Author Topic: AI War Beta 7.011-7.012 "Salvaged Resources" Released!  (Read 15619 times)

Offline keith.lamothe

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AI War Beta 7.011-7.012 "Salvaged Resources" Released!
« on: March 15, 2014, 11:58:08 am »
(Crossposted from this blog post)

This one carries a number of rather significant econ-related changes that have been brewing for a while:

Now that hacking has been around long enough and seems to be welcome, we've moved ahead with the combination of metal and crystal (into just metal) so that hacking can move up into the main resource bar.  Crystal as a separate mechanic had some impact on the game, but ultimately we could do better.

The other main thrust was to nibble at both ends of the refleeting problem.  To a large extent there's no problem if a major player fleet wipe takes a long time to recover from.  Actions should have consequences.  But if it _only_ takes time (specifically, the player's real wall-clock time), then that crosses the line from "reduced player ability" to "reduced player interest", which is not cool.  So now the AI can "take the ball and throw it back" proportional to your offensive casualties.  That nibbles at one side (making post-fleet-wipe more interesting, possibly terminally so).  On the other side, when the AI takes casualties in your territory you get bonus metal-per-second while your command stations gather up the salvage.  That nibbles at the other side (speeding up the refleet, if you survive).

Along with that, the resource cap (aside from updating for the m+c combination) now increases a bit with each command station and thus keeps up better as the scale of the conflict increases throughout the game.

Finally, there are a few bugfixes including a rather important one to the core timing of the simulation.  Previously (as many of you noticed) the sim actually ran faster when you moved the mouse around like a crazy person.  No longer :)  But now the + and - speed settings have a more pronounced impact and the +10 speed (renamed to "+!!!") has been repurposed as a genuine "go as fast as you can" (while still drawing a few frames per second) setting.  In the early game (before the sim load gets serious) that can let you pass a tremendous amount of sim-time very quickly if you want to.

Update: 7.012 hotfix for some unhandled errors on the Economy tab of the Stats window.  Apparently it was still in denial about crystal.

Enjoy!

This is a standard update that you can download through the  in-game updater itself, if you already have 4.000 or later. When you launch the game, you'll see the notice of the update having been found if you're connected to the Internet at the time.  If you don't have 4.000 or later, you can download that here.
« Last Edit: March 15, 2014, 03:41:26 pm by keith.lamothe »
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Offline chemical_art

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Re: AI War Beta 7.011 "Salvaged Resources" Released!
« Reply #1 on: March 15, 2014, 12:04:05 pm »
Well i see it is time i  install ai war on my new rig and have a go at normal caps. this sound.ds simply awesome.
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Offline Chthon

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Re: AI War Beta 7.011 "Salvaged Resources" Released!
« Reply #2 on: March 15, 2014, 02:02:23 pm »
I don't remember asking for salvage. Did you ask me to implement salvage?  When did I ever say I wanted salvage.  You're just lucky I like the idea man.

All kidding aside, wow, I'm going to have to try it out once I have the time.  Sounds like you did some awesome work with this.  Increased storage I think will help out a lot without outright giving the player an advantage.  I also think I may just try out logistics stations now.

Offline Draco18s

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Re: AI War Beta 7.011 "Salvaged Resources" Released!
« Reply #3 on: March 15, 2014, 02:21:13 pm »
New pants sir.  I seem to require them.

(They have holes, you see, they just don't make them like they used to.)

I don't remember asking for salvage. Did you ask me to implement salvage?  When did I ever say I wanted salvage.  You're just lucky I like the idea man.

That idea sprouted from a thread I was active in.  I don't recall if it was my idea, or if I had recycled it from somewhere else.  Probably mine, as it was an idea I had implemented here about two years ago.

Offline keith.lamothe

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Re: AI War Beta 7.011 "Salvaged Resources" Released!
« Reply #4 on: March 15, 2014, 02:28:08 pm »
New pants sir.  I seem to require them.
The AI will be happy to fashion some for you out of your newly field-dressed battle-fleet.

Quote
That idea sprouted from a thread I was active in.  I don't recall if it was my idea, or if I had recycled it from somewhere else.  Probably mine, as it was an idea I had implemented here about two years ago.
Your idea certainly played a part in inspiring the salvage stuff, yep :)
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Offline Aklyon

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Re: AI War Beta 7.011 "Salvaged Resources" Released!
« Reply #5 on: March 15, 2014, 02:38:52 pm »
Do Railpods, enclave spawn, and such who will die anyway after some time count for salvage?

Also, does this big update of things break previous saves?

Offline keith.lamothe

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Re: AI War Beta 7.011 "Salvaged Resources" Released!
« Reply #6 on: March 15, 2014, 02:43:28 pm »
Do Railpods, enclave spawn, and such who will die anyway after some time count for salvage?
Yep :)  But since their metal value is used, it's not much.

I used a full 18-space-dock-backed-up-by-full-mkII-engie-cap "tiger cannon" (mks I through III youngling tigers) against one AI mkIV planet with a Plasma Eye in a 7/7 MP test and the while the reprisal was... vigorous... it was still quite manageable.  And tasty.

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Also, does this big update of things break previous saves?
Nope, we never break old saves in AIW, since even before pre-1.0 :)  Sometimes old saves get weird, but never broken unless we mess up badly.  In this case it just combines your old metal and crystal reserves into metal and goes on trucking.

If anyone sees a save that won't load please let me know ASAP (with the save that won't load) so I can fix the issue.
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Offline Kahuna

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Re: AI War Beta 7.011 "Salvaged Resources" Released!
« Reply #7 on: March 15, 2014, 02:46:58 pm »
Awesome change. The new +3 speed is about as fast as the old +10 speed. Also the game feels lighter and smoother. Awesome. AND.. when I double click to select all x units I can instantly deselect them.. unlike before. Before you would be stuck with the current selection for a moment.
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Offline TechSY730

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Re: AI War Beta 7.011 "Salvaged Resources" Released!
« Reply #8 on: March 15, 2014, 02:54:57 pm »
Wow!

First: Congrats on your new daughter Keith.  I wish her the best. :)

Second: Awesome update. This may finally be the update that convinces me to update to the new hacking system (I've been sitting on 7.001 this whole time). Not so hot about the metal/crystal merge, but I can accept it for everything else here.

Third: The new speed increments seems a bit much. Or at least +1 and -1. Maybe +1 and -1 could be 1.5x and .75x speed (respectively), and shift 2x and .5x to +2 and -2 (and shift the rest of the scale as is along with it)? 2x is quite a bit faster after all, it it might be nice to have something in-between.

Fourth: I was hoping that the cleanup drones (or whatever they are called, that's how little I have used them) would play a role in the scrap stuff, but a way to further differentiate command stations is cool too.

Fifth: I really need to check into The Last Federation more. It seems like a game I would like.

Sixth: Dang, my post rate has been slipping big time these last few months. I need to do something about that, before Mánagarmr or chemical_art catch up. :P

Offline keith.lamothe

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Re: AI War Beta 7.011 "Salvaged Resources" Released!
« Reply #9 on: March 15, 2014, 03:02:32 pm »
Third: The new speed increments seems a bit much. Or at least +1 and -1. Maybe +1 and -1 could be 1.5x and .75x speed (respectively), and shift 2x and .5x to +2 and -2 (and shift the rest of the scale as is along with it)? 2x is quite a bit faster after all, it it might be nice to have something in-between.
Yea, I wondered if that would make them a bit too coarse.  I might redo 1 through 5 to be more like what 1 through 3 are right now, and have 6 through 9 scale across the current 4 through 9.

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Fourth: I was hoping that the cleanup drones (or whatever they are called, that's how little I have used them) would play a role in the scrap stuff, but a way to further differentiate command stations is cool too.
I really waffled back and forth for a while on whether to involve the cleanup drones in this, with actual visible wrecks that you can reclaim (even in AI territory, perhaps).  It seemed like a really natural fit with the concept of a cleanup drone.

But once I really got ahold of the overall idea I concluded that the salvage thing was worthwhile in itself, and would be moreso (not less so) if it were made as non-fiddly as possible.  Meaning essentially no special player behavior is necessary to make it work.

Honestly the cleanup drones may just go away entirely.  I think the only thing left for them is to remove AI mine remains.  Do AI mines even leave remains anymore?

Quote
Sixth: Dang, my post rate has been slipping big time these last few months. I need to do something about that, before Mánagarmr or chemical_art catch up. :P
Welcome back :)
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Offline Aklyon

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Re: AI War Beta 7.011 "Salvaged Resources" Released!
« Reply #10 on: March 15, 2014, 03:18:13 pm »
Economy screen is bugged, it keeps trapping people who look at it.

Offline keith.lamothe

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Re: AI War Beta 7.011 "Salvaged Resources" Released!
« Reply #11 on: March 15, 2014, 03:34:02 pm »
Economy screen is bugged, it keeps trapping people who look at it.
Initially I didn't know what you meant.  I see now that it was throwing errors; testing a fix.
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Offline keith.lamothe

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Re: AI War Beta 7.011-7.012 "Salvaged Resources" Released!
« Reply #12 on: March 15, 2014, 03:41:37 pm »
Ok, thanks for letting me know :)

Update: 7.012 hotfix for some unhandled errors on the Economy tab of the Stats window.  Apparently it was still in denial about crystal.
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Offline Cyborg

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Re: AI War Beta 7.011-7.012 "Salvaged Resources" Released!
« Reply #13 on: March 15, 2014, 03:54:25 pm »
I approve. Thanks Keith.
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Offline Vinraith

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Re: AI War Beta 7.011-7.012 "Salvaged Resources" Released!
« Reply #14 on: March 15, 2014, 04:12:33 pm »
Looks interesting. I won't be able to test this for a little while so can someone clarify: the reprisal waves follow the normal wave rules? That is, they come through AI warp gates?