AI War state of the game

[relmz32]

I disappear for the weekend, and I come back to this.

Damn you people and making a 5 page long thread on a topic I'm interested in, but don't have the time or patience to read it all!

I'm sorry that you don't have the energy to read all of the comments, but you should at least read the op! While I may not agree with all that Wingflier said, I very much appreciate his overarching goal: Trying to provide ideas to make this great game that we all enjoy better.

An issue with talking about such a giant topic as "State of the Game," is that I think Keith would be the most likely in the best position to provide this kind of feedback, similar to how Mark Rosewater does in his articles on dailymtg.com of the same name.

[keith.lamothe]

I disappear for the weekend, and I come back to this.

Yep, just when you think the kids are old enough.  The flour, milk, and sugar are all over the kitchen floor.  We were just trying to bake a cake!

[Draco18s]

I'm sorry that you don't have the energy to read all of the comments, but you should at least read the op!

I did read the OP.
As for the rest, I could read them, but not all at once (I only get a few minutes of free time in one go, you see).  The problem is figuring out where I left off!

Re: Original Post

Did you know that it takes 28 seconds for a Fighter to kill a single Bomber?  TWENTY EIGHT SECONDS.  That is enough time to get a cup of coffee and come back.  Why?  Why does it take so long?  And the saddest part of it all is that is the fastest matchup of the entire Triangle Counters, and indeed one of the fastest counter-matchups in the game.

Conversely, I and my friends have quit the game because that is too fast.

[Lancefighter]

didn't at one point a frigate kill a raptor in one shot? This mightve been like forever ago, granted..

[Kahuna]

Did you know that it takes 28 seconds for a Fighter to kill a single Bomber?  TWENTY EIGHT SECONDS.  That is enough time to get a cup of coffee and come back.  Why?  Why does it take so long?  And the saddest part of it all is that is the fastest matchup of the entire Triangle Counters, and indeed one of the fastest counter-matchups in the game.

Conversely, I and my friends have quit the game because that is too fast.

That's what the epic mode is for.

[Draco18s]

That's what the epic mode is for.

We use(d) epic and low-caps and it's still too much of a hard-counter.

[TechSY730]

I'm not sure that Draco18s complaint is so much that it is too fast, as much as it was that the average difference of lethality between the general case and the "X counters Y" case is too great.

If this is the case, then the average general case lethality could go up, and the average "X counters Y" "bonus" to lethality could go down (increasing the average but also decreasing variance) would satisfy both "sides".

Now of course, this does bring into question of how much do we want ships to be differentiated based on "general case" stats (HP, armor, weapon damage, reload time, range) and "specific case", "enumed" stats (ammo type immunities, hull type bonuses, ship "class" restrictions), and where the relative importance of these two classes of stats should be. Also, how can we provide ways for ships to "feel" different in ways beyond just DPS and overall durability, but without reducing the importance of "general case" DPS and overall durability by too much?

Also, it might be worth making a game mode that is even "slower" than even epic provides.

[Draco18s]

Also, it might be worth making a game mode that is even "slower" than even epic provides.

I just thought of something that I don't know the answer to:

Does the game speed (epic/normal/fast) modify how often the AI sends waves, etc.?

If not, it probably should.  There's a vast different between a fast game where the AI sends a wave and you can recall your fleet to the location in seconds vs. minutes.

[orzelek]

I'm not sure if I understand this lethality concept here correctly - but for me things simply die to fast. I'm using ultra low caps from their introduction to slightly mitigate that. Also playing all games on epic setting.

Personally I would welcome setting that would go further from epic and while leaving speed at epic level would further reduce damage and/or reload speeds by 50%.

I simply like when fight is not over in few seconds and you can actually look at it while it happens.

(Not using AIP per hour obviously - my games have times in 10+ range and I didn't finish many - one with FS while it was created I think)

[Hearteater]

I can't fathom what you guys are doing to end fights in a few seconds at epic pace.

[keith.lamothe]

I can't fathom what you guys are doing to end fights in a few seconds at epic pace.

Ramming Speed!

[Draco18s]

Ramming Speed!

Ahm sorrah Capn, I cahnot!  Tha engines, thay be capped at one quatah speed!

[orzelek]

I can't fathom what you guys are doing to end fights in a few seconds at epic pace.

That was a small exaggeration...

I think I need to mantis new game option - More Epic
It's here: mantis

[Oralordos]

Are you sure you shouldn't call a slower than epic game-mode slow-motion?

[LaughingThesaurus]

Call it Matrix Mode.