Enemy Drops

[CodexArcanum]

That said, I realize that the game doesn't notice players doing stealth, and doesn't do anything to "punish" us, so I wonder if this could be changed?  Would it feel more fair to you if there was a mechanic whereby if you avoided a lot of enemies (I assume this would mean raising CP a good deal without doing getting a lot of enemy unlocks), instead of unlock tougher enemies the existing creatures would get boosts to detection range and become more aggressive about chasing you?  I think I might like that as a stealth player, and I wonder if that would feel more fair to more combaty players?  In that case it wouldn't be so much being "punished" for killing enemies as the game taking note of your playstyle and upping the challenge for you.

I think that would be excellent.  When I noticed that killing enemies was making them tougher, I just saw it as a good incentive to try stealth more.  Previously I'd had very little reason to use stealth outside certain missions.  Obviously I can't avoid killing all enemies, but now I had a reason to at least try and avoid killing some of them.  Interesting, some enemies already have much higher detection rates.  Clockwork Probes (vile villains!) seem to lock on to me very quickly no matter what.  So that seems to be a small element of the game already.

[nobody]

Specifically, I think Arcen (and me) wanted to avoid the RPG situation where you're allowed to sneak past an enemy but then you wind up being weaker as a result.  I think the current system does this quite well. 

what I am suggesting wouldnt change any of that. you still get the same items you currently get from the terrain, but they would be from the enemies. meaning you can choose to either sneak past the enemies and collect resources from the ground, or you can kill the enemies and get resources that way. and as you said about player choice. being able to go stealth or attack enemies, well this just adds to that. now you can choose how you want to gather resources.

and I dont think that item drops from enemies should be an efficient way to collect items. something like less then 15% chance for common items, and less than 1% for rarer items. Plus the rarer items wont drop at all from the weaker enemies.

[tigersfan]

A couple of things to keep in mind...

1.) The reason enemies are there is to be an obstacle in the way of getting what you need. Giving them drops ruins this. If you give them drops then players are tempted to kill them all. We never intended for all enemies to be killed.

2.) Also keep in mind that killing enemies is no longer a determent either. Enemy unlocks where enemies get harder after you kill so many are gone. Now the game randomly adds new and harder enemies as you progress in the game, it's not based on how many you kill.

[Bluddy]

2.) Also keep in mind that killing enemies is no longer a determent either. Enemy unlocks where enemies get harder after you kill so many are gone. Now the game randomly adds new and harder enemies as you progress in the game, it's not based on how many you kill.

Are you sure? I still see enemy unlockables in my encyclopedia.

[Terraziel]

2.) Also keep in mind that killing enemies is no longer a determent either. Enemy unlocks where enemies get harder after you kill so many are gone. Now the game randomly adds new and harder enemies as you progress in the game, it's not based on how many you kill.

That only applies to the elite enemies, new enemies and variants are still unlocked through killing enemies.

[bvchaosinc]

1.) The reason enemies are there is to be an obstacle in the way of getting what you need. Giving them drops ruins this. If you give them drops then players are tempted to kill them all. We never intended for all enemies to be killed.

Are their any changes coming to make the enemies effectual obstacles?  Currently as soon as you are capable of knock back enemies lose all challenge.

[The Wuggly Ump]

1.) The reason enemies are there is to be an obstacle in the way of getting what you need. Giving them drops ruins this. If you give them drops then players are tempted to kill them all. We never intended for all enemies to be killed.

That's a good point, but an obstacle isn't fun by itself. Overcoming an obstacle can be fun, but if conquering the obstacle (whether by violence, stealth, diplomacy, or anything else) doesn't reward me in some way, I have no incentive to conquer it at all. As it is, my most effective method of getting to the next "reward" is to see how fast I can run past every enemy on my way to the next mission, which invariably means several screens of running and hopping. Unfortunately, I'm discovering that playing that way is extremely boring. I can engage the enemies to relieve the tedium, but since there's no metagame reason for doing that it seems pointless.

Right now, I think the combat's the strongest element of the game in terms of immediate, short-term fun. If you don't intend for the enemies to be fought all the time, which is an awesome idea, I think you should give us an alternative that's equally satisfying. Otherwise, just have them drop 0.1% of an enchant charge or something, just so I don't feel like I'm wasting my time.