Author Topic: If we did do a Valley 2 expansion, what would you even want to see?  (Read 12685 times)

Online Oralordos

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Re: If we did do a Valley 2 expansion, what would you even want to see?
« Reply #30 on: June 19, 2013, 06:35:15 PM »
I would say yes to a just strategy or just platforming expansion. With how the game is right now... I would probably want a just platforming expansion more. Just because it's already good so anything making it more good would be awesome.

Offline LaughingThesaurus

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Re: If we did do a Valley 2 expansion, what would you even want to see?
« Reply #31 on: June 20, 2013, 03:14:02 PM »
I would absolutely play a 'just platforming' sort of expansion. As much as I like, say, metroidvania games (wander, explore, level up, pretty much what I like about Valley 1) and would like it to lean a bit more towards that... I would still be fine with it just being platforming. I love my platforming.
Oh.. and I do want to clarify. The stress of the strategy game drives me away, not purely because it's strategy, but because it's so easy for people to die or get really seriously hurt. You're always losing structures. There's just this invincible man that is destroying everything you love and hold dear. That is really what stresses me out more than anything else. It's like the idea of playing a game of AI War, where the devourer golem only stays on your planets and never hurts the AI.

Offline Billick

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Re: If we did do a Valley 2 expansion, what would you even want to see?
« Reply #32 on: June 20, 2013, 04:50:28 PM »
I do miss the exploration aspect of Valley 1.  I'm not sure how you could incorporate that into the second game without blowing up the budget.  As it is, I got bored with the platforming before I got bored with the strategy portion.  I would play a "just strategy" mode.

Rogue Legacy was accepted by Greenlight btw.  It looks pretty good.

Offline madcow

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Re: If we did do a Valley 2 expansion, what would you even want to see?
« Reply #33 on: June 20, 2013, 05:56:38 PM »
By the way, for those that were asking about a rogue-like beat em up.

 Legends of Dungeon.

http://www.robotloveskitty.com/LoD/

Online Pepisolo

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Re: If we did do a Valley 2 expansion, what would you even want to see?
« Reply #34 on: June 20, 2013, 07:20:09 PM »
By the way, for those that were asking about a rogue-like beat em up.

 Legends of Dungeon.

http://www.robotloveskitty.com/LoD/

Thanks! I think I remember this from Greenlight. I'll be keeping an eye on this one!

Offline doctorfrog

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Re: If we did do a Valley 2 expansion, what would you even want to see?
« Reply #35 on: June 20, 2013, 07:34:57 PM »
Just a dream of mine. If such a game already exists somewhere out there in the tinternets then I'm all ears.

Rogue Legacy

You're welcome.  :D

I was, and still am, an enormous fan of Spelunky, and I'm looking forward to the PC release of both Spelunky and Rogue Legacy this summer.

There is an undeniable appeal to super hard Metroid-style exploration platforming for me.

Offline madcow

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Re: If we did do a Valley 2 expansion, what would you even want to see?
« Reply #36 on: June 20, 2013, 07:38:58 PM »
Spelunky is an amazing game. I love it to bits.

Offline x4000

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Re: If we did do a Valley 2 expansion, what would you even want to see?
« Reply #37 on: June 21, 2013, 04:14:45 PM »
Spelunky is an amazing game. I love it to bits.

I am excited for that one, too.

When I see something like that, it makes me lose all motivation to work on something too similar, though.  Not in a depressing way, just in a disinterested way.  When someone else executes something flawlessly, I'll happily play their game instead.  I want to go boldly where no game has gone before. (Although I hope this is more than a five-year mission ;)).
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Offline Billick

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Re: If we did do a Valley 2 expansion, what would you even want to see?
« Reply #38 on: June 21, 2013, 05:08:59 PM »
Spelunky is probably my favorite platformer in the last 20 years, and I'm excited that the new version is coming out on PC. 

Offline mrhanman

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Re: If we did do a Valley 2 expansion, what would you even want to see?
« Reply #39 on: June 21, 2013, 08:14:33 PM »
Dust has been eating most of my time lately.  I've got about 6 hours into it so far, and I'm still amazed at how incredible every aspect of it is.

If I were inclined to make my own platformer, I'd probably put it down after playing Dust.

Offline doctorfrog

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Re: If we did do a Valley 2 expansion, what would you even want to see?
« Reply #40 on: June 22, 2013, 03:05:42 AM »
Spelunky is an amazing game. I love it to bits.

I am excited for that one, too.

When I see something like that, it makes me lose all motivation to work on something too similar, though.  Not in a depressing way, just in a disinterested way.  When someone else executes something flawlessly, I'll happily play their game instead.  I want to go boldly where no game has gone before. (Although I hope this is more than a five-year mission ;)).

I think I understand what you're saying here. When Spelunky showed up in 2008, it basically both created and perfected the action roguelike genre. It's not that it can't ever be topped or polished, or what have you, it's just that it came out of nowhere and said, "Hey, here's an idea of mine. And here's basically the best possible first-generation implementation of it. Also, it is free and adorable."

It's a little bit like the Wright bros wheeled out a P-51 on that first flight. Best plane that can ever be made? No, but a hard act to follow, and you just kind of want to admire it for a bit and see where the industry takes it... because in the meantime, it's still the best thing in the air.

Offline x4000

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Re: If we did do a Valley 2 expansion, what would you even want to see?
« Reply #41 on: June 22, 2013, 03:31:38 PM »
To some extent, yeah.  I like being the Wright Bros instead of Boeing, would be the fitting description inside your example area.  If someone else has already done something and done it well, then I don't have any interest in going over there and trying to chase it and do it better.  My motivations come from doing things that have never been done before, or which in my opinion have been done poorly. 

AI War came out of my frustration that I had never liked any space-based RTS games, ever.  If you asked me in 2008 what I thought of space-based RTS games, I would have said "slow, clunky, and not fun."  But I really like space, and I really like RTS games, and it seemed stupid to me that I couldn't find some game that didn't feel like my ships were in molasses and where I could feel like Ender Wiggin.  So I did it myself.

Shattered Haven came out of my love for both Zelda and Lode Runner.  I was frustrated that there had only been (to my mind) one really good Lode Runner game, and nothing to come close since.  And I thought the general idea of it had a lot of potential that had been left untapped, but also that the side-view perspective was really limiting the sort of stages that could be designed.  So I made my own take.

Valley 1 came from a whole host of desires, most of them "things I'd like to see but that are not based on any one particular game since there's nothing else really close to it."  Trying to make a better Metroidvania title than anyone else ever has (with far more budgets and experience than me at the art of a very long-running genre) is something I'd run screaming from.  I'm excellent at invention, but making super-polished late-life entries into an existing genre is something best left to others.

And while we're at it, Skyward Collapse came from my desires to create a form of living boardgame that involved tile placement in a fun solitaire fashion where you are your own enemy and there is no enemy AI, there's just you versus a very tough situation.  The whole "god game" aspect actually was something that we backed into, it wasn't the core thing about it.  I've never actually really played god games before, other than maybe two hours of Black and White, which I didn't like.  I missed Populous.  I loved Actraiser, thought that doesn't really count.  And Actraiser was one inspiration among many for Valley 1.

Whew.  Anyhow, perhaps that clarifies.  I like swooping into spaces that are either ignored or served poorly.  And then innovating there.  That's the strength of Arcen, is coming up with new and crazy things.  Getting into a direct battle over who can do the best art, or perfect every last nuance of gameplay the best, is an area we'd lose out in.  I'm sure we could do it, but the budget would be large and we'd be trying to innovate while doing the other stuff, and that rarely is going to work out well.
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Offline LaughingThesaurus

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Re: If we did do a Valley 2 expansion, what would you even want to see?
« Reply #42 on: June 22, 2013, 06:40:09 PM »
You say that, but you've spent all this time perfecting AI War.
I think you could definitely do a great job improving on a formula, you'd just need to hold back a little on your innovation instincts just enough so you don't ruin things. It's like, any kind of game design ideas I do any work on, I always have to hold back on making it complex. I love complex, but unfortunately, people don't often.

Offline keith.lamothe

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Re: If we did do a Valley 2 expansion, what would you even want to see?
« Reply #43 on: June 22, 2013, 07:07:33 PM »
You say that, but you've spent all this time perfecting AI War.
Well, yes, but one thing to note is that my personal inclinations and abilities tend much more towards refinement of something like that, and I'm honestly pretty inexperienced on just doing whole new stuff out of nowhere.  Chris is more balanced on that.  Hence my mostly taking care of the ongoing AIW work while Chris hatches crazy schemes makes new games :)  Though it does sound like he'll keep refining SC for a while if things continue along current lines.
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Offline LaughingThesaurus

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Re: If we did do a Valley 2 expansion, what would you even want to see?
« Reply #44 on: June 22, 2013, 07:17:57 PM »
Ahhh, I see. So, in that way, you two do really complement each other rather nicely.