Author Topic: End Game Staging - Core Worlds  (Read 4783 times)

Offline ErictheRed

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End Game Staging - Core Worlds
« on: January 27, 2014, 10:05:51 am »
Ok, trying to win my first 7/7 and this is my current situation:

80 Planet map
AI Progress around 130
All Expansions enabled
4 out of 5 ARS taken
All core shield generators destroyed

I have almost the entire galaxy map scouted and know where the two AI homeworlds are.

I captured a Adv Factory early on and have devoted my research to fleet ship unlocks, as well as turrets and fortresses for defense (no starship research).  I believe a weakness of my current fleet is that I'm bomber heavy - I have Mark 1-5 bombers, Mark 1-2 Space Tanks, Mark 1-4 Fighters, and various other specialty ships obtained from ARS.   Also have a cursed golem, a mark 5 spirecraft ion and about 5 spirecraft martyr's.

The one mistake I know I have made was alerting a core planet.  I had to deep strike to take a planet 3 hops away from a AI homeworld.  I did not think I would be able to take the core world with a deep strike fleet; I wanted a staging area to build up defenses and refleet if necessary. 

Now the problem is the rapid build up of forces on the core world.  I have read many prior posts on this forum talking about how alerting a core world is a primal sin and now I am having difficulty figuring out how to get past it the homeworld, especially because when I send strike forces to neuter the core, it floods with reinforcements and a strategic reserve notification pops up. 

I have multiple saves leading up to this point, because I knew that alerting the core could make the game unwinnable.  It appears that I am at that point now. 

Are warp jammers a necessary tech to research for the end game (5000 research is steep!)?  I could possibly cloak a strike fleet and send them over to the homeworld, but I could probably expect to lose most if not all of them.  At this point, I don't think I can clear the core world but maybe that is not necessary.  The other AI homeworld is going to be even more of a problem since it has two core worlds in a row leading up to it.  I have no idea how to even begin cracking that nut.

Please let me know how you normally deal with core worlds bordering a homeworld and endgame strategies that avoid this kind of standoff. 

Offline Saya

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Re: End Game Staging - Core Worlds
« Reply #1 on: February 02, 2014, 02:51:39 am »
Alright since nobody care to respond I do my best with my crappy English.
Warp jammer are not necessary but are very helpful tools.

Since you have a cursed golem you can, provided you avoid or destroy anti-starship weapons, screen it with the space tanks + the fighters and let his firepower rip and tear whatever the AI throw at you.

Now for the main part, depending on the core world defense strategy varies but (my personal way of dealing with them) basically go like that.
-> Fortify my closest planet just in case.
-> Remove any highly annoying building, ion cannons, some guardposts & the likes using suicide runs.
-> Either spam ships while building a beachhead and tank the strategic reserve out or just send ships until the AI reach it's pre-programmed kill limit (so same thing, only happen if I can't build or feel like I can clear it this way.).
-> Destroy the command station and leave the planet unconquered unless it's my only front for obvious reason.
-> Push to the homeworld as fast as possible because it's a whole new level of pain if left on alert unchecked for too long.

Offline alocritani

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Re: End Game Staging - Core Worlds
« Reply #2 on: February 02, 2014, 05:13:22 am »
Can you post a savegame, so we can see the situation in a better way?

Anyway, I usually prefer to bypass core worlds entirely by cloaked assault transports. Of course first I create a tachyon-free path to homeworld by suicide runs (fighters, mostly, because they have bonus against tachyon emitters and are faster to rebuild)

The bad news is that homeworlds have planetary tachyon coverage, so forget any sneak approach.

I usually split my attack force in 2 or 3 groups: a single group of bombers and similar; another group of long range ships (frigates, mostly) and another one with short range ships (fighters).

Another thing very useful is the auto-kite feature in CTRL tab. I usually set limit to 5000. This way frigates will retreat away from attackers, giving them longer live. In this case, use attack-move (X + right click): in this way, when no more targets are in range, your ships will return to the assigned place. Otherwise they will be all scattered around, because of auto-kite behavior.

and yet, use scout starship for anti-sniper coverage; use mobile dock for repairing ships; don't underestimate long-range engine-damaging lasers of riot control starship; don't be afraid to conquer any planet close to your ones, easy to defend, in order to gain other knowledge.

Offline Histidine

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Re: End Game Staging - Core Worlds
« Reply #3 on: February 02, 2014, 08:38:01 am »
I set up my staging area two hops out from the target core world (so it doesn't go on alert), then use whatever means necessary (short of nukes, for obvious reasons) to neuter the core world and destroy things like ion cannons and OMDs on it. Once that's done, you can move through it with a high degree of (though by no means complete) safety, and you don't put the core world or the homeworld on permanent alert (this is very important if you need more than one run to kill it).
« Last Edit: February 02, 2014, 08:41:38 am by Histidine »

Offline Nodor

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Re: End Game Staging - Core Worlds
« Reply #4 on: February 03, 2014, 11:57:35 pm »
Alerting a core world for a bit.. is not fatal.
Keeping one on alert for a few hours can ruin your game.   

Standard moves:
Capture planet 2 jumps out of homeworld 1.
Blow up everything but the base on the adjacent core world (including wormhole guardposts) next to the first home world.
Refleet
Capture planet 2 jumps out of homeworld 2.
Blow up everything but the base on the adjacent core world (including wormhole guardposts) next to the second home world.
Refleet
Hit homeworld 1, taking down as many guard posts as possible/command station.
Refleet as needed.
Hit homeworld 2, taking down as many guard posts as possible/command station.
Refleet as needed.

Offline ErictheRed

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Re: End Game Staging - Core Worlds
« Reply #5 on: February 04, 2014, 02:02:04 pm »
Thanks for the responses.  I will try to post my latest save tonight.  I basically have attempted to follow Nodor's advice and started the process next to AI Homeworld 1.  Took the planet 2 hops away and setup a beachhead to neuter the core world adjacent to the homeworld.  The core world I am trying to clear has a mark III fortress contained within core shields so I'm currently having some difficulty.  I just realized that I could try to hack and destroy it so I will attempt that tonight.  the homeworld has been on alert for maybe 20 min or so as I have had my fleet on the coreworld to help secure my foothold. 

Offline ErictheRed

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Re: End Game Staging - Core Worlds
« Reply #6 on: February 04, 2014, 09:56:37 pm »
Attached is my latest save.  I backtracked a bit so my current position is a bit different from what I described.  I'm about to take a hacker onto the core world and see if that will help remove this fortress.  Then my plan is to remove all guardposts from the first AI homeworld, neuter the second, and then pop them both in close proximity since my AI progress is getting higher than what I am comfortable with. 

There is still a superterminal but other than that, I removed all other AI progress reducers.  Please give me any advice you might have that will lead this game to a happy ending.


Offline alocritani

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Re: End Game Staging - Core Worlds
« Reply #7 on: February 08, 2014, 10:30:54 am »
I'd suggest to unlock assault transports so you can simply "skip" mk IV worlds

Offline zoutzakje

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Re: End Game Staging - Core Worlds
« Reply #8 on: February 13, 2014, 03:16:22 pm »
haven't read the other comments so i don't know what has been covered. I'll just give me own piece of advice of what i usually try to do.
First off, warp jammers are an incredible useful tool. They saved my ass on 9/9 games more than once. Try only to get them if you can see use for more than just 1 of them, because they are pricey knowledge wise.

Thing you have to keep in mind with core worlds is to prevent putting them on alert. Think ahead before you get into that situation, because once a coreworld has been on alert for too long, your options become limited untill only warp jammers are left (and sometimes it could even be too late for that).
Whenever you attack a world, always make sure that you've scouted everything adjacent to the world you're attacking, in order to avoid triggering raid engines or putting core worlds on alert, etc. You can recognize coreworlds by the fact that it has 2 warp gates and lots of mk V ships.

Don't alert a coreworld unless you're ready to destroy the homeworlds. This is what i usually do: So there is the homeworld, a coreworld, a world before the coreworld and i take the world before that. That's where i hold my stand and from there i make my assault to the homeworld when I'm ready. It might take a while to figure out how to get through it properly, but it's better than having a coreworld on alert for an hour or longer.

I haven't had the time to look at your save so i hope any of this is useful information for your current situation. Is there a possible way to attack the homeworld from a different side? Going through a coreworld that hasn't been put on alert? Or is the homeworld at a dead end with only one coreworld?

Offline ErictheRed

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Re: End Game Staging - Core Worlds
« Reply #9 on: February 18, 2014, 12:24:46 pm »
The core world I was speaking of before is the only route to one of the AI homeworlds.  I have completely neutered this core world and wiped all the homeworld guardposts out on the adjacent AI homeworld.  I have not yet made in-roads to assault the second homeworld and I'm currently at around 230 AI progress.  Rather than wait, I think my best option is to destroy this first homeworld so I don't have to go through the massive core ship build-up on the alerted core when I'm finally ready.

It will increase my AI progress by 100 I believe - but then I hope to take the superterminal system and reduce as much as possible.  I'm trying to use all my remaining progress on fleet and starships so really trying to avoid the warp jammer unlock as much as possible.  I will not make the same mistake of alerting the core world for the second AI homeworld.  Thanks for the advice.

Offline Kahuna

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Re: End Game Staging - Core Worlds
« Reply #10 on: February 18, 2014, 02:43:40 pm »
I posted a couple of posts about AI home worlds here yesterday and today. You might wanna check them out.
set /A diff=10
if %diff%==max (
   set /A me=:)
) else (
   set /A me=SadPanda
)
echo Check out my AI War strategy guide and find your inner Super Cat!
echo 2592 hours of AI War and counting!
echo Kahuna matata!

Offline ErictheRed

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Re: End Game Staging - Core Worlds
« Reply #11 on: February 19, 2014, 10:04:15 am »
Thanks Kahuna.  When I started playing this game, I never used mines and built my defenses around the wormholes.  Your guide totally changed the way I play.

I destroyed the first AI homeworld commander center and it only increased my AI progress by 15.  Last time I won, I could have sworn it was 100.  Now I have set up a staging area 3 planets away from the second AI homeworld so I don't wake up the core this time and have about 7000 research to spend.  I used the ST to reduce AI progress so now I'm around 255.  I think I've got this one unless the AI goes crazy.

Are assault transports worth unlocking at this time or should I spend the points on starships/fleetships?  I've got advanced starship and fleetship factorys and one more unlock on plasma siege will give me the Mark IV.  Alternatively, I could get Mark IV space tanks.  I have to start clearing a path now and hopefully I get this win.

Offline Kahuna

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Re: End Game Staging - Core Worlds
« Reply #12 on: February 21, 2014, 01:22:03 am »
I'm glad I was able to help. Too bad I've not had the energy to finish the guide. I might rewrite it all and make it more compact at some point (I'm looking at you summer vacation).
« Last Edit: February 21, 2014, 01:28:28 am by Kahuna »
set /A diff=10
if %diff%==max (
   set /A me=:)
) else (
   set /A me=SadPanda
)
echo Check out my AI War strategy guide and find your inner Super Cat!
echo 2592 hours of AI War and counting!
echo Kahuna matata!

Offline ErictheRed

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Re: End Game Staging - Core Worlds
« Reply #13 on: February 21, 2014, 03:30:29 pm »
I finally got the win.  I ended up unlocking plasma siege to Mark III and got Mark IV from the starship factory.  I also unlocked nanoswarms to Mark IV which was an outstanding decision as those ships are awesome!  I was able to spit them out rapidly to deflect all counter attacks as I destroyed core posts. 

Finally, the AI parked about 3000 ships right outside the wormhole I was attacking from but they were not core.  So I cloaked a nuke, detonated it, then sent in 7 shuttles worth of ships.  While this was happening, they somehow launched a 2500 threat attack made up of Mark IV and V ships on the planet adjacent to my homeworld which was just starting to bust through so this game really came down to the wire.


Offline ErictheRed

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Re: End Game Staging - Core Worlds
« Reply #14 on: February 21, 2014, 03:33:17 pm »
One other quick question, is there a significant difference between an assault transport and a regular transport w/ cloaker starship?