Author Topic: Steam Activation  (Read 5000 times)

Offline RedViv

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 4
Steam Activation
« on: November 30, 2010, 06:33:08 am »
Oi, I just tried to add my A.I. War serial (purchased from Impulse way back) to Steam, and it tells me that this key is already activated on an existing Steam account. Is that because Impulse keys are incompatible (looking through the forums, I see nothing pointing to that), or is there a completely different problem?

Offline keith.lamothe

  • Arcen Games Staff
  • Arcen Staff
  • Zenith Council Member Mark III
  • *****
  • Posts: 19,505
Re: Steam Activation
« Reply #1 on: November 30, 2010, 08:31:23 am »
Impulse keys should work.

My guess is a pirate got the same key from a keygen and activated it on steam.  Which takes a degree of nerve.
Have ideas or bug reports for one of our games? Mantis for Suggestions and Bug Reports. Thanks for helping to make our games better!

Offline x4000

  • Chris McElligott Park, Arcen Founder and Lead Dev
  • Arcen Staff
  • Zenith Council Member Mark III
  • *****
  • Posts: 31,651
Re: Steam Activation
« Reply #2 on: November 30, 2010, 09:42:44 am »
Have ideas or bug reports for one of our games?  Mantis for Suggestions and Bug Reports. Thanks for helping to make our games better!

Offline RedViv

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 4
Re: Steam Activation
« Reply #3 on: November 30, 2010, 10:48:58 am »
Yep.  That's most likely what it is: http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1543880
Alright, then I shall proceed to contact the Steam support, providing a receipt and such. Even if the person in that thread did not succeed there.
Down with those nasty pirates, I say. There's no reason to do this to a game like this, a dev like you guys here, not even a shallow "rebellion against the establishment" one.  :(
« Last Edit: November 30, 2010, 10:54:11 am by RedViv »

Offline keith.lamothe

  • Arcen Games Staff
  • Arcen Staff
  • Zenith Council Member Mark III
  • *****
  • Posts: 19,505
Re: Steam Activation
« Reply #4 on: November 30, 2010, 10:52:39 am »
Alright, then I shall proceed to contact the Steam support, providing a receipt and such.
Down with those nasty pirates, I say. There's no reason to do this to a game like this, a dev like you guys here, not even a shallow "rebellion against the establishment" one.  :(
There's not even a practical reason, honestly, since there's no drm, etc.  If they want to abuse an honor system it's very simple: act dishonorably, just use the same key someone else bought.  But they really felt the need to make a keygen AND to register the keys thus gotten in steam, thus robbing other customers of the chance to do so.  Granted, the pirates in question probably don't realize that registering the key in steam does that.  Anyway, don't want to waste any more mental cycles on the subject, got bugs to fix.
Have ideas or bug reports for one of our games? Mantis for Suggestions and Bug Reports. Thanks for helping to make our games better!

Offline RedViv

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 4
Re: Steam Activation
« Reply #5 on: November 30, 2010, 10:56:40 am »
Anyway, don't want to waste any more mental cycles on the subject, got bugs to fix.
Aye, proceed. I've already wasted too much time being angry about this, too, but as a translator I'm kind of dependant on games companies surviving. ^^

Offline dumpsterKEEPER

  • Sr. Member Mark II
  • ****
  • Posts: 361
Re: Steam Activation
« Reply #6 on: November 30, 2010, 11:40:49 am »
Yep.  That's most likely what it is: http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1543880
Alright, then I shall proceed to contact the Steam support, providing a receipt and such. Even if the person in that thread did not succeed there.
Down with those nasty pirates, I say. There's no reason to do this to a game like this, a dev like you guys here, not even a shallow "rebellion against the establishment" one.  :(

As you pointed out, most likely Steam will just turn you away. I ran into this myself trying to register the Zenith Remnant expansion and contacted Steam about it. Once they found out it was purchased through another online store, they said they couldn't help me and told me to contact my place of purchase instead. That really just puts me in a bit of a loop though, as the seller sold me a perfectly valid key and the problem is really with the registration on Steam. It's not Steam's fault, but I wish there was some other way to resolve the problem.

Anyway, just wanted to point out that the experience in that thread isn't unique, for what it's worth.

Offline RedViv

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 4
Re: Steam Activation
« Reply #7 on: November 30, 2010, 11:55:30 am »
Well, then it's three of us now. They told me that they can't go and block that guy with MY serial, though I did hand them my proof of purchase.
...
Oh well, it's only about 14 Euros right now to get everything A.I. War again, I'll just give you swell folks more money. ^_^

Offline echelonone

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 6
Re: Steam Activation
« Reply #8 on: December 31, 2010, 09:04:10 pm »
I also have this same problem. I think that Arcen and Steam should get together to resolve this issue for us legitimate owners/customers, or should provide us with another working serial number.
« Last Edit: December 31, 2010, 09:19:28 pm by echelonone »

Offline ShadowOTE

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 517
Re: Steam Activation
« Reply #9 on: January 01, 2011, 03:55:30 am »
It sounds like this is just a case of valve/steam not having spent the time or resources chasing after what is (to them) a problem facing a very minor subset of their total user base. Yes, it sucks, but short of a large outcry for providing publishers and such a way to resolve this issue it's unlikely to be resolved. That said, by all means raise a fuss on the steam forums and start calling them - it's possible with enough people pushing it might just get fixed.


Edit - of course, there is (theoretically) an easy fix to prevent this from being a problem. Steam could provide publishers a way to submit all sold cd keys. If you try to register a key not on the list it doesn't let you, even if it's valid. The publisher would, of course, have to let you know that it will be X amount of time before you can register with steam/impulse/whatever, but that's a fair trade-off for this particular edge case.
« Last Edit: January 01, 2011, 04:05:26 am by ShadowOTE »

Offline keith.lamothe

  • Arcen Games Staff
  • Arcen Staff
  • Zenith Council Member Mark III
  • *****
  • Posts: 19,505
Re: Steam Activation
« Reply #10 on: January 01, 2011, 10:36:16 am »
It sounds like this is just a case of valve/steam not having spent the time or resources chasing after what is (to them) a problem facing a very minor subset of their total user base. Yes, it sucks, but short of a large outcry for providing publishers and such a way to resolve this issue it's unlikely to be resolved. That said, by all means raise a fuss on the steam forums and start calling them - it's possible with enough people pushing it might just get fixed.

Well, actually, I don't think that would work.  You see, for them to let you use keys bought elsewhere to activate the game on steam and gain access to all the benefits of having actually purchased it on steam (including downloading it through them, which costs them money)... is a courtesy.  They don't have to do it.  The problem of someone else having pirated the "remote" key and having beaten the legitimate customer "to the punch" and activating it on steam first is one of those that's tough enough that they'd probably be more likely to just stop doing the cross-activations altogether.  More trouble than it's worth.  Honestly, if I were in their position that's how I'd see it, if people kept fussing at me about it.

Quote
Edit - of course, there is (theoretically) an easy fix to prevent this from being a problem. Steam could provide publishers a way to submit all sold cd keys. If you try to register a key not on the list it doesn't let you, even if it's valid. The publisher would, of course, have to let you know that it will be X amount of time before you can register with steam/impulse/whatever, but that's a fair trade-off for this particular edge case.
We don't actually know which keys have been sold by which other distributors, only those keys purchased directly through our own store.  And I'm not actually sure if we have particularly easy access to that data (Chris handles all the store stuff).

Anyway, the core problem here is that some users are stealing from legitimate customers by activating pirated keys on steam (and on impulse too, I guess, dunno).  We don't put any DRM (aside from the super-unaware serial key system; without it you couldn't activate the game on steam at all) in our game because we don't want to inconvenience legitimate customers. However in this case some pirates have declined to show the same courtesy.  Perhaps (hopefully) they did not realize how the system works and that they were directly harming other users.

Thankfully, that theft only applies to access to the benefits of having bought the game through steam when you actually bought it somewhere else.  We do try to make clear that we can't 100% guarantee that access anyway.  The only way to do that is to buy directly from steam.

As for us issuing replacement keys to folks experiencing this, there are a number of logistical and other issues with that solution.  It's up to Chris in any event.
« Last Edit: January 01, 2011, 10:40:41 am by keith.lamothe »
Have ideas or bug reports for one of our games? Mantis for Suggestions and Bug Reports. Thanks for helping to make our games better!

Offline ShadowOTE

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 517
Re: Steam Activation
« Reply #11 on: January 01, 2011, 01:30:30 pm »
Yeah, Keith pretty much sums it up. As I said, for steam it's a minor problem that would be far too much trouble to justify.

As far as my other suggestion goes... it was 4am and I couldn't sleep. Since then I've thought it over a bit more, and there are some legitimate problems there (such as the one you mentioned). That said, I can't see any other way to counter this particular issue without running into the "too much time and money to justify fixing" problem.

Offline echelonone

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 6
Re: Steam Activation
« Reply #12 on: January 01, 2011, 10:03:27 pm »
I also have this same problem. I think that Arcen and Steam should get together to resolve this issue for us legitimate owners/customers, or should provide us with another working serial number.

See my Steam post:  http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?p=19993410#post19993410

Offline keith.lamothe

  • Arcen Games Staff
  • Arcen Staff
  • Zenith Council Member Mark III
  • *****
  • Posts: 19,505
Re: Steam Activation
« Reply #13 on: January 01, 2011, 10:39:16 pm »
In response to the question "What is Arcen going to do for me as a paying/supportive costumer?" from that post, the answer is: I don't know, ask Chris.  In case he's not following this particular forum topic, you can reach him at [email protected] .

But, for what it's worth, the problems you are experiencing are with the services of the distributors themselves rather than anything over which we are directly able to control.  We've done what we can so that you can always play the actual games you purchased because you can take a key purchased _anywhere_ and use it to activate a copy downloaded from any of the mirrors (a list is here ).

I do sympathize with your plight (particularly not being able to buy the expansions direct through steam because it won't take your key), but I hope you can also sympathize with ours, in that we're limited in what we can reasonably be expected to do about the consequences of some third-party's irresponsible behavior (someone using a keygen and then actually activating the key in steam) on your ability to use the services of another third party (steam/impulse).  We can ensure that you can play the games and get access to all the updates and support available for them, and we have done that.

All that said, I probably shouldn't say so much as I'm really not the person who can either grant or deny any request you as a customer might make; if you're wanting some kind of refund or replacement key or whatever you'll need to talk to Chris.
Have ideas or bug reports for one of our games? Mantis for Suggestions and Bug Reports. Thanks for helping to make our games better!

Offline x4000

  • Chris McElligott Park, Arcen Founder and Lead Dev
  • Arcen Staff
  • Zenith Council Member Mark III
  • *****
  • Posts: 31,651
Re: Steam Activation
« Reply #14 on: January 03, 2011, 12:27:11 pm »
Thanks for your patience, I've been away given that it was both the weekend and a holiiday, but I've responded already to that other post (just saw this one after having already made a post over there).
Have ideas or bug reports for one of our games?  Mantis for Suggestions and Bug Reports. Thanks for helping to make our games better!