Author Topic: AI War Beta 6.016 "Deflecting Attraction" Released!  (Read 5238 times)

Offline chemical_art

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Re: AI War Beta 6.016 "Deflecting Attraction" Released!
« Reply #30 on: April 06, 2013, 12:48:01 am »
I just booted up a game from a month and a half ago, and my Spire Frigates feel like vaporous blobs of paste compared to the newly buffed spire starship (I'm not sure if I should be elated or disappointed)

They don't even have much more DPS individually... compared to the mark 1.




Keep in mind that the Spire Starship was the human attempt to make the largest unit they could build, at great cost, using spire technology.

The Spire frigate is the smallest unit of the spire main fleet.

So its OK that the starship is stronger I think.
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Offline keith.lamothe

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Re: AI War Beta 6.016 "Deflecting Attraction" Released!
« Reply #31 on: April 06, 2013, 10:51:09 am »
I just booted up a game from a month and a half ago, and my Spire Frigates feel like vaporous blobs of paste compared to the newly buffed spire starship (I'm not sure if I should be elated or disappointed)
Well, bear in mind that the spire starship has a cap of 1, so it's gotta pack a lot into the one ship ;)  Whereas you get multiple frigates even at the refugee-outpost level.
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Offline TechSY730

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Re: AI War Beta 6.016 "Deflecting Attraction" Released!
« Reply #32 on: April 06, 2013, 02:16:37 pm »
Just a question. Any ETA of the new AI toggle changes? Will it be next version (6.017), or the one after that? If it is the next one, any idea when that would be? (Monday, Tuesday, whatever)


I'm not trying to push you, I'm asking so I know whether to start a new game now or wait a bit.

Offline keith.lamothe

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Re: AI War Beta 6.016 "Deflecting Attraction" Released!
« Reply #33 on: April 06, 2013, 02:26:56 pm »
The toggle will be in the next release.  The only things actually confirmed for it are the strategic-reserve static strength and the core-guard-posts increasing floor on death (and reducing the AIP on death of the AI HCS from 100 to 20, regardless of toggle).

Probably Tuesday or Wednesday, noonish.
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Offline Wingflier

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Re: AI War Beta 6.016 "Deflecting Attraction" Released!
« Reply #34 on: April 06, 2013, 03:11:08 pm »
Aww what? No punishment for popping Data Centers?
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Offline Vyndicu

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Re: AI War Beta 6.016 "Deflecting Attraction" Released!
« Reply #35 on: April 06, 2013, 03:28:10 pm »
I just booted up a game from a month and a half ago, and my Spire Frigates feel like vaporous blobs of paste compared to the newly buffed spire starship (I'm not sure if I should be elated or disappointed)
Well, bear in mind that the spire starship has a cap of 1, so it's gotta pack a lot into the one ship ;)  Whereas you get multiple frigates even at the refugee-outpost level.

Hmm I had a weird thought. If Spire Frigate is the smallest ship Fallen Spire maintain and Spire Starship is the largest human/spire hybrid ship. Then where do Spire Corvette fit? Spire corvette are smaller than Spire Starship, I am assuming to fit more modules?

I am ignoring the shadow spire champion ship size since it is not a "traditional" ship so to speak.

Offline Wingflier

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Re: AI War Beta 6.016 "Deflecting Attraction" Released!
« Reply #36 on: April 06, 2013, 04:26:14 pm »
I just booted up a game from a month and a half ago, and my Spire Frigates feel like vaporous blobs of paste compared to the newly buffed spire starship (I'm not sure if I should be elated or disappointed)
Well, bear in mind that the spire starship has a cap of 1, so it's gotta pack a lot into the one ship ;)  Whereas you get multiple frigates even at the refugee-outpost level.

Hmm I had a weird thought. If Spire Frigate is the smallest ship Fallen Spire maintain and Spire Starship is the largest human/spire hybrid ship. Then where do Spire Corvette fit? Spire corvette are smaller than Spire Starship, I am assuming to fit more modules?

I am ignoring the shadow spire champion ship size since it is not a "traditional" ship so to speak.
I don't think Keith was talking about "size" as in dimensions or pixels on your screen.

When he said it's gotta "pack" a lot into one ship, he meant a lot of FIREPOWER.  The Spire Starship, because of its high cost and low cap, is extremely powerful for 1 ship. The Spire Corvettes are also strong too, but in a different way than the Spire Starship. They are a lot less durable, but can do more damage overall with their neat modules, and can shield allied ships with their forcefields.
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Offline contingencyplan

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Re: AI War Beta 6.016 "Deflecting Attraction" Released!
« Reply #37 on: April 06, 2013, 10:07:42 pm »
A quick question. Engine damage is supposed to auto-repair, right, which is why the "minimum speed = 1" was dropped back to 0?

Is that auto-repair disabled when ships receive regular non-engine damage? I have a Plasma Siege SS that got its engines knocked out by some spiders. It's essentially permanently in-range of a wormhole guardpost, so I can't repair it with engineers, and its engines don't seem to be recovering at all (though perhaps there's a time limit I wasn't aware of?).

Are my options to take out the wormhole posts or delete my Plasma SS?

Offline keith.lamothe

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Re: AI War Beta 6.016 "Deflecting Attraction" Released!
« Reply #38 on: April 06, 2013, 10:23:42 pm »
A quick question. Engine damage is supposed to auto-repair, right, which is why the "minimum speed = 1" was dropped back to 0?

Is that auto-repair disabled when ships receive regular non-engine damage? I have a Plasma Siege SS that got its engines knocked out by some spiders. It's essentially permanently in-range of a wormhole guardpost, so I can't repair it with engineers, and its engines don't seem to be recovering at all (though perhaps there's a time limit I wasn't aware of?).

Are my options to take out the wormhole posts or delete my Plasma SS?
I think if you were to bring in a forcefield (a riot's would do) and cover the plasma-ss, the plasma-ss would cease taking damage and could be repaired after a brief time.  This wouldn't work with a ff-emitting unit that was engine-dead since those take damage when "touching" ffs take damage, but it should work here.

Alternatively just something distracting the wh-gp with other targets could do the trick but that's at the mercy of the retargeting logic.
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Offline Aeson

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Re: AI War Beta 6.016 "Deflecting Attraction" Released!
« Reply #39 on: April 06, 2013, 10:27:31 pm »
@Vyndicu:
I tend to view the Spire Corvette as either a stripped-down (and somewhat improved, in some ways) version of the Spire Starship, which makes use of the greater understanding of Spire technology resulting from contact with the Imperial Spire to allow the mounting of Human/Spire modules, or as a Spire Frigate enhanced with human technology resulting from the development of the Spire Starship and modules for the Imperial Spire warships you can get in the FS campaign. The description of the ship indicates more that it is a stripped-down Spire Frigate outfitted with extra human weapons, but its statistics look more like a stripped down version of the Spire Starship, and the modules are the same kinds of things you can mount on Spire Destroyers or other larger Spire warships (I haven't checked the statistics of the modules, though, so it might not have the same modules, just the same types of modules).

Also, the Spire Starship isn't really a Human/Spire hybrid (although possibly we could argue that the newer iterations of the Spire Starships are, with the old versions representing the attempt at imitating the unspecified artifacts in its description, and the enhancements made representing contact with the Imperial Spire granting greater understanding of the technology that the Human factions attempted to replicate, and possibly some direct technical assistance from the Imperial Spire). It is more an imitation of what the humans thought the Spire technology was based off of unspecified artifacts, or a result of attempts to reverse-engineer Imperial Spire technology based on derelicts, debris, or other things like that, rather than a concerted effort to mesh two technology bases. I'd say that the Spire Corvette (and arguably the modules you can add to Spire Destroyers and higher) represents the first real hybridization of the Human and Spire technology bases, with both factions being involved in its development.

The above, however, is just my view on this.

As for where the Corvette fits in the ship line-up, I'd put it between the Spire Frigate and the Spire Destroyer/Starship in size and power, despite its name indicating that it should be smaller and weaker than the Spire Frigate. Perhaps consider the Spire Corvette as a Battlecruiser while the Spire Starship is a Battleship - ship types with similar damage potential (that being "lots"), and one trades a lot of durability for a slight speed advantage (in this case it's more a trade-off between firepower and durability, since although the Corvette does have a very slight speed advantage, the difference is mostly in its module-based firepower and lower base health).

Offline contingencyplan

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Re: AI War Beta 6.016 "Deflecting Attraction" Released!
« Reply #40 on: April 07, 2013, 05:29:11 am »
A quick question. Engine damage is supposed to auto-repair, right, which is why the "minimum speed = 1" was dropped back to 0?

Is that auto-repair disabled when ships receive regular non-engine damage? I have a Plasma Siege SS that got its engines knocked out by some spiders. It's essentially permanently in-range of a wormhole guardpost, so I can't repair it with engineers, and its engines don't seem to be recovering at all (though perhaps there's a time limit I wasn't aware of?).

Are my options to take out the wormhole posts or delete my Plasma SS?
I think if you were to bring in a forcefield (a riot's would do) and cover the plasma-ss, the plasma-ss would cease taking damage and could be repaired after a brief time.  This wouldn't work with a ff-emitting unit that was engine-dead since those take damage when "touching" ffs take damage, but it should work here.

Alternatively just something distracting the wh-gp with other targets could do the trick but that's at the mercy of the retargeting logic.

Figured there was some way to deal with it; re-loading the save (with the engineers already present) caused the wormhole posts to start targeting the engineers, solving the problem as well. Something like a FF might work, aside from the inbound champion counter :-P.

My question was more to is the "(no engine repair ~ no repair period) on damage" flag intended? Would there be game-breaking consequences to permitting engine-damaged ships to "run away" via self-repair if they're no longer under engine-damaging attacks? (I do realize this would work both ways.)

Offline Bognor

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Re: AI War Beta 6.016 "Deflecting Attraction" Released!
« Reply #41 on: April 07, 2013, 11:34:30 pm »
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Offline TechSY730

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Re: AI War Beta 6.016 "Deflecting Attraction" Released!
« Reply #42 on: April 09, 2013, 12:26:40 pm »
For the next version's title name, "Defending The AI's Front Lawn", I can't help but laugh at that.
I am picturing an old robot sitting on a somewhat rundown front porch on a rocking chair with a shotgun yelling "You darn humans get off ma' front lawn".



Of course, though, that shotgun probably shoots like 50 ultra high strength lasers, and he has a couple hundred Mk. V attack ships behind a fence in his backyard...

Offline keith.lamothe

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Re: AI War Beta 6.016 "Deflecting Attraction" Released!
« Reply #43 on: April 09, 2013, 01:21:39 pm »
a couple hundred Mk. V attack ships behind a fence in his backyard...
With a sign saying "Beware of Wrath Lance".
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Offline keith.lamothe

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Re: AI War Beta 6.016 "Deflecting Attraction" Released!
« Reply #44 on: April 09, 2013, 01:23:20 pm »
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