Author Topic: AI War Beta 3.719, "And There Was Much Rejoicing," Released!  (Read 9726 times)

TheMachineIsSentient

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Re: AI War Beta 3.719, "And There Was Much Rejoicing," Released!
« Reply #15 on: October 19, 2010, 10:20:27 pm »
We had a nice game of multiplayer tonight in the QA lounge. It felt a little more laggy than usual, but it's hard to tell if the locations are the issue, as we are far apart. Other than that, only a few defects came up, and certainly some user interface things can be done to make  multiplayer easier. Those are opened in the bug tracker. But it was fun, overall, and things look good. Nice to see Keith make an appearance as well. Don't be a stranger!

Offline RCIX

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Re: AI War Beta 3.719, "And There Was Much Rejoicing," Released!
« Reply #16 on: October 19, 2010, 10:57:46 pm »
Really like the new updates :)

How can i activate the draggable planets though?

Also, how do i force units to group-move by default? The toggle in the bottom left is gone :(
« Last Edit: October 19, 2010, 11:09:47 pm by RCIX »
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Offline x4000

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Re: AI War Beta 3.719, "And There Was Much Rejoicing," Released!
« Reply #17 on: October 19, 2010, 11:27:06 pm »
I'm overwhelmed as I went from 3.1...something to this in one fell swoop!

Definitely a big update!  :)

One minor issue I have found is that unit selection doesn't always make the click sound. Sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't, and I keep finding myself double-checking to make sure I picked a unit and didn't miss clicking on it.

Would you mind logging defects and suggestions in the bug tracker?  Thanks, and glad you're enjoying it! http://www.arcengames.com/mantisbt

We had a nice game of multiplayer tonight in the QA lounge. It felt a little more laggy than usual, but it's hard to tell if the locations are the issue, as we are far apart. Other than that, only a few defects came up, and certainly some user interface things can be done to make  multiplayer easier. Those are opened in the bug tracker. But it was fun, overall, and things look good. Nice to see Keith make an appearance as well. Don't be a stranger!

That's wonderful!  Glad things seem to be winding down, and working better overall.  As far as the lag goes, I wouldn't think it would be any moreso now than usual, most of the networking hasn't changed in ages, but I'll keep an eye out for it.  Anyway, that's quite refreshing to hear. :)

Really like the new updates :)

I'm glad!

How can i activate the draggable planets though?

Um... to be honest, I don't know how you activated them in the old version of the game, I never used them.  If it's the context menu, then probably those aren't re-implemented yet, and most likely won't be until after 4.0 comes out.  We're just in super crunch-mode at the moment, and some of the peripheral features like that (and in-game graphs, most of the other context-menu stuff that isn't currently there) probably won't make it until after the 4.0 cutoff.

Also, how do i force units to group-move by default? The toggle in the bottom left is gone :(

It's not gone, it just moved. :)  It's in the Ctrl window now, with the other control-node-like stuff.  There just wasn't a reason to have this on the screen as a big toggle, it wasn't that important to get at so quickly, because of the G hotkey that lets you do it when you need it fast.
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Offline KingIsaacLinksr

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Re: AI War Beta 3.719, "And There Was Much Rejoicing," Released!
« Reply #18 on: October 19, 2010, 11:33:29 pm »
Oh btw, just thought I'd chime in and I know these features were implemented patches ago, but:

S-Cntrl nodes being made into a menu setting area = awesomesauce, I just can't thank you enough for making that easier ;)
All Mark 1 turrets available is awesome.  I never liked how few we got at the beginning and now I can focus on more important stuff about AIW, rather than the turret research.
Balancing changes have been great.
And everything else, graphics especially, my eyes thank you a lot for making this game easier and more beautiful for them.  :)  

Not at all useful for this patch, but I thought it just needed saying.  Fox and I got our butts kicked twice in 3.178 by game-enders within 6 & 15mins so hopefully you've fixed it in this patch, might find out tomorrow.  

Keep it up for the stretch home!  (If you guys even think 4.0 is "home" xD)

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Offline Mánagarmr

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Re: AI War Beta 3.719, "And There Was Much Rejoicing," Released!
« Reply #19 on: October 20, 2010, 12:25:13 am »
Yeah, most likely the "swarm of MK IV guardians" that wipes us out were ye old Devourer golem stirring up crap. That should be fixed for this release, afaik.
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Offline Gallant Dragon

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Re: AI War Beta 3.719, "And There Was Much Rejoicing," Released!
« Reply #20 on: October 20, 2010, 12:42:20 am »
Game-ending swarm of ships = Sir Robin's Minstrels
Arcen Development Team = A bunch of starving knights.

There was much rejoicing.
It's just carriers all the way down!

Offline RogueThunder

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Re: AI War Beta 3.719, "And There Was Much Rejoicing," Released!
« Reply #21 on: October 20, 2010, 01:08:20 am »
Hmmm.

Finally have had some time to play with the new betas...

Guardians... are getting to me. I understand they're supposed to be something of a counter-attack...

That said, A: Laser Guardians move 12 speed faster than their triangle counter... Which isn't terribly effective since bonuses Vs Swarm armor seem to be kept low. Appropriate for every other swarm ship I suspect... but...
B: I had a Laser Guardian attack me from another system I had never entered with anything but a pile of scouts. Ah... Doesn't seem right. (I was saved by my love for Logistics Stations...)
« Last Edit: October 20, 2010, 01:11:11 am by RogueThunder »
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Offline Mánagarmr

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Re: AI War Beta 3.719, "And There Was Much Rejoicing," Released!
« Reply #22 on: October 20, 2010, 01:12:03 am »
Guardians require a whole new line of thinking, and scouts tend to anger guardians. Therefor scouting needs to be a bit more careful than usual, because there is a risk that the guardians will counterattack (however not very likely).
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Offline Gallant Dragon

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Re: AI War Beta 3.719, "And There Was Much Rejoicing," Released!
« Reply #23 on: October 20, 2010, 01:19:50 am »
Wasn't guardians being aggravated by scouts fixed?
It's just carriers all the way down!

Offline Shardz

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Re: AI War Beta 3.719, "And There Was Much Rejoicing," Released!
« Reply #24 on: October 20, 2010, 01:31:49 am »
I just got smeared by a fleet of MkV Guardians, some Zenith Starships and a ton of other support units. I just had one unit peep into a wormhole and they ALL came seeping through like crazy for the big win. My main support fleet of 1,300+ ships MkI - III's were all destroyed in about 15 seconds. I then watched this mass of about 400+ MkV ships devour each planet in about 35 seconds each...then I lost.

I don't think the Guardian hostility thing is quite over yet...   >:(

Offline x4000

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Re: AI War Beta 3.719, "And There Was Much Rejoicing," Released!
« Reply #25 on: October 20, 2010, 02:47:31 am »
kingisaaclinksr, glad you're enjoying it so well and thanks for the kind words.  I'm really pleased with how this is shaping up, too.

Guardians getting stirred up by scouts should indeed be fixed.  We've seen no evidence of them being stirred up by that specifically since 3.717, in 3.718 it was all devourers to our knowledge.  Please correct us if that's not so.

Regarding the laser guardians in particular, you need to use siege starships or similar on them.  Every guardian (and indeed, every unit in general now) doesn't have a core triangle unit counter, but it does have a counter somewhere in all your new unlocks of starships, turrets, etc.  Generally a starship will suffice.  If you try to play without starships now, though, you'll get eaten alive most likely.  It's a shift for me, too.  Of course, depending on your bonus ships that you unlock, you might have more or fewer starships actually needed in terms of counters for things like guardians, etc.

I just got smeared by a fleet of MkV Guardians, some Zenith Starships and a ton of other support units. I just had one unit peep into a wormhole and they ALL came seeping through like crazy for the big win. My main support fleet of 1,300+ ships MkI - III's were all destroyed in about 15 seconds. I then watched this mass of about 400+ MkV ships devour each planet in about 35 seconds each...then I lost.

I don't think the Guardian hostility thing is quite over yet...   >:(

If this wasn't a scout, then this is exactly the intended behavior.  They are very, very hostile except to scouts.  Poking your head into an AI planet that is high level with anything but a scout is a very dangerous thing to do, like poking your head into any enemy encampment in real life.  Fear the AI. ;)

I haven't thought about this with transports too much, though.  Any thoughts on how that is working for the moment, anyone?  Those might need to be given the same immunity from enraging the guards that scouts have.

Generally speaking, with the lower-level planets it should become self evident to players that this is what is happening by the time they reach a mark V world.  By the time you reach the really high level worlds, though, this becomes a very real danger.  Of course, if you're using an older savegame where you already have proximity to those sorts of worlds, then you wouldn't have the opportunity to go through that discovery process in a safe fashion, if you see what I mean.  It's not supposed to just obliterate you without warning, you're supposed to instinctively know not to prod that particular hornet nest without care by the time you reach one that's so deadly.  But existing saves, etc, can really mess with that.
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Offline Ozymandiaz

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Re: AI War Beta 3.719, "And There Was Much Rejoicing," Released!
« Reply #26 on: October 20, 2010, 03:18:59 am »
Looks good!
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Offline zebramatt

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Re: AI War Beta 3.719, "And There Was Much Rejoicing," Released!
« Reply #27 on: October 20, 2010, 03:46:42 am »
It's definitely getting there in leaps and bounds - this build feels almost ready to go!

Offline keith.lamothe

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Re: AI War Beta 3.719, "And There Was Much Rejoicing," Released!
« Reply #28 on: October 20, 2010, 08:49:03 am »
If you try to play without starships now, though, you'll get eaten alive most likely.  It's a shift for me, too.  Of course, depending on your bonus ships that you unlock, you might have more or fewer starships actually needed in terms of counters for things like guardians, etc.
Conceptually that seems fine, it's just a point of education for the player, but economically speaking a Siege MkI is pretty expensive in crystal, particularly when combined with a few tractor turrets, etc.  The massive boost to home-command-station m+c production helps a lot, just wondering if mandating starships in their current form is a bit much on the early game economy ;)  But the players would know better than I would, I don't actually get to play much nowadays.

Quote
If this wasn't a scout, then this is exactly the intended behavior.  They are very, very hostile except to scouts.  Poking your head into an AI planet that is high level with anything but a scout is a very dangerous thing to do, like poking your head into any enemy encampment in real life.  Fear the AI. ;)

I haven't thought about this with transports too much, though.  Any thoughts on how that is working for the moment, anyone?  Those might need to be given the same immunity from enraging the guards that scouts have.
My understanding from the code is that the guardians will not actually free themselves unless the offender actually fires upon them (or the guard post or some other guard of the guard post), so transports would be safe.  Has anyone seen differently in 3.719?
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Offline Sizzle

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Re: AI War Beta 3.719, "And There Was Much Rejoicing," Released!
« Reply #29 on: October 20, 2010, 09:29:47 am »
Quote
If this wasn't a scout, then this is exactly the intended behavior.  They are very, very hostile except to scouts.  Poking your head into an AI planet that is high level with anything but a scout is a very dangerous thing to do, like poking your head into any enemy encampment in real life.  Fear the AI. ;)

I haven't thought about this with transports too much, though.  Any thoughts on how that is working for the moment, anyone?  Those might need to be given the same immunity from enraging the guards that scouts have.
My understanding from the code is that the guardians will not actually free themselves unless the offender actually fires upon them (or the guard post or some other guard of the guard post), so transports would be safe.  Has anyone seen differently in 3.719?

So conceptually if you ran in a fleet under a cloaker or low power they'd not free themselves?