Author Topic: AVWW2 Beta: Brief opinions/observations and a bug report.  (Read 4487 times)

Offline timebomb

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AVWW2 Beta: Brief opinions/observations and a bug report.
« on: December 21, 2012, 03:44:37 am »
Hey all. I've played a little bit of AVWW and have been playing the AVWW2 beta for a couple hours now. Tons of fun!

First, some of the good:

- AVWW2 feels similar to AVWW1 in certain ways, which is good. While a ton of things are very different, I feel it still has some of the essence of the first game in it.

- I like the fact that there's a storyline.

- While I didn't dislike the old art as I thought it was quite unique and interesting, I do very much so like the new art.

- I like the new strategy overview.

- I like the new combat. I think it's pretty fluid.

- No mana points. Woo hoo, spammin' abilities to my heart's content (other than the 4th ability, of course).


Now, some of the not so good:

- The game briefly tried to introduce me to equipment. I've gotten a couple chests so far and have no idea what they gave me, where my equipment is, what it does, etc etc.

- The lack of loot is disheartening. I love loot, and while I understand there were some inventory issues and what-not with AVWW1, the fact that only loot is from the occasional area containing a treasure box makes me less enthusiastic. In fact, it leads to the following issue:

- I see little reason to kill mobs. As far as I'm concerned (and aware), they serve little purpose other than blocking me from getting to my objective. I often just run past the majority of them. There needs to be more of a reason to kill these guys. In AVWW1, we had those things that we could use as a currency to buy items, as well as the fact that killing more mobs made those mobs harder. While I'm not saying that's exactly what we need, we do need more of a reason to kill mobs than we currently have.

- Boss fights. At least I think they are? The fights in the level up areas preceded by a cutscene. I don't know if these fights are epic or not, because I just go on top of the boss dude and spam my #4 ultimate ability a couple times and he dies. I do this for all the windmills and what-not as well. These #4 abilities should do a lot less damage to towers and bosses IMO.

- I'm pretty certain I wasn't told to keep my survivors away from demonica until a turn before he was about to come out. The problem is that I had 3 survivors right near him when I was told this, so I ended up having one die. This could be remedied by mentioning he demolishes your survivors on your very first turn as well as the one prior to him coming out.

- I'm sure this one is going to be worked in during beta and into release, but some of the mage types seem a lot more OPd than others. For example, there is one, I think the illuminologist, where there autoattack blows up and sends out tons of tiny projectiles. This does a crapload of damage and 1-2 shots most things whether they are above you, below you, or in front of you. Another mage, some sort of earth mage I think, has a #2 ability that is stronger on charge, but is probably the worst ability out of any of the several mage type's abilities that I had.

- I heard from a dev video that we could unlock more mage types, but didn't hear anything about that while ingame. More information told early on about that, even very briefly, would be quite useful and perhaps even a bit reassuring (i.e. to people that want more abilities but don't know how to get them or if they can get them).


Finally, a bug:
I can not climb up one of the level up towers I was in. I killed the boss and the door led here. It's impossible to make this jump: http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=114673065
Here's my world folder: http://www.mediafire.com/?rf63r37ud9nh63b


Overall, AVWW2 is a very fun game. I've had a blast in the beta thus far. Thanks a lot for all your hard work.
« Last Edit: December 21, 2012, 04:01:17 am by timebomb »

Offline Mánagarmr

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Re: AVWW2 Beta: Brief opinions/observations and a bug report.
« Reply #1 on: December 21, 2012, 04:43:31 am »
- I see little reason to kill mobs. As far as I'm concerned (and aware), they serve little purpose other than blocking me from getting to my objective. I often just run past the majority of them. There needs to be more of a reason to kill these guys. In AVWW1, we had those things that we could use as a currency to buy items, as well as the fact that killing more mobs made those mobs harder. While I'm not saying that's exactly what we need, we do need more of a reason to kill mobs than we currently have.
Actually, there was no reason to kill mobs in AVWW1 either, aside from getting the occasional health drops. It was removed to prevent farming, which is what it inevitably leads to. In order to play optimally, you have to kill every single enemy and grind mobs. It's a lot less fun than simply having enemies as obstacles.

In fact, AVWW2 is remarkably similar to old school platformers in that enemies drop only health and ammo.
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Offline Misery

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Re: AVWW2 Beta: Brief opinions/observations and a bug report.
« Reply #2 on: December 21, 2012, 04:59:50 am »
- I see little reason to kill mobs. As far as I'm concerned (and aware), they serve little purpose other than blocking me from getting to my objective. I often just run past the majority of them. There needs to be more of a reason to kill these guys. In AVWW1, we had those things that we could use as a currency to buy items, as well as the fact that killing more mobs made those mobs harder. While I'm not saying that's exactly what we need, we do need more of a reason to kill mobs than we currently have.
Actually, there was no reason to kill mobs in AVWW1 either, aside from getting the occasional health drops. It was removed to prevent farming, which is what it inevitably leads to. In order to play optimally, you have to kill every single enemy and grind mobs. It's a lot less fun than simply having enemies as obstacles.

In fact, AVWW2 is remarkably similar to old school platformers in that enemies drop only health and ammo.


Yep.   The old Metroid games were like that as well.   You werent expected to kill absolutely everything, and the game would take forever if you tried to.   I think that sort of idea fits in well with the sort of combat that this game is going for.  There's generally alot of options for dealing with monsters so far, and if the best option for the current situation is "jump over it", well, that's fine too.  Doing so might allow you to reach your goal for the area that much faster.

I do though often find that in many situations, this really isnt feasable.   I seem to see plenty of times where enemies really are IN THE WAY, and it's either kill them, or take unnecessary damage doing so.   And taking hits then means I need to pop more of them afterwards to get that health back.   That's how it's been in my game so far, anyway.   PARTICULARLY once enemy patterns started changing.   Those balloons, and now those squid things with the blue boomerang shots... usually, I *have* to take them out entirely, now, if I want to get past without losing half my health.



Now lets see, to respond to the OP:

First, I agree that bosses need more health right now.    I dont think these guys scale very well, whereas many normal foes seem to scale pretty much fine.  Doesnt help that bosses are extremely vulnerable to certain types of spells (rocket spells, for instance, or those "wave" ones).

I also agree on the fact that some spell classes are very definitely OP right now.   Tier 3 spells, Plumicler as a whole could use a damage nerf, as could Vervician.  For Plumicler, that Insect Rocket spell in particular is extremely spammable.  Against bosses, it just deletes them.  Shatters most of their spells, too.

Agree on the equipment as well, which is something I'd wanted to bring up.    The game HAS an equipment system and it's an interesting one.... but the extreme rarity of these items caused by their fragileness means that you rarely see it in action, and it may as well not be there.    Since the items are so very breakable in a game where it's very easy to take lots of hits or just die outright, these things should be COMMON.   Some of them break after you take just one hit from something!

And finally, yeah, the game needs to mention that stronger mage classes get unlocked as you go along.  I hadnt known that at first either.

Offline timebomb

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Re: AVWW2 Beta: Brief opinions/observations and a bug report.
« Reply #3 on: December 21, 2012, 05:05:17 am »
- I see little reason to kill mobs. As far as I'm concerned (and aware), they serve little purpose other than blocking me from getting to my objective. I often just run past the majority of them. There needs to be more of a reason to kill these guys. In AVWW1, we had those things that we could use as a currency to buy items, as well as the fact that killing more mobs made those mobs harder. While I'm not saying that's exactly what we need, we do need more of a reason to kill mobs than we currently have.
Actually, there was no reason to kill mobs in AVWW1 either, aside from getting the occasional health drops. It was removed to prevent farming, which is what it inevitably leads to. In order to play optimally, you have to kill every single enemy and grind mobs. It's a lot less fun than simply having enemies as obstacles.

In fact, AVWW2 is remarkably similar to old school platformers in that enemies drop only health and ammo.


Yep.   The old Metroid games were like that as well.   You werent expected to kill absolutely everything, and the game would take forever if you tried to.   I think that sort of idea fits in well with the sort of combat that this game is going for.  There's generally alot of options for dealing with monsters so far, and if the best option for the current situation is "jump over it", well, that's fine too.  Doing so might allow you to reach your goal for the area that much faster.

I do though often find that in many situations, this really isnt feasable.   I seem to see plenty of times where enemies really are IN THE WAY, and it's either kill them, or take unnecessary damage doing so.   And taking hits then means I need to pop more of them afterwards to get that health back.   That's how it's been in my game so far, anyway.   PARTICULARLY once enemy patterns started changing.   Those balloons, and now those squid things with the blue boomerang shots... usually, I *have* to take them out entirely, now, if I want to get past without losing half my health.

In regards specifically to the bolded text, if that's true, then that's excellent. Currently, I think I am nearing turn 10-ish and I have no issues running through 95%+ of mobs to get to my objective.

Offline Misery

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Re: AVWW2 Beta: Brief opinions/observations and a bug report.
« Reply #4 on: December 21, 2012, 05:58:24 am »


In regards specifically to the bolded text, if that's true, then that's excellent. Currently, I think I am nearing turn 10-ish and I have no issues running through 95%+ of mobs to get to my objective.

The difficulty setting is also important for that.... out of curiosity, which are you on?

I'm on skilled, and at my current point in the game, alot of enemies are starting to get mean.  Heck, those squid things were real nasty customers before, but suddenly they got even worse, with double the amount of bullets.    And worst of all is encountering those guys in a cave system.   The caves in general just seem alot more dangerous.   When you're on a surface sort of tile?  Yeah, you can leap over many things, particularly if you have Storm Dash.  It dont help you at all in caves and buildings though.

And if you like a challenge, you'll be pleased to know that it ramps up quite nicely as the game goes on, and individual turns go by faster as you get used to it.    I'm on turn 53 in mine, and most things hit pretty hard (and I still have quite alot of the game yet to do).  Pretty easy to die at this point if I'm not careful.   Early turns though, yeah, they're pretty easy on purpose.

Just wait'll you get to a research facility though.  Hah.  There might be a more difficult type of area in the game, but if there is, I've yet to encounter it.

Offline timebomb

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Re: AVWW2 Beta: Brief opinions/observations and a bug report.
« Reply #5 on: December 21, 2012, 06:05:53 am »
I'm on all of the normal, unchanged difficulty settings. I'm glad to hear the difficulty ramps up as the game goes on :). Can you change the difficulty in the middle of the game like you could in AVWW1?

Offline Misery

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Re: AVWW2 Beta: Brief opinions/observations and a bug report.
« Reply #6 on: December 21, 2012, 06:58:21 am »
I'm on all of the normal, unchanged difficulty settings. I'm glad to hear the difficulty ramps up as the game goes on :). Can you change the difficulty in the middle of the game like you could in AVWW1?

Nope.  Once you set it, it stays that way for the duration of the game.

If it's being too easy though.... could always just start a new save.

Offline madcow

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Re: AVWW2 Beta: Brief opinions/observations and a bug report.
« Reply #7 on: December 21, 2012, 08:46:24 am »
The rocket type spells are a confirmed bug by the way. They're supposed to do the same damage regardless of how many particles hit (something like 10x less than they do on a direct hit now). So hopefully that'll be fixed soon.

Offline Misery

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Re: AVWW2 Beta: Brief opinions/observations and a bug report.
« Reply #8 on: December 21, 2012, 09:18:43 am »
The rocket type spells are a confirmed bug by the way. They're supposed to do the same damage regardless of how many particles hit (something like 10x less than they do on a direct hit now). So hopefully that'll be fixed soon.

Ah!   That reminds me..... it seems that spells of that sort (and certain other types) are causing enemies to NOT drop health or ammo?   Or am I just getting absurdly unlucky?

Offline madcow

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Re: AVWW2 Beta: Brief opinions/observations and a bug report.
« Reply #9 on: December 21, 2012, 10:20:01 am »
The rocket type spells are a confirmed bug by the way. They're supposed to do the same damage regardless of how many particles hit (something like 10x less than they do on a direct hit now). So hopefully that'll be fixed soon.

Ah!   That reminds me..... it seems that spells of that sort (and certain other types) are causing enemies to NOT drop health or ammo?   Or am I just getting absurdly unlucky?

That one's on mantis too.

Offline timebomb

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Re: AVWW2 Beta: Brief opinions/observations and a bug report.
« Reply #10 on: December 21, 2012, 11:57:54 pm »
After watching the start of Gezmo's Let's Play AVWW2 vid, I noticed that it appears that we can move multiple people at once to do a task rather than just one person. I didn't know this, and this would address my issues with losing one survivor when Demonica came out. The player should definitely be told that this is possible at some point in the tutorial IMO.

Offline Chemuel

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Re: AVWW2 Beta: Brief opinions/observations and a bug report.
« Reply #11 on: December 22, 2012, 05:30:42 am »
Okay, I love the game.

Now for some details.



Poison pills, equipment and survival


Currently there is very little incentive to survive. Go down the hole, grab the perk, suicide. Kill the Bossmob, smash the totem, suicide. As I understand it, the prime reason not to die is supposed to be equipment. Equipment You can only ever have one of, that breaks uncontrollably and is currently very rare.

Now, just making equipment more common does not remedy the issue at all. Die - find a new toy. Or maybe You have found that legendary plushytoy of overlord-obliterating + 9 - in which case dying is of no consequence either, as You would lose that thing long before You get anywhere You might possibly need it as it... breaks.

My suggestions for making survival more appealing and the equipment more interesting:

1. Give us a full blown inventory system. Nothing with an interface or visible stats - the "unknown properties with cool names" idea is awesome. But let us have boots, a belt maybe, a talisman, armor and possibly a weapon that can be used as a talisman. Just create slots of sorts. Make the items breakable by specific hits from bosses - but not otherwise. You lose equipment only by replacing it with an item that goes in the same slot - or by dying. Dying could remove all equipment, which would be super-harsh, or one random piece. That way You would be worried about dying because You could loose Your invincibilizing bigstick of smashing everything + 5 and try to avoid it. On the other hand, You could collect loot that actually feels like something nice to have. Also, then You'd really stand in front of the box and think if the item with the strange name is possibly better than what You have now. Right now I usually just look if it says something crappy and skip it, otherwise I take it, as it breaks anyway before I leave the level.

2. As an alternative I suggest making these items more like talismans - which if I understand correctly they are supposed to be anyway. Give them their own health that adds to Your own, and let them heal with the little green orbs, or maybe ammo, or a third drop type (another incentive to actually kill mobs then). They would become weaker with taking damage as well, but You could refresh them with the life-force of slain monsters. That way, even with only one item You would have a way to protect and keep something nice You found, would also be forced to think about replacing the item with a new one - and of course avoid dying.



The strategic game


Okay, maybe I am just very strategically inept or have missed a point here but I like everything about it - except the challenge. Or rather, the type of challenge. You run around, secureing spots of interest and sending Your people out to build kewl stuff. Now currently I feel that is a waste of time. The strategic game feels less like chess and more like a turn based lava-escape. I get it that the big bad should be big and bad, but having it randomly wade through my buildings - special ones just as well as grasslands and ruining them while I can do absolutely nothing about it? Not nice. Furthermore a simple computation. Overlord has four tiles of movement on rook difficulty. Means he destroys four tiles a turn. I can secure a maximum of four relevant tiles a turn (the one with the generator, plus at best three adjacent ones). The places that unlock by themselves seem to be just caves at the moment, that, for the strategic game's purposes are a meaningless wasteland. The game furthermore tells me that nasty fella is going to gain in speed. Conclusion - the survivors are losing ground. Constantly. Building something is a waste of time, as You can do exactly one dispatch per turn. You need that to clear away those nasty warded towers and towns. And You flee, hoping that the stuff You secure every turn can make up for the production lost to the overlord. In this context more survivors also are a massive liability - they consume more than YOu will be able to afford, sooner or later, while keeping them all in one spot to do the one mission You are allowed per turn obsoletes the idea of having more survivors to lose later. Spreading them out just creates more danger without benefit.
In conclusion, the idea of having all these kewl buildings with different attributes and the option to build new ones, an entire survivor-economy even, but being allowed to keep none of them is frustrating.

Now I do not have smart suggestions. Either You want that feeling of being on the run constantly, but then the environment must be more streamlined for that - all the building and secureing makes little sense, it's more scavenge and run then. Would be a bit underwhelming. Or You want an actual strategic game (anyone else senses the inspiration from those zombie-survival games that circled around the net for a while?).

Suggestions would be

 - to allow more dispatches a turn, maybe from special buildings.
 - to allow building fortifications that take the overlord one step (not turn!) to destroy, slowing him down.
 - to include a basic guideline on how to kite the overlord in the tutorial (as said, I am somewhat challenged strategy-wise, so I have not figured out how the thing actually ticks...) - maybe an analysis of his methods from the time You studied at the keep?
 - to create a dispatch mission type that is dangerous to boot and has a high death/injury ratio that will fortify an area against the big bad's attack.
 - to create a dispatch mission that will actively attack the overlord to slow him down, same risk as above (maybe a raid on his supply-train?)
 - to create a player mission that would slow down the overlord one step - or maybe several, depending on performance but end the strategic turn
 - to balance that out by giving the Lieutenants an active strategic role. (Like chess? Only one move in a specific direction possible at first? Later two diagonal ones? Or the classic knight-jump?)
 - to have him spend turns re-erecting generators, means, secureing, some of the areas he has trampled?
 - to combine the active participation of the survivors with the bestiary idea - slaying more monsters of a type could slightly increase their chances of success or at least survival when battling a lieutenant/the overlord using mainly a certain type of monster as "army".

I would think all of the above could be a way to make the game more interesting strategy-wise, give You as a player more of a desperate-fight-for-survival-feeling, instead of a desperate flight for survival. It would make having more survivors more worthwhile and also make the strategic game more of an economic clash (which is still threatening, as the overlord has no weak spots and will constantly gain in power - more steps a turn means more destructive potential, even if he can be held up for one or more steps a turn). Spending dispatches and player-turns on slowing the overlord would have to be weighed against expansion and secureing of new territory - especially level up mills, as every turn the overlord is stalled the player still becomes more of a whimp by global power inflation. Also You could really "defend" a strategically important place - for example one that allows for another dispatch per turn/ every two turns, at an increasing economic cost and danger to Your population.

I am very aware that these are suggestions that do not yet really add up to a good concept, and so far noone else has complained about the way things work on the strategy map. So... maybe just the part in the tutorial, or help at least, about how to handle that monster?


(Now given that I am rather new to these forums and the thing has come up - it's just feedback based on my personal experience. So I'd be glad if anyone sharing my perception would say so.)



Finally, about the feeling of the game:


It's not as bleak as the predecessor, which as I understood the announcements was intended. Now however we have the tortured hero. Who, while wakeing up in the keep when dying is still not all that tortured in the actual game. Therefore I'd suggest the following:

A tutorial mission where the player is still in training with the overlord. Running around, actually murdering innocent survivors while learning the game. Would display just how great the difference in power between these denizens of darkness and Your average survivor is as well as give the "the things I had to do" sentence some depth. As a replacement for the respawn-stone a Leiutenant could be sent along, commenting and reviving the player/ warping him out if he dies.
[edit: idea already exists, and in much more detail: http://www.arcengames.com/forums/index.php/topic,12207.0.html ]


Expanding on this idea I would suggest flashback-missions. Maybe every n number of turns or after rescueing a survivor, or capturing a specific landmark - maybe after a level up, or several of these, the turn update sends the player through a flash-back dream of his past. Working for Daimonaica or for/with one of the Lieutenants the player might be tasked to hunt survivors or kill a specific leader (a more generic boss"monster"), capture a landmark for the overlord and build a windstorm generator, destroy a specific item or structure important to the survivors or do some collecting or clearing out missions to expand the keep (i.e. "capturing" a specific type of monster that then is unlocked on the map later). Type of mission could be linked to the reason it pops up (rescueing a survivor reminds the hero of how he would hunt them, and so on). Success in the mission could reward perk tokens, special items, or in an addition to the above ideas for equipment an update to something the character already has. Maybe it could unlock a second active perk per level, or maybe every n missions could do so, or an activation for a perk independent from level.
The clue here I think should be, that if the character dies he just failed the mission and wakes up at that point. No reward, no problem. If he succeeds he gains the reward (having been a more powerful servant of the overlord now also means he is stronger in the present, especially after "accepting" the supressed memory) but morale of the survivors takes a hit and maybe monsters should become one or several turns stronger then, as a successful player on the side of the villain also means that he is stronger to begin with.

« Last Edit: December 22, 2012, 05:34:59 am by Chemuel »

Offline Misery

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Re: AVWW2 Beta: Brief opinions/observations and a bug report.
« Reply #12 on: December 22, 2012, 08:14:22 am »

Big block of stuff



A few things:

1, I agree with you on the poison pills.  However, while I myself have not reached the later parts of the game, as I understand it, the rules for death change at some point;  you do have to actually destroy the Oblivion Crystal at some point, which is the thing that allows you to constantly resurrect in the first place.   But the earlier parts of the game where the thing is intact, yeah, there should be SOME effect from death.  Though, dont forget.... the game isnt finished yet.  They might put something in there for this (or they might not).

2.  The strategy bit.  I do think it's deeper than you might be seeing it.   Building VS Destroying, for instance.  The vast majority of the time, you're not doing to be wrecking things.... you should be building, or moving large distances via the Rally command, generally on the way to a spot to build something on.  The only real reason to smash down those.... er.... "evil town" places or whatever they are, AKA, the barriers on the map, is because you need to get your main character past it to something on the other side.  If they're not very directly in the way.... no need to bother with them.   They're basically just wall tiles.  Try other directions first, if some of those are in your way.  The evil outposts as well.... you dont HAVE to destroy these.  They simply make adjacent tiles more difficult.... that's about it.  If one of them is really giving you alot of trouble, THEN go and wreck it.   But most of the time, you can just ignore them.  Simply be aware of which tiles they're affecting, and prepare perks correctly, and be very careful going through the tile in question.   Most of the time, at least by my experience so far, you want to be building things, and doing stuff that gives you benefits or necessary things like food/mana/scrap/whatever.   As you find more and more types of tiles, your options will continue to increase.  It'll go from "Ok, do I make another farm, or another factory" to "Ok, another farm, or a factory, or do I repair the tower, or build a covered farm in the swamp, or build a clinic, or make more housing, or....".   Sorta like that.   The earliest parts of the game when you havent explored much will be fairly simple compared to later on.

About unlocking via expansion:  This is entirely dependant on the RNG.   You're going to find LOTS of different types of tiles.  Caves are only one type... you'll be finding buildings and factories and houses and apartments and castles and various special structures like Ivory Towers or Pyramids.   There's way too many for me to list here.  And all of these different tiles DO something, so long as they are "unlocked" by clearing the area, and so long as they are intact.   Just keep going forward with it, you'll see what I mean.  If you're going into one area and there's mostly just wilderness and caves?  Might wanna go try a different direction on the map, because you definitely do need lots more stuff than caves (not that caves arent a good thing, and there might be times when you WANT to find caves to get perks, but they're proving difficult to come by).


The Overlord:  Yeah, it's not always too clear just HOW this guy moves exactly.   Even if his max range is, say, 5 tiles, he wont always MOVE 5 tiles.  Actually destroying buildings seems to take up a certain amount of his "moves" per turn.   He's powerful, but he's not going to just be wrecking 5 apartments and a castle all in one go, generally.   Alot of times when he IS smashing stuff, his range for that turn will be quite reduced.   And there's also YOUR range to think about.   Not only can you increase the base move range of your survivors by claiming castles, but you can increase the.... er.... "unlock" range, AKA, the range of tiles that open up when you destroy a wind thingy.  I think the game explains this in your strategic overview.... "Amplification Towers", I think they're called.   You want these.  As you get more, your unlock-at-once range will go up.... so long as Jerkface doesnt go step on it.   Like everything else though, you can re-build it with a mission.  And of course, based on the layout of the land, the boss isnt always going to be able to actually smash something on a given turn, he may have to use the entire turn JUST moving, similar to your "rally" command with survivors.   Again though, as you find more tiles and see how things work and what options you have, the strategy here will start to make more sense.   Alot of strategy in deciding what to build/do, WHEN to build/do it, and so on.  Breaking down the wall/town/whatever tiles and such is still important, but you seriously wont be doing it all that often.     The number of survivors, the reasons for increasing that number (and knowing WHEN to try to increase it by rescuing them), and reasons to split them up (yes, you're probably going to want to do this, for various reasons) should become a bit more clear as you go along.  One hint:  Even if you have your guys all split up, it's often very easy to immediately get all of them back together in a single turn when you need to, particularly as you unlock warp points and castles.

There's alot of different ways to go about things here, though I do agree that it's not always super clear, when learning it.   The game sorta explains the earliest bits of it, and there's some good stuff with the strategic overview, but alot of other things, it just dumps you in the deep end, lol.   And then you find out that the deep end keeps getting deeper yet (in a good way, though).


After having spent many hours with the game now myself, I can say this:  The strategy part of the game IS really pretty deep.... Arcen knows what they're doing when it comes to strategy in general.  This part of the game has gotten lots of praise so far for good reason.   But it can be tough to learn, and figuring out all of the different tactics and such that you can use to get ahead isnt always so easy.   

Good feedback post, though, overall.
« Last Edit: December 22, 2012, 08:19:46 am by Misery »

Offline Jagobah

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Re: AVWW2 Beta: Brief opinions/observations and a bug report.
« Reply #13 on: December 26, 2012, 04:31:07 pm »
I'm replying to this thread to confirm that the bug the OP found is a bug that I've also encountered, in regards to the generated levels being impossible to complete in the Level Up Windmills.


I originally made a post about this in the Steam discussion area in the AVWW2's Game Hub area.  The direct link for it can be found here:  http://steamcommunity.com/app/228320/discussions/0/846940247983186585/


My screenshot:  http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=115407569
My world:  http://www.jagobah.org/Jagobah_Environ_TEST.zip


I hope this is helpful for the devs.

Offline Panopticon

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  • Posts: 274
Re: AVWW2 Beta: Brief opinions/observations and a bug report.
« Reply #14 on: December 26, 2012, 10:16:39 pm »
I've been thinking that a possibility for a death penalty could be something along the lines of disabling perks for a turn or three. Some kind of effect that lasts over a turn but not too long, more than three turns would feel too long in my opinion. This wouldn't be crippling most likely but it would remove some pretty cool buffs and would be nice at representing a weakened state.

Or maybe you lose access to the mage class and perks you were using at the time of death for a turn or three. Something like that will discourage Poison Pill abuse without being too crippling.