Author Topic: Things that go through your head while playing AVWW2 (swearing, necessarily)  (Read 1876 times)

Offline Mahboii

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As much as I like the game in general, it's hands-down the game that plays dirtier than any other I know of. It's worse than A****** Mario and IWBTG combined, because at least in those the traps stay the same every time you play. AVWW2, otoh, will find new ways to screw you every time you retry the level, let alone start a new one. I know you have a health bar here, but I'd just love to see someone do a perfect run on a higher difficulty, even allowing for hits. So, let's put together a list:

1. Who could possibly dodge that in time?!
2. Invincible enemies that cuddly hug  you dead, classy.
3. That drone/spider/bat/orb/crab WOULD slip past my wall of Magma Blasts, wouldn't it?!
4. God**** f****** wall pigeons.
5. How am I supposed to kill the dragon when all my shots go the other way?!
6. Oh a jumping cube, I'm dead now. *poison pill*
7. I'd put you next to Demonaica if someone else wouldn't take your place, b****. (The survivor complaining EVERY TIME you die)
8. A chest sitting diagonally on a stairway? Seems legit.
9. Yep, of course. (leap of faith landing onto an enemy)
10. Ice jumpers give me PTSD flashbacks to Modern Warfare 2.
11. Get off, get the f*** off me! (being cuddly hugged  by drone/spider/bat/mimic/orb/crab)
12. How come the premade castle levels are the most infuriating of all?
13. How about some health for once!
14. Those C4 fliers were just never meant to be dodged, might as well subtract the health when you enter the room. Or, you know, not spawn them indoors.
15. Oh god no, an enemy down and to the left.
16. Why'd my guided missile ammo power just last half a second?
17. The achievements for the 3 highest difficulties should be called Masochist, Buddhist Monk and Gun To Your Head?, respectively.
« Last Edit: September 11, 2013, 03:30:07 PM by Mahboii »

Offline abdulmuhsee

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As much as I like the game in general, it's hands-down the game that plays dirtier than any other I know of. It's worse than A****** Mario and IWBTG combined, because at least in those the traps stay the same every time you play.

So would you prefer the game became stale due to being exactly the same every time?  You're complaining about the exact thing that makes the game so great.  Does IWBTG make you want to play it over and over again, or are you finished for good after the first time you beat it?  With AVWW2, you have loads of replay value.

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AVWW2, otoh, will find new ways to screw you every time you retry the level, let alone start a new one. I know you have a health bar here, but I'd just love to see someone do a perfect run on a higher difficulty, even allowing for hits.


You're not supposed to be able to get through the game without dying; that's the whole point of the oblivion crystal.  Normally you wouldn't have a chance against Demonaica, and that's why the resistance sacrificed so much to get their hands on one.  You'll still die, but you'll be able to come back and try again.  Morale is built around this concept in AVWW2: try to die as few times as possible to keep your morale up.  I've beaten the game on Master Hero with just a dozen deaths or so.

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So, let's put together a list:

As for your list, there are definitely some difficult enemies, but no invincible ones.  Wall pigeons and crabs are definitely a challenge when you're new to the game, but they become more manageable with experience.  The forest dragon is pretty cheap with its resistance field, especially being virtually impenetrable on higher difficulties, and the cube is, as you say, pretty much a death sentence.

There are a couple ways around this; with the cube, weapons like the exploding "mines" and lances (IIRC) cannot be deflected and can kill them quite easily.  Ammo spells can usually take them out as well.  Other than that, just try to live up to the challenge.  AVWW2 is one of the most challenging, but also one of the most rewarding games I have played in recent memory.

Offline Mahboii

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All good points, and I actually agree. Thing is, the formula is very far from perfect. It's understandable because a game with so much randomisation is going to be a real pony to balance no matter what. However, I'm not sure it's a good idea to lower morale every time you die. It just aggravates the player and just seems like a forced link between the strategy and combat segments. It doesn't have to be there, just have morale be independent from the combat and make sure there are enough threats to morale in the strategy game.

Offline Misery

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The way I see it, the central problem with the game is simple:  It's the enemies themselves, not the layouts or anything like that.   And defnitely not ALL of the enemies, no no no.  It's a few very specific ones that can cause problems. 

Particularly at higher levels;  some foes scale BADLY, and can become literally impossible to kill without getting hit, no matter what you have and what you do.

Scorpions, for example.   Almost all of the time, at higher difficulties, you CANNOT kill these without taking a hit.  They simply fire waaaaaayyyyyyy too often.  When the first fire wave is just about done, they're standing still, and about to fire the next wave.  You cant pierce those waves, and many ranged attacks dont actually have enough range for you to be out of the flame radius while still being in range to hit them.  The one, and only, thing that I've found that works against them is snake attacks.... but that's mostly for caverns.  It's not so good at all on overland sequences.

The pigeons are not quite as nasty.... their attacks CAN be dodged.... but they fire so frequently that you just cant hit them most of the time.  Unlike the scorpions though it's safe to get on a platform with them and pop them when they're coming around a corner.

These are pretty much the two most aggravating enemies in the game, and they appear VERY frequently.   They're not nearly as bad on lower difficulties, but they're a nightmare on the high ones.

The Eels have basically the same attack as the scorpions, but they do not cling to walls;  they're dangerous as heck, but you can get into positions to hit them without immediately getting blasted.  Their attack works out for them;  the scorpions, honestly, probably should have a different attack type.

They're even worse with certain mage classes.  In my current game, there is no such thing as a good ranged attack that has actual speed to it's projectiles.  I mostly got Drone shots, and V shots... definitely useful to me in many situations, but they simply dont work against these foes at all.   Ammo spells can help against them, but like all crawlers they're just too frequent.  You dont have enough ammo to really use that as a viable method of defeating them.

Aurochs are pretty bad too.  Usually undamageable on high difficulties.   With the right setup though you can simply leap over them;  their attacks are very predictable, if chaotic, and they're slower than a brick in sludge. 


Or something like the Teleporting Ice Jerk.  The one that fires a shot, and teleports to wherever the shot stops.   It's fast enough, and fires frequently enough, that you dont have time to aim at it once it's somewhat close to you, depending on what spells you have.  Ammo spells at least are much more viable against this guy.   Bursts or crosses can take him down.


There's a couple of others.... but all in all, MOST enemies can be dealt with, technically, without you getting hit, even on high difficulties.  It's just a matter of figuring out HOW.   As well as knowing what mage classes to use, and what perks to set.  I generally change classes and perks almost every single time I enter an area, in order to suit the situation.


The one other really major problem I'm aware of though is the game's extreme tendancy to spawn enemies right in front of the entrance to an area.  Either in the same slice, or the slice next to it;  often meaning that those enemies get a free shot at you that you may not be able to dodge.



Also:  Screw mosquitoes.  Argh.   They're not unfair whatsoever, they're just..... argh.   So..... irritating..... just stand still, dammit!  Stop throwing those damn orange things at me!

Offline Mahboii

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Or something like the Teleporting Ice Jerk.  The one that fires a shot, and teleports to wherever the shot stops.   It's fast enough, and fires frequently enough, that you dont have time to aim at it once it's somewhat close to you, depending on what spells you have.

These kill me out of all proportion to other enemies. There's no comparison - ice jumpers are lethal.