Thoughts on our new store/marketing copy for Valley 2?

[x4000]

Hey folks, a lot of you expressed some concerns about our beta marketing copy not really conveying as much as it should about the game, so we're posting our 1.0 copy here for you to see and critique.  Have at it!


About the Game
A modern take on the 16-bit era, A Valley Without Wind 2 blends a variety of mechanics across multiple genres, seamlessly bringing together the best qualities of old-school platform-shooters and turn-based strategy games.  You choose how and where to explore via the world map, how to upgrade your character via mage classes, feats, and perks that you unlock, and how to battle the forces of evil every step of the way.

Your character is a mage who has infiltrated the inner circle of the evil Demonaica, and you now share the power of immortality that he uses to terrorize the land. Using this power against him, it's time to lead an uprising and ultimately bring him and his henchmen back to mortality so that they can be dispatched.

Gameplay alternates between two modes that complement each other: brief, tightly-designed platforming segments where your character customization and equipment can be tuned to meet the tactical needs of the current stage; and quick strategic turns on the world map where you order your troops to fight, scavenge, build, recruit, farm, and use special powers.  Demonaica and his armies pursue your forces directly on the world map, while his five henchmen have been sent to recapture you in the platforming segments.

Your immortality came at great personal cost, but it makes you the one last hope of saving the world from darkness.

Key Features:

    Platforming and Turn-Based Strategy Coupled Together:
    Flip back and forth between your own adventure, and the progress of the resistance you're in charge of.  Freely adjust difficulty levels for both to tailor the experience to your own personal playstyle.  Both sides of the game can be quite easy or incredibly hard.
    More Tactile Combat:
    The physics of movement and attacks have been completely redone from the first title, with more traditional gamepad and keyboard support. Spells have mass and can block each other, leading to many interesting tactical situations in the platforming segments.
    Vastly Improved Visuals:
    Fully redone artwork by Heavy Cat Studios, including 125 all-new monsters, 200 spells, and lots more.
    Focused Gameplay Arc:
    Unlike the endless sandbox-style first game, this complete re-imagining has a distinct beginning, middle, and end.
    Procedurally Generated Worlds:
    Each world is a unique challenge, leading to excellent replay value once you do beat the game!
    Co-Op Multiplayer:
    Bring along as many friends as you like on your journey, depending on your connection speed. 2-8 players recommended on most Internet connections; many more on LAN.
    See Just How Deep An Arcen-style Rabbit-Hole Goes:
    After dozens of hours you still haven't seen it all: 50 mage classes in 5 tiers, 200 spells, 125 enemies, 14 biomes, 100+ types of world map tiles, 64 character customization perks, 100ks of procedural equipment possibilities.
    Extra Challenges For Expert Players:
    String together flawless kills to earn "concentration" and become even stronger.  Beat the game on harder difficulties to earn rare achievements.

[tigersfan]

I have two nitpicks... not all 125 enemies are new, bats are back!

Also, I think rather than "randomly" generated worlds, it should say "procedurally". Random really applies more to how the first game did it. This game's world and chunk gen has a lot more rigid rules than the first.

Hey... I said they were nitpicks.

[madcow]

The first thing that jumps out is a point could be made about gamepad support, and being an ideal game for big picture mode.  I'm assuming it would be awesome in big picture ode at least, I never use the thing.  You mentioned redone controls, I think the word tighter could be used there.  Maybe more later.

[x4000]

Good point on proedurally vs randomly, that has been adjusted.

In terms of the enemies, all of them have 100% new graphics, and all of them have different internal characteristics, too.  Bats are the closest to their counterpart from the first game out of any others, but these move slower, have different health, emit a glow, have new graphics, etc.  I think that qualifies as new.

[x4000]

Thanks madcow, I've added to the original with notes about gamepad and keyboard support being improved. 

Regarding Big Picture, I'm not sure that it's ideal for that because in a few cases use of the mouse is actually required (hence the "partial gamepad support" label on Steam -- you can't forego touching anything but your gamepad while playing this game.  Well, you can while actually playing, but not in all the extra menus like settings and choosing a character).  The other barrier to big picture support is the fact that our fonts are too small to be seen on a TV from the other side of the room.  I really don't want people to be expecting to play this comfortably on a TV from across the room, as I don't think that will work out well (and we already have had a few people complain about that very thing, which the game was never designed for).

[madcow]

Ahh okay. I've never used it before and assumed it would be fine, I guess they know what you say about when you assume.

[tigersfan]

Good point on proedurally vs randomly, that has been adjusted.

In terms of the enemies, all of them have 100% new graphics, and all of them have different internal characteristics, too.  Bats are the closest to their counterpart from the first game out of any others, but these move slower, have different health, emit a glow, have new graphics, etc.  I think that qualifies as new.

Fair enough.

[Pepisolo]

First impression is that this is a vast improvement. Looks good to me now, although I'll go through it a bit later with some more thought. Presumably you're not allowed to reference specific game titles? Like saying stuff like Contra meets Actraiser?

[madcow]

I wonder about mentioning the art studio by name or not.  Couldn't say if its worth doing or not.

[x4000]

First impression is that this is a vast improvement. Looks good to me now, although I'll go through it a bit later with some more thought. Presumably you're not allowed to reference specific game titles? Like saying stuff like Contra meets Actraiser?

Yeah, that's called "unjust brand enrichment," according to Arcen's lawyer when I asked him about that in the past.  It's basically grounds for a lawsuit.  Even using terms like "Metroidvania" in official marketing copy is iffy, so we don't.  We say those things in talking to people because that's what the subgenre is simply called, and press are free to use that, but in marketing materials we have to be pretty careful.

I wonder about mentioning the art studio by name or not.  Couldn't say if its worth doing or not.

Facepalm.  That's something that I should be doing out of respect for them, at any rate.  It's not going to take anything from us, and it is good for them.

[Panopticon]

Now that you mention Metroidvania it would be nice to have a way to impart those qualities of the game to prospective customers without getting into any legally sticky areas.

I really enjoy a game where progress is gated and things open up after overcoming specific challenges. A lot of other players enjoy this too so this aspect of the game deserves some exposure.

[x4000]

That's what I was trying to get across with the line "You choose how and where to explore via the world map, how to upgrade your character via mage classes, feats, and perks that you unlock, and how to battle the forces of evil every step of the way."  But I guess that didn't have the desired effect for you?

[Pepisolo]

Just went through this bit by bit trying to dissect it to provide feedback, but I kept just writing stuff like "Nice", "Cool", "Sets the tone" etc. So seems pretty good. Oh, one thing:

"Spells have mass and can block each another"

As for the Metroidvanian thing. Seems like its going to be hard to describe the Metroidvanian feel fully without actually saying ... Metroidvanian, so I think you've probably done pretty well just to even hint at it. The old-school feel has definitely been bigged up. Much better than the old blurb.

I'll get a couple of people to look over it, to see what they say, too.

One extra thing, maybe you could fit in some mention of the corrupt wind plaguing the land.

[Panopticon]

That's what I was trying to get across with the line "You choose how and where to explore via the world map, how to upgrade your character via mage classes, feats, and perks that you unlock, and how to battle the forces of evil every step of the way."  But I guess that didn't have the desired effect for you?

Yeah, that imparts to me an emphasis on player choices, which the game has a lot. It's a great quality but I guess the quality I'm talking about is that feeling of progress that's specific to the gated mechanics. I've talked to people who worry about the procedural nature of the games generation, thinking about it in a Minecraft kind of sense I guess. What I mean by that is that Minecraft generates some really cool environments but outside of the exploration and building the gameplay elements aren't super deep. So a way to highlight the kind of focused exploration that rewards you with access to previously inaccessible locations with new stuff to discover and add to your toolbox is what I'm talking about. The only succinct way I know to put it is referring to Metroid and Castelvania though.

Urgh that's not really that clear either. I mean Minecraft is a great game in its own sense and exploration definitely allows you to craft up gear that gives you a greater ability to explore and leverage your environment. Valley 2 is a much more focused game though, and that's something that procedural generation isn't really known for outside of the roguelike (and AI War) fanbase. A lot of times people see procedural and think random. That's definitely not the case with Valley 2 and I guess I'm just worried about that perception and want to guard against it.

Sorry if that's a bit muddy, and I'm honestly not sure if I'm making a mountain out of a mole hill at this point. Just throwing stuff at the wall I guess and seeing what sticks.

[tigersfan]

That's what I was trying to get across with the line "You choose how and where to explore via the world map, how to upgrade your character via mage classes, feats, and perks that you unlock, and how to battle the forces of evil every step of the way."  But I guess that didn't have the desired effect for you?

Yeah, that imparts to me an emphasis on player choices, which the game has a lot. It's a great quality but I guess the quality I'm talking about is that feeling of progress that's specific to the gated mechanics. I've talked to people who worry about the procedural nature of the games generation, thinking about it in a Minecraft kind of sense I guess. What I mean by that is that Minecraft generates some really cool environments but outside of the exploration and building the gameplay elements aren't super deep. So a way to highlight the kind of focused exploration that rewards you with access to previously inaccessible locations with new stuff to discover and add to your toolbox is what I'm talking about. The only succinct way I know to put it is referring to Metroid and Castelvania though.

Urgh that's not really that clear either. I mean Minecraft is a great game in its own sense and exploration definitely allows you to craft up gear that gives you a greater ability to explore and leverage your environment. Valley 2 is a much more focused game though, and that's something that procedural generation isn't really known for outside of the roguelike (and AI War) fanbase. A lot of times people see procedural and think random. That's definitely not the case with Valley 2 and I guess I'm just worried about that perception and want to guard against it.

Sorry if that's a bit muddy, and I'm honestly not sure if I'm making a mountain out of a mole hill at this point. Just throwing stuff at the wall I guess and seeing what sticks.

I think what he's trying to say is that there should be a greater emphasis on the fact that while there is a lot of player choice, the game is also focused, and has a beginning, middle, and end, unlike a sandbox like Minecraft. Is that pretty accurate?