutralize the thing making them. The frigate was getting beaten up a lot so went back to my save before entering after no luck finding the creator. Are there any tips out there for these?

Forgot how much I like this game so glad to be playing again but so far these 2 things are very new to me, any help would be appreciated!

Offline Toranth

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Re: Been away started playing again with a couple of questions
« Reply #1 on: December 13, 2013, 11:14:32 am »
2) I am trying out the champions and have a Shadow Frigate, found a gray Spire enclave in a cul-de-sac only that ship can get into due to the shadow drive. Reading the journal I need to weather the storm of gatlings or find and neutralize the thing making them. The frigate was getting beaten up a lot so went back to my save before entering after no luck finding the creator. Are there any tips out there for these?
In that scenario, the gatling creator doesn't actually exist.  Try to fight off the Gatlings and protect your allies starbases as best you can.  Don't forget to upgrade your Champion whenever you complete a scenario.  Leveling up gives points you can spend to unlock new and higher mark weapon modules, and at certain times you will unlock new and larger hull types (more module bays, use higher mark modules, different abilities, etc).


1) How exactly does hacking work? It either didn't exist or was still in its infancy when I last played and I did not see much on how to go about it on the Wiki.
The most recent revision of Hacking is still fairly new, and very interesting.
Hacking revolves around a new resource, Hacking Progress (HaP).  HaP goes up 1-for-1 as AIP goes up, but does not goes down when AIP goes down.  Whenever you successfully complete a hack, your HaP goes down.  In other words, current HaP = Total_AIP - HaP_Spent.
The AI's response is proportional to the amount of hacking you've done.  If your HaP is positive, it's the sum of all HaP you've spent.  If you spend more HaP than you have, your total will go negative.  You can still do hacking, but when your HaP is negative the AI's response is dramatically increased, as in exponents.  Negative HaP hacking can be very dangerous.  Not recommended.

So what can you hack?
Hacking includes the classics of Knowledge Raiding and SuperTerminal AIP reduction, but also includes:
ARS research redirection - Allows you to choose one of three ships to unlock when you capture an ARS (you can view which three ships by bringing any Science vessel into a system with an ARS.  Select the science ship and click the ARS tab).
Fabricator Design Download - Allows you to gain a ship type from the fabricator.  Aka, hacking a Core Bomber Fab will let your Space Docks build Mk V Bombers, even without the need to capture or protect that fab.  You do not gain access to Mk I-IV.
Advanced Production Hacking - Similar to Fab hacking, you can hack an Advanced Factory or Advanced Starship Constructor to gain the ability to produce Mk IV fleetships or starships from your docks, without the need to capture or protect the Factory.
Sabotage Hacking - Induces an AI structure to self-destruct.  These can be things like forcefields, fortresses, Raid Engines, AI Eyes, etc.  Most importantly, you do NOT gain the AIP cost from destroying AI structures in this manner.  For example, the Interplanetary Munitions Booster gives +5 AIP normally, but not when Sabotage-hacked.
Sensor Hacking - This hack causes all AI ships in the system to become uncloaked for 35 seconds, AND auto-cloaks all of your ships for 35 seconds.  This is normal cloaking; if your ships fire they will become visible.
AI Backup Servers - AI Backup Servers are a new AI structure.  One backup server exists somewhere in the universe for each ship type the AI has onlocked, per AI player.  Each Backup server can be hacked only once, and there are two possible hacks that can be done: Download and Corruption.
AI Backup Server Download - You can hack the Backup Server to download and gain the ship type of the Backup.  This is exactly like gaining a ship through an ARS.  You gain the Mk I version, and can research higher Marks.
AI Backup Server Corruption - You can hack a Backup server to re-lock the ship-type.  That AI player will no longer be able to create ships of that type.  Pre-existing units will still be alive, but no more waves or reinforcements of that type will appear.  Note: The Core Types defending the AI Homeworlds are a different list, and are not affected by this Hack.

So how do you hack something?
There is a new Science vessel type called the Hacker, built from the Command Station's Econ build menu.  This is a cloaked vessel that you can move around to reach your target system.  When you reach your target system, click on the Hack to access the Hacker's build menu.  There is a specific immobile cloaked ship you can build for each type of hack, that will perform the actual hack.  For example, use the Hacker ship to build a Covert Knowledge Extractor to perform a Knowledge Raid.  The countdown timer/K gather total appears over the ship, and the hack begins.
The SuperTerminal still works as it always has, no special ships required.  Just build a Command Station in the same system as the SuperTerminal, and the hack will begin.

Each hack has a different cost in HaP, and every time you execute the hack, the cost goes up by 1.5x as the AI becomes more resistant.
Knowledge Raiding  - Extracts 6K/sec, after a :15 second preparation phase.  Costs 30 HaP to gather 3000 K.  Goes up by 1.5x for each 3000K extracted.
SuperTerminal AIP reduction - Costs 1 HaP per SuperTerminal tick, and increases by 1.5x for every 20 AIP.  Note that since the ST is -2/+1 AIP per tick, the first 20 points of AIP reduction are "free".
ARS research redirection - Takes 10:00 minutes, and costs 50 HaP for the first hack.
Fabricator Design Download - Takes 5:00 minutes and costs 30 HaP for the first hack.
Advanced Production Hacking - Takes 15:00 minutes and costs 100 HaP for the first hack.  Hacking both an Advanced Factory and an Advanced Starship Constructor costs a total of 250 HaP.
Sabotage Hacking - takes 1:00 minute and costs 2 HaP for the first hack.  Again, this avoids the AIP increase from destroying AI structures.
Sensor Hacking - takes :30 seconds, and costs 10 HaP for the first hack.
AI Backup Server Download - Takes 5:00 minutes, and costs 50 HaP for the first hack.
AI Backup Server Corruption - Takes 5:00 minutes, and costs 30 HaP for the first hack.


As you can see, hacking is a powerful new alternative to gaining AIP, allowing capturing new ship types or destroying annoying AI structures without gaining AIP. 

Other things that might be new to you:  There's a new Showdown win condition you can enable in the lobby; Mk IV/V starships now exist; Neinzul Enclaves and AI Carrier Guardians now act as automatic drone producers instead of their previous roles; the new amazing Protector Starships; Mk V turrets (made possible by capturing Core Turret Controllers) exist and are built on a per-system cap; AI Guardposts are MUCH nastier than before; and there are several new types of Brutal Core Guardposts - check out the patch notes for more info, or just (briefly) enjoy the surprise.

Offline Salamander

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Re: Been away started playing again with a couple of questions
« Reply #2 on: December 13, 2013, 11:19:51 am »
Wow thanks for all the info!

I left all the ship types on and added the Champion to my game besides the Spire campaign as I'm trying to get settled back in with a lower difficultly AI and not too much new stuff. Will look into all the info you gave me.

Greatly appreciated!  :D

Offline Draco18s

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Re: Been away started playing again with a couple of questions
« Reply #3 on: December 13, 2013, 12:13:43 pm »
Superterminal hacks are also very interesting under the new system.  Because of how the AIP floor is raised (+2 AIP -1 AIP) the hacking point cost is actually free for the first good long while.

Offline Salamander

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Re: Been away started playing again with a couple of questions
« Reply #4 on: December 22, 2013, 02:58:22 am »
Quite enjoying the Shadow campaign although I got to rather nasty one with a ton of suicide ships and had made the mistake of not backing up my save so my Zenith Destroyer Champion was armed with too many Polarizers which it was not using on the enemy starbases so lost the last friendly starbase while still attacking the last enemy one. Had those guns been able to shoot these bases, I would have won that one even if it would have been very close.

My AIs are set low, only at 4 since I'm so rusty and even then the 2nd time I hacked an ARS saw a flood of units in response! I didn't try a 3rd one after that!

Trying to get a few friends to try it out, one has played it with me before and with the insane Steam sale having the whole game and all current expansions for a measly 4.24 I grabbed it for 9 friends. That's a crazy low price for a game with so much play value!

Offline Bognor

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Re: Been away started playing again with a couple of questions
« Reply #5 on: December 22, 2013, 05:41:49 am »
Fabricator Design Download - Takes 5:00 minutes and costs 30 HaP for the first hack.
Actually a bargain at 20 HaP  :)
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Offline Draco18s

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Re: Been away started playing again with a couple of questions
« Reply #6 on: December 22, 2013, 10:31:42 am »
Fabricator Design Download - Takes 5:00 minutes and costs 30 HaP for the first hack.
Actually a bargain at 20 HaP  :)

And 30 for the second.  So tasty.

Offline Toranth

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Re: Been away started playing again with a couple of questions
« Reply #7 on: December 22, 2013, 11:57:27 am »
Fabricator Design Download - Takes 5:00 minutes and costs 30 HaP for the first hack.
Actually a bargain at 20 HaP  :)
*checks again* Yup, you're correct.  Dunno why I had it in my head that it was actually 30 HaP for the first Fab hack, but it's nice that it is one step cheaper.

I still think that ARS hacking is way too expensive, though.  It costs the same as a Design Download, but ARS hacking doesn't get you a new ship, while Downloading does.  Downloading also allows for more options than just one-of-three.

Offline Bognor

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Re: Been away started playing again with a couple of questions
« Reply #8 on: December 22, 2013, 07:19:16 pm »
I still find it weird that your first AI Backup Server download gets you a mark I ship for 50 HaP, whereas your first Fabricator download gets you a mark V ship for 20 Hap.  I mentioned this to Keith and he noted that the Backup Server download has more overall potential as you can spend knowledge to get marks II-IV.  But I'm never short on things to spend knowledge on.

It actually seems like the price is roughly reversed, ARS hack (50 HaP) < Backup Server download (30 HaP) < Fabricator hack (20 HaP)

Then again, Fab hacking being cheap means you can probably do it a few times, maybe getting a core turret controller or two as well as some core fleet ships or starships.
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Offline TechSY730

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Re: Been away started playing again with a couple of questions
« Reply #9 on: December 26, 2013, 11:17:35 am »
Because of this interplay of immediate vs. long-term reward of these various hacks almost balancing out, why not have the ARS, backup server, and fabricator hacks all be the same base price? Like 25 or 30 HaP?

That still leaves the question of the advanced factory hack though, that has a much more skewed immediate vs. long-term reward (very little, and very often no immediate reward, enormously huge long term reward if you have the knowledge for it). That's a more complicated issue.

Offline Vacuity

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Re: Been away started playing again with a couple of questions
« Reply #10 on: December 27, 2013, 10:26:26 am »
It's worth bearing in mind that after hacking a single advanced factory of each type (regular and starship), you would never want or need to hack another.  The increased hacking costs for successive hacks are essentially irrelevant for these hacks.  There are plenty of circumstances in which you might wish to hack multiple times for the others.

For some reason, ARS's hate me and almost always offer ships I neither need nor like as the first option, and they're the most expensive to hack.  Ugh.

Offline Draco18s

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Re: Been away started playing again with a couple of questions
« Reply #11 on: December 27, 2013, 01:19:48 pm »
For some reason, ARS's hate me and almost always offer ships I neither need nor like as the first option, and they're the most expensive to hack.  Ugh.

On the other claw, I go in guns blazing expecting to need to hack it, find out that I'm offered:

Lightning Torpedo Frigates, Autobombs, and Bulletproof fighters.

Firstoneplzkthx.

Offline Chthon

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Re: Been away started playing again with a couple of questions
« Reply #12 on: December 27, 2013, 06:34:23 pm »
For some reason, ARS's hate me and almost always offer ships I neither need nor like as the first option, and they're the most expensive to hack.  Ugh.

On the other claw, I go in guns blazing expecting to need to hack it, find out that I'm offered:

Lightning Torpedo Frigates, Autobombs, and Bulletproof fighters.

Firstoneplzkthx.
Multiplayer you might find yourself hacking that one just because another player would prefer something else based on how they teched.  Autobombs make great throwaway troops to protect your MSDs while they follow your armies.  Well them and railpods.  Together... well, you could probably just send in the MSDs and watch the havoc.