Neinzul Ally the Fallen Spire

[zoutzakje]

I vote 673.892 nanoswarms built at the end of the game. Let's see how close I get

Be careful though guys. I don't know how long that super hybrid has been roaming around now, but it has to die ASAP.

[Minotaar]

I vote 673.892 nanoswarms built at the end of the game. Let's see how close I get

Be careful though guys. I don't know how long that super hybrid has been roaming around now, but it has to die ASAP.

The Dyson plot doesn't happen at all on normal hybrids anymore.
As for the mushrooms, I'll certainly be doing my part

[zoutzakje]

I vote 673.892 nanoswarms built at the end of the game. Let's see how close I get

Be careful though guys. I don't know how long that super hybrid has been roaming around now, but it has to die ASAP.

The Dyson plot doesn't happen at all on normal hybrids anymore.
As for the mushrooms, I'll certainly be doing my part

Oh yeah, that's right. I forgot the plot is now advanced hybrid only. Heh, in that case you can just ignore the super hybrid(s) completely. Unless they got a buff, they're not powerful enough to worry about (that's a hint Keith )

[Cyborg]

Thanks, I will pick this up and see what I can do. I will respond to specifics later as I need to get a better look at it first.

[keith.lamothe]

The nanoswarm Is aren't very good at reclaiming, no, but the ability (via looping docks nearby) to "debuff" an entire planet's worth of AI ships with engine damage, (temporary) paralysis, and armor damage for a very small amount of m+c is actually really helpful.  And FRD-looping unending production of them into an AI planet drastically reduces the effectiveness of the enemy forces (the aforementioned debuffs, and overloading targeting queues and splitting up response forces), making it a lot easier to attack with conventional forces.

Yes, and I certainly did that tactic as shown above. It was okay I guess. I used them just like I would autobombs.

Ah, right; been short on time and skimmed.  Yea, just like autobombs in a lot of ways.  And not terribly unlike other youngling "sieges" (though they're typically more directed).

Just caught up on the thread, very entertaining

Yea, ion scrapping used to be a very, very strong tactic, to the point that early game econ could simply be a matter of "find an ion cannon, eat it".  So I nerfed it into the floor.  Perhaps too effectively   But since then overall econ output has gone waaaay up.  If folks have an idea for scrapping numbers for the ion cannons that would make it more of an actual choice and not "obviously never capture to scrap" and not "obviously capture to scrap", I'm all ears.

Hybrids no like martyrs.  A plan may be necessary.

[PokerChen]

Oh, yes, over 21k nanowarms built so far. Accepting bets on the endgame value 

200k!

If folks have an idea for scrapping numbers for the ion cannons that would make it more of an actual choice and not "obviously never capture to scrap" and not "obviously capture to scrap", I'm all ears.

With Ion-Is and Ion-Vs and game mechanics, I don't think there exists a balanced sale price... but I'll have a go.

We can have the %-chances scale down with mark from 4% and halved every after. Looks a little high - the 200K mark begins to give players free distribution nodes. The AIP-scaling and waves will outpace Ion Cannons at some point in the game and we could be scrapping them left, right and centre. However, cannon-IIIs and above are very valuable *if* they happen to share a planet with strategic assets - I could envisage keeping a V just for exo-waves. Ion-Is are now worth a free mark-I starship, (you won't normally bring mark-I ships out on assaults after the early-game). Ion-IIs if you don't bring out mark-IIs.

A most relevant question is "How many ion cannons on an average planet? i.e. How much scrap value?".  Hearteater's table modified:

Mark	Value	Scrapped
I	800,000	800	->	32,000 (4%)
II	3,600,000	3,600	->	72,000 (2%)
III	14,400,000	14,000	->	144,000 (1%)
IV	43,200,000	43,200	->	216,000 (0.5%)
V	129,600,000	129,600	->	324,000 (0.25%)

[Cyborg]

Researched:
forcefields Mark II
Decloaker
raid starships 2

I stopped at five hours, 58 min. Spent most of this time doing logistical organization and taking on a couple planets. The first one was Tetherges. There was continuous harassment from that planet that needed to be dealt with first. Wasn't too bad, although moving around forces on the backfield triggers attacks on the other planets. All the more reason to reduce the entry to two planets.


I ended up leaving Farmville alone, however, unsure of what you want to do with that. In some ways, it's more trouble than it's worth for the hundred or so shredders (take any more and you lose the system, as I found out). I'll let you decide whether or not the AIP is worth it or if you want to leave it as a shredder farm.

The next thing I did was set up the planet on Tetherges, with only a few defenses. One of the things I should have done is more of the backfield to the front lines. Tetherges has eyebots coming in all the time, sometimes in 200 or so packs. I needed the decloaker to clean it out. I hate spending knowledge on low HP crap stuff like that, but it was too irritating to use tachyon emitters or scout starships.

The vast majority of my time was spent fighting off some waves, a cross-planet attack, and dealing with Dempe. Raeliuschr got hit for two hours straight, so I appreciated having three fortresses on there.


At its peak, Dempe was pushing 1600 units- high-level marks and hybrids. Carriers continue to come from this planet. I tried various solutions, including sucking some of them into Raeliuschr. The final cost was three martyrs, and one EMP (+2 AIP).

I landed that missile, ran in six raid starships (surprisingly, three was not enough to survive the short missile time), and got the heck out. They retaliated, much fun was had by all except the AI. :-)
After that, I jumped back in and took out some guardians and nearby guard post, and left again shortly thereafter.




Success.


Things to do:
* The stragglers remaining should be able to be taken by reworking the stardocks to pump out triangle ships and wear them down that way. The economy is in really good shape for now, just need to make more of the regular ships. Might be a good use of the 5000 knowledge that's left. Still haven't taken any knowledge from Farmville or Dempe, so there's plenty of opportunity.

* Hybrids continue to flow onto Dempe. Fortresses absolutely crush them. Raid starships aren't bad either.
 
* There is also that nice-looking ARS on Erpirajo. We could use another cap of ships.

[Minotaar]

First thing I do is dismantle the shredder-farm, a warpgate guardian spawned on it. Then I need to finish Dempe off. I take out the two EMP guardians on the first run. A 1.8k frigate wave to Tetherges, and there are virtually no defenses there yet. I use my martyr/riot tractor team to drag the first 1k frigates into Raeiuschr, where they get burninated by forts and HBCs, cleaned up the rest of them with the fleet. Then make another run for Dempe, using tractors to remove the fleetships and once again drag them into the chokepoint defenses. Still lost most of the fleet and it's only down to about 150 ships. The next attempt finally breaks it. Just the guardposts left to clean up.

What do I do about waves onto Tetherges? Well, I could I suppose gateraid Tuneuo. Why do I not have scouts on that? I know I sent some several times. Let's see...



So much for gate-raiding! That's another hybrid stack. Great. I could gate-raid it with jumpships, but I'll still need to defend against hybrid attacks, and there's even a warpgate guardian, so might as well just create another chokepoint on Tetherges. Another 1.3k wave of frigates to Tetherges, deflected with the same tractor shenanigans.

So Tuneuo is basically where the AI chokepoints YOU!!, what are we going to do in terms of strategy? With the north blocked off, I decide to scout out the bottom and try to find some Golems there. My jumpships are ready, I load up the scouts.

Turns out, Attrition Emitters damage Jumpships and it's actually kind of painful. And there's really not a lot of mk2 planets to travel through. Will have to be careful, I don't want to waste too many asteroids on this, and I only have (well, had) 1 Xampite.
The first find is an Artillery golem on Boomistic. Not exactly what I'd hoped for, but should be good regardless. A fact IV found on Samomoat close by as well.

Armored golem and the Dyson on Killneiye, now this is somewhat exciting. Let's find out what else is around the Dyson, maybe a Dyson-protected enclave could be created. Let's say I didn't really think through the implications of this for the FS campaign at the time. 

What I find around the Dyson is 3 Data Centers. Not bad. My jumpships are running out, so for a final mission I send them over to Murdoch. They do not make it back, but deliver 20 scouts. Managed to find a planet with an ARS and another Armored golem, and also very luckily the rest of the Co-Processors. A wave of 1.2k fighters announces for Tetherges, but 2 fortresses are already up there. I get a 120-strong resistance fighter spawn from that as well.

In the meantime, Tuneuo up to 1.9k and 57 hives. Maybe we'll nuke'em later.  Actually I'm kind of interested in what is left of a hive after a nuke, except its hull. That's kind of a philosophical question in our current situation, though. What I can do is raid all of the AIP reducers, free the Dyson and acquire the golems. I smuggle some Raids, Cloakers and Enclaves onto the Dyson world. There's a counterattack post on it, can't be too bad, right?

927 MK 3s? Oops.

It is next door from Raeiuschr, so I could once again use the tractors. We'll see. Raids pop the shield guardpost and head to the CS, trying to avoid the Neinzul-Vs-Dyson battle that is happening. 8 minutes till the counter hits, I just build some turrets around the CS so it doesn't get destroyed, but the actual defending will happen on Raeiuschr. 0.7k fighters and 2k raiders also happen just for fun, the cleanup of those finishes 45 seconds before the counter. It spawns from exactly the side I wanted, as the Raeiuschr wormhole is in their way, I'll just have to scoop them up. The raiders which are immune to tractors I'll have to fight with the fleet. That turns out not to be a problem. All 4 of my Martyrs survive at about 10% hp, they still have work to do... Having survived that, it's time to focus on the deepstrike. I need to get some engineers over to repair my Raids... CPA, 1.3k in 13 minutes. Thank god for only 2 chokepoints. There should be a Hybrid attack, though, so I need this amored golem right now. Get some more engineers and a colony ship in there. Only a couple minutes needed for the rebuild, didn't even drain the whole bank. Let's get this Golem back home to defend. (What actually happens is "The Golem tramples through the two planets in the way to get to the mainland on its own.  ) 441 MK 1's and 900 MK 2's freed n CPA, defense mode ON. The defensive Hybrids are NOT mobilizing though (does this only happen when advanced hybrids are enabled?)

Threatballs are stacking up, Tuneuo is up to 3k ships. Tempted to hurl a Martyr into it. I just have one with 0% HP lying around. Not now. Wait for more. Wait for more... Can't wait anymore.





The only things that will be left after the nuclear war are apparently cockroaches and Honeycombs. 

The other threatball is also easily cleaned up, let's keep raiding and claim our other Golem. Soon all the scouted DC's and CP's are down, AIP is 101. The Artillery golem planet falls to the Armored with some nanoswarm and Raid support. There is also an Engineer V fab on it, which is like the best thing EVER. Immediately 2k raiders head to it though, and the DysonBall (tm) isn't up to speed yet. I scrap half my fleet and turbo-rebuild it with all the engineers. The golem for some reason decided to instantly pop the carrier, nothing too scary came out of it, though, just more raiders. What was really weird is that all the Raiders focusfired the golem the whole time. It tickled. An eyebot wave announces to the same planet, and they ALSO focusfire the golem. At least it works nicely as bait. While that was happening I raid some hive spawners. I get three, the last one is on Chraidzup, but I lost the Raids... and I'm also out of time.