Author Topic: How would you go about taking out 1100+ turrets on a planet?  (Read 2464 times)

Offline Rustayne

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In my current game, I just managed to wittle down over 4000 ships, down to 0, but there are still over 1100 turrets in the surrounding area.  On the gate I have access to, there is probably 400-500 turrets all grouped up from guard posts, the station, and 2 warp gates that were close by, that pretty much destroy me before I have a chance to get anywhere.  I figure with the type of game I'm playing I'm going to have to deal with this more then just this once, so what would be an effective way of clearing them out without sending wave after wave of ships in to take out 10-20 at a time? 

Offline x4000

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Re: How would you go about taking out 1100+ turrets on a planet?
« Reply #1 on: June 22, 2010, 10:11:36 am »
Well, there are a few different ways that that can be addressed.  But, before I speak directly to that, on the subject of whittling down the over 4000 ships, did you consider just raiding the guard posts and/or the command station?  That "frees" the ships that were on guard duty, which means that they then are likely to come over to your planets if you aren't right on their plants at the moment.  That might not sound like much, and in fact in some circumstances could be a hugely bad thing, but if you play your cards right that can mean you're fighting their forces on your planet near your turrets, rather than on their planet around their turrets, which is an immense tactical advantage if you can survive their onslaught.

Tangent aside, here are various ways you could go about this; various techniques could be used individually or in tandem:

1. You could use lightning warheads to clear the immediate wormhole area, freeing your guys to come through, but that comes at an AIP cost.

2. You could use EMP warheads to freeze the turrets for a while, giving yourself 30 seconds (per EMP) of free reign.

3. You could bring fleet starships along (light, flagship, etc) with some bombers and fighters to boost their strength when attacking the turret balls (that only works so well).

4. You could just leave the turrets until you destroy the command stations on all the adjacent planets to your target planet, at which time the turrets will go out of supply and will be laughably easy to kill because they won't even be able to shoot at you.

5. You could build a force field generator of some sort and group-move your fleet around with that on the enemy planet (it can go through wormholes), so that you're hurting the AI turrets without them obliterating you.  But, your firepower would go down by 75%, so that's pretty harsh.  Including fleet starships under the forcefield would help, but only so much.

6. A mobile repair station fully outfitted with tugs can really help with the survivability of your ships in a situation like this.

7. If you have Zenith Bombards, those can take out turrets from outside their range, which is immensely useful although expensive in metal and crystal (and you still have to get them to an initial safe location).

8. Speaking of getting your ships to an initial safe location, you can use transports to do that, which are now knowledge-free (in the latest betas).

9. In general, I would recommend holding Z+X every so often, to see the enemy attack range circles.  Unload your transport outside of any of those, then move your ships to attack turrets that are just under one big circle of ranges, rather than under the intersection of 2-3 partially-overlapping turret balls.  Basically what is being shown in that one tactics video on the videos page for AI War.  If you choose which turret ball to attack based on that sort of thing, then you'll take the least amount of damage possible at any given time, which hugely boosts survivability.


And... I'm sure there are other things, too, that can be done.  But hopefully those are a good start. :)
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Offline Rustayne

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Re: How would you go about taking out 1100+ turrets on a planet?
« Reply #2 on: June 22, 2010, 10:25:28 am »
For your top part that is exactly what I did.  I took my mk1 and mk2 fighters into transports, moved them to the guard post, and blew it up, sending 300-400 ships into my turrets around the gate on the other side.  I did this til all the posts were down, and then grabbed my fleet and transported them all over to blow the station up. 

I have dreads, riots, and flagships as my starships at this point, and they don't seem to be helping out that much hehe. 

I've considered the missile idea, but I'm not sure if I want to raise my AIP or not.  Factoring on a min of 2500 AIP by the time I finish this game, I'm not sure jacking it up anymore or not would matter.  I have never gotten past mk2 in terms of AIP before, I typically get like 10-15 planets, then start to lay siege towards their home worlds. 

As far as cutting supply off, that at the moment is impossible as there is a black hole machine on the system, and the turrets are making it a bit hard to pop it, so I can warp to the other planets and do that.  I guess I could try the transport idea for it, but it does seem like the turrets have better range then what my ships I currently have available to me do, so they still might get torn up.

Now for another question, since it kind of affects this.  Will my AIP matter if it goes up past the min I have calculated?  Missiles seems like the best option, but if there is going to be a big difference between say 2500 and 3000, then I would think this option is probably not my best option.

I look forward to your response. :)

Rustayne

Offline x4000

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Re: How would you go about taking out 1100+ turrets on a planet?
« Reply #3 on: June 22, 2010, 10:33:12 am »
Cool stuff.  Misc responses:

1. Your dreads might also do okay against the turrets if you can keep them out of range of the turrets.  I know they are good against force fields, but I can't remember about with turrets.

2. Yeah, keep those riots out of there for the most part, if I recall.  They are awesome for responding to an incoming wash of ships to your planet, though, especially if you have all those engine-killing parts on them.

3. Past a certain point the AIP definitely does not make a substantial difference (except in terms of CPAs), but I think that point is something more like 4000 or so.  It's hard to remember exactly, and varies by difficulty, but you can calculate it for your difficulty using the data on this page: http://arcengames.com/mediawiki/index.php?title=AI_War_-_AI_Techs 

Most likely you'll be at Mark V already by the time you hit 2500 AIP, so probably it's the difference in the size of the waves and CPAs, and little more than that.  But, that said, there's also some relevance to when you hit that sort of extreme AIP level.  If it's too early in the game, you might not have either the economy or bottlenecks set up that you'll need to survive the massive waves and raids of Core ships.

I've never played that style of campaign before, to be honest, so I'm not the best to give advice on it.  Kalzarius had a marathon 2p game where they cleared out all of 100 planets in something like 66 game hours, so he might be able to answer some questions if you post in his threads.  He's got some AARs up in the AAR section, so those might also provide some interesting reading as the closest other example on the forums to what you're doing (to my knowledge).

Good luck!
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Offline Rustayne

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Re: How would you go about taking out 1100+ turrets on a planet?
« Reply #4 on: June 22, 2010, 10:41:48 am »
Has far as the economy goes, right now I'm quite set.  Thanks to the wonderful updates on mk2 and mk3 stations, my economy is sitting at roughly 900-160 or so.  I have 11 planets behind my bottleneck captured and the rest of the map is on the other side. :)  I will go reading in the AAR and see what I can find about this game your talking about.  It seems like an insane challenge to do this, and that is why I'm attempting it.  The AI is this game is so tactical and I love it.  Thanks again for being so quick and through.


Offline x4000

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Re: How would you go about taking out 1100+ turrets on a planet?
« Reply #5 on: June 22, 2010, 10:47:35 am »
All sounds good!  And, my pleasure. :)

One thing I will say, about responding to high-level CPAs: the ability to near-instantly replenish your forces is an absolute godsend, so by the time you are getting to the late game you may need something like 3000-100 of metal and crystal during normal circumstances, so that it can crank up to 3000-3000 during big fights, with maybe 3-6 docks each with 6+ engineers on them all cranking out replacement ships just as fast as your existing ones die.  That can get expensive fast.

And when you're otherwise not having to expend those sorts of resources, of course you can instead then be sinking that excess cash into mercenaries so that it doesn't go to waste.

Definitely an extreme challenge for sure, especially at higher difficulties.  Will be interested to hear how this goes. :)
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Offline pierre dupon

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Re: How would you go about taking out 1100+ turrets on a planet?
« Reply #6 on: June 22, 2010, 11:05:16 am »
Something that's worked well for me: if you have supply build a fortress in an empty area. Defend it with a small fleet and it'll wipe the turrets over time. Might take upwards of an hour to do 1k turrets, but if you combine that with bombers, dreads etc then the planet should empty fast enough. I set my fortresses a priority target of tractors so that the bombers dont get stuck on one turret ball for too long.

Offline x4000

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Re: How would you go about taking out 1100+ turrets on a planet?
« Reply #7 on: June 22, 2010, 11:16:50 am »
Oh, that's a really good idea.  I never think to do that, but fortresses would be a really excellent way of handling this.  The newer fortresses with the multiple mark levels would now make that even easier to do.
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Offline Rustayne

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Re: How would you go about taking out 1100+ turrets on a planet?
« Reply #8 on: June 22, 2010, 11:31:00 am »
That is a really good idea.  Could take a Forcefield mk3 in with a builder and build it, and let it do it's thing.  Thanks for the idea, Think I will give that a whirl and see how it works out.

Offline pierre dupon

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Re: How would you go about taking out 1100+ turrets on a planet?
« Reply #9 on: June 22, 2010, 11:37:26 am »
I usually dont even need a FF, unless there are turrets over the wormhole. I just send in a builder, 4-5 engineers and my support fleet. A mk1 fortress takes 30secs with 4engineers.
Let me know how it goes.  :)

Offline x4000

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Re: How would you go about taking out 1100+ turrets on a planet?
« Reply #10 on: June 22, 2010, 11:54:53 am »
Sending a scout starship along to help block sniper shots would also help well for that.
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Offline Rustayne

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Re: How would you go about taking out 1100+ turrets on a planet?
« Reply #11 on: June 22, 2010, 12:23:36 pm »
It worked out really well.  Took about 35 mins or so but a mk1 and an mk2 cleared it pretty good.  I also figured since I was in there, I could just colonize it to scrap the black hole machine, and then kill the station again.  So I've past road block 1, and now onto my next hub, a 3400 IV planet that looks wicked with all the ships moving between gates.  It looks like a square with an X through it. :)

Offline x4000

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Re: How would you go about taking out 1100+ turrets on a planet?
« Reply #12 on: June 22, 2010, 12:26:35 pm »
Cool stuff!
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Offline pierre dupon

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Re: How would you go about taking out 1100+ turrets on a planet?
« Reply #13 on: June 22, 2010, 12:59:21 pm »
Nice one! That's the reason I love this game!

rubikscube

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Re: How would you go about taking out 1100+ turrets on a planet?
« Reply #14 on: June 22, 2010, 04:13:30 pm »
x covered most but you can

1. keep on transport raiding (unless as soon as you get out transport you die)

2. warheads definetly good

3. your frigates are basically unstoppable unless they have setinal or lots of snipers

4. and mobile builders, force fields and other sneaky stuff