Author Topic: AI War - A Guide to Golems  (Read 19508 times)

Offline Hearteater

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Re: AI War - A Guide to Golems
« Reply #75 on: February 03, 2012, 08:13:23 PM »
The ship-limit idea should be tweaked in the event that players want to upgrade their zombie fleet. Mark IV zombies would be most efficient on the ship-cap, and difficult to get if you already have 2000 mark-I, or worse, 2000 mark-I infiltrators from that recent wave... This creates a lot of optimisation angst.
Since they don't do this kind of math for schizo waves, I'm guessing it probably wouldn't be something ideal here.  But the Botnet Golem could self-destruct less valuable zombies when it reclaims better targets.  Value being calculated as Mark / Cap.

Offline keith.lamothe

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Re: AI War - A Guide to Golems
« Reply #76 on: February 03, 2012, 08:15:28 PM »
The ship-limit idea should be tweaked in the event that players want to upgrade their zombie fleet. Mark IV zombies would be most efficient on the ship-cap, and difficult to get if you already have 2000 mark-I, or worse, 2000 mark-I infiltrators from that recent wave... This creates a lot of optimisation angst.
Since they don't do this kind of math for schizo waves, I'm guessing it probably wouldn't be something ideal here.  But the Botnet Golem could self-destruct less valuable zombies when it reclaims better targets.  Value being calculated as Mark / Cap.
That math is done for schizo waves; if you get schizo waves with spire stealth battleships and infiltrators it sure doesn't give you equal numbers of both :)
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Offline Hearteater

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Re: AI War - A Guide to Golems
« Reply #77 on: February 03, 2012, 08:22:19 PM »
I was referring to the step 9 full cap minimum :)  It doesn't try and add up all the hodgepodge of ships to see if it is a full cap "worth" of assorted ships.

Offline keith.lamothe

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Re: AI War - A Guide to Golems
« Reply #78 on: February 03, 2012, 08:26:04 PM »
I was referring to the step 9 full cap minimum :)  It doesn't try and add up all the hodgepodge of ships to see if it is a full cap "worth" of assorted ships.
Ah right.  Actually doing that would be relatively easy, it just didn't seem worthwhile.

Anyway, I'm actually not very inclined to do the zombie cap at this point; I'd rather make the zombies congregate around the botnet and thus be more likely to die.  Or become an unstoppable swarm.  Either sounds fun :)
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Offline BobTheJanitor

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Re: AI War - A Guide to Golems
« Reply #79 on: February 03, 2012, 08:45:38 PM »
Zombies following the golem sounds hilarious, although it will probably end up being horribly abuseable as well. But I think it would be fun to try at least. Although when my system freezes because it's trying to handle 20,000 zombies on one world I might come to regret my enthusiasm.

Edit: Speeling
« Last Edit: February 04, 2012, 11:43:07 AM by BobTheJanitor »

Offline PokerChen

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Re: AI War - A Guide to Golems
« Reply #80 on: February 04, 2012, 07:42:43 AM »
Our very own Hybrid... Hmmm... You know, they do look similar to each other with that shared pentagonal star appearance. Just like to game icon. :P

Offline keith.lamothe

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Re: AI War - A Guide to Golems
« Reply #81 on: February 04, 2012, 09:49:16 AM »
Zombies following the golem sounds hilarious, although it wall probably end up being horribly abuseable as well. But I think it would be fun to try at least. Although when my system freezes because it's trying to handle 20,000 zombies on one world I might come to regret my enthusiasm.
One thing that would probably happen is that the more "escorts" it has the harder it is to reclaim a lot of units because the escorts keep killing them too fast.  But it's hard to say; the maw mechanic would make it pretty quick to "reserve" targets for reeducation.
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Offline Wanderer

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Re: AI War - A Guide to Golems
« Reply #82 on: February 04, 2012, 06:08:09 PM »
I was referring to the step 9 full cap minimum :)  It doesn't try and add up all the hodgepodge of ships to see if it is a full cap "worth" of assorted ships.
Ah right.  Actually doing that would be relatively easy, it just didn't seem worthwhile.

Anyway, I'm actually not very inclined to do the zombie cap at this point; I'd rather make the zombies congregate around the botnet and thus be more likely to die.  Or become an unstoppable swarm.  Either sounds fun :)

Heheh, that could be a lot of fun, actually.  And I agree with the other point, eventually the false barrier of zombies will keep the botnet from getting more until that's been thinned out a bit.  That's probably a much better idea then nerfing the poor golem in some way.
... and then we'll have cake.

Offline PokerChen

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Re: AI War - A Guide to Golems
« Reply #83 on: February 12, 2012, 08:51:56 PM »
I have now finished a game using the new regen-golem with reduced repair costs. It works very well grouped with zenith cache fleets to keep them topped up.

I've kept it largely separate from my defense-fleet where I have a small stack of neinzul vultures, but am noting that regen-golems seems to be replicating neinzul ships as well. It's probably *not* the most efficient use of resources for this golem. :P

Offline keith.lamothe

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Re: AI War - A Guide to Golems
« Reply #84 on: February 12, 2012, 09:23:00 PM »
I have now finished a game using the new regen-golem with reduced repair costs. It works very well grouped with zenith cache fleets to keep them topped up.
Good to hear :)

Quote
I've kept it largely separate from my defense-fleet where I have a small stack of neinzul vultures, but am noting that regen-golems seems to be replicating neinzul ships as well. It's probably *not* the most efficient use of resources for this golem. :P
Ah, yea, haha.  Would it be better if it just didn't regen them at all?
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Offline PokerChen

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Re: AI War - A Guide to Golems
« Reply #85 on: February 13, 2012, 12:00:25 AM »
I have now finished a game using the new regen-golem with reduced repair costs. It works very well grouped with zenith cache fleets to keep them topped up.
Good to hear :)

Quote
I've kept it largely separate from my defense-fleet where I have a small stack of neinzul vultures, but am noting that regen-golems seems to be replicating neinzul ships as well. It's probably *not* the most efficient use of resources for this golem. :P
Ah, yea, haha.  Would it be better if it just didn't regen them at all?

I would personally agree with removing the regen just from the neinzuls - they are specially enough to warrant that (zenith replication and neinzul technology don't mix together). Advice from others?

Offline Eternaly_Lost

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Re: AI War - A Guide to Golems
« Reply #86 on: February 13, 2012, 08:52:16 AM »
I almost always play with EXO waves( Golem and Spire Hard, and Always play Fallen Spire Campaign), and honestly if anything I find that the Botnet might be a little weak, given that if an EXO comes in, If I am not right there to make sure that it shield it is under was not the first thing that EXO hit on the way though, I often find that I am down a Botnet. I normally do play with 2-4 planets versus 9 AIs, but given you are likely to only get 1 or 2 of them at most in a whole game, it alright if they are extremely powerful. They very much are a super weapon, and balancing them for 7-7 play might make them completely worthless when you really do need them. Unless you plan on making a way for us to rebuild them, even at great cost (Buy them from the Traders? Has that been suggested before?) I don't see any real reason to make them weaker when you are talking about 1 or 2 at the most per game, and once they are gone, they are gone.

However, I might make a suggestion to help balance them out, keep them as they are, but build a fourth EXO-wave that builds based on your Golems and only charges well you have them. Make them small at first and make their only goal to remove those Golems that you control. Keep it uncapped and sooner or later you see Hunter-Killers or Motherships flying into remove your super weapons if you managed to run them that long. Maybe even make it an option like Spire/Golem-Hard(Say, call it Golems-Very Hard?) versus easy and medium? So that if people want superweapons that cost them, they basicly can get another EXO wave that wants to wipe them out when they start to use them, because they are using them. So the AI stops sending it as soon as they are gone.

Offline Martyn van Buren

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Re: AI War - A Guide to Golems
« Reply #87 on: February 15, 2012, 05:22:25 AM »
Also perhaps add an option to combine the high energy costs and AIP increases of golems medium with the exo-waves of golems hard?  I sure as hell won't be playing that option but it might be good for people who need that extra challenge.