Author Topic: XCOM 2  (Read 7084 times)

Offline Wingflier

  • Core Member Mark II
  • *****
  • Posts: 2,741
  • To add me on Steam, click the little Steam icon ^
Re: XCOM 2
« Reply #30 on: February 08, 2016, 12:02:11 AM »
may I ask how that extreme that random number generator for this game is? I just did the first mission of xeno earlier and it didn't seem to obnoxious kind of at the level at which I'm willing to cope with really.
It seems random, like Mick says. Sometimes you get screwed, but your soldiers are meant to die, it's all part of the game. Even if you lose an entire squad, you can still win the greater campaign. You can also retreat if things start to get too hairy.
"Inner peace is the void of expectation. It is the absence of our shared desperation to feel a certain way."

Offline Aklyon

  • Core Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2,088
Re: XCOM 2
« Reply #31 on: February 08, 2016, 01:49:44 AM »
You can also retreat if things start to get too hairy.
This. Is important. Not so much if you reload too often (me), but for people actually doing things ironman, its not EU. Theres only a couple missions where the evac point is already set, for the rest you can and are allowed to run away from fights. Just make sure you bring all your soldiers gear with you if possible, otherwise you'll lose it.

Also, you can extend the timers, delay the timers while you're in stealth (in exchange for slightly shorter timers), or just remove them entirely. All three are available mod options.

Offline Coppermantis

  • Hero Member Mark III
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,209
  • Avenger? I hardly know 'er!
Re: XCOM 2
« Reply #32 on: February 08, 2016, 02:26:34 AM »
So I had a grenadier get hit by a sectoid's psychic attack and panic. She ran into distant cover, took a snap shot at the sectoid, and killed it with a critical hit.

Sometimes the RNG just works, you know?


I'm finding that the missions themselves are easier, but the geoscape is harder. I'm currently playing on commander difficulty, and most missions have been easier for me than playing EW on hard. The ones that aren't though, those absolutely wreck me. I'm not playing on ironman so I'll save-scum total squad wipes though.

As for the mission timer, I like it a lot. The game would be too easy I feel if I could just slowly crawl forward in Overwatch like in EW. The timer makes it a lot more tense and exciting; I had a VIP mission that I got out on the very last possible turn. Reinforcements came in and were camping the evac zone, had to cut through them as hastily as I could. There was a great moment where one of my rangers took out the last trooper with her sword and roped out right afterwards, I like to imagine that she reached down and sliced him up as she was ascending into the Skyranger.


The geoscape though, that's a whole different piece of work. I thought I could get away with putting off the blacksite mission until I had some good equipment, but now the Avatar Project is two steps from completion. Lesson learned, get Radio ASAP. Also get the Advanced Warfare Center or whatever it is early on. The way health/armor works now means that soldiers get wounded far more often. That really screwed me over when my high-ranking troops are out of the action for nineteen(!) days. Probably contributed to my delay on the blacksite, as I wanted my full A-team to be ready when I took it on.

I love how much stronger everything feels. Mutons and Sectoids are scary now. Codexes are straight up murder machines but they're so satisfying to kill. (Recently figured out that you can kill enemies by making them fall to their deaths when I grenaded a Codex on a rooftop and it fell down two stories). I'm terrified to see what new things the aliens will reveal at every corner.
I can already tell this is going to be a roller coaster ride of disappointment.

Offline TheVampire100

  • Hero Member Mark III
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,232
  • Ordinary Vampire
Re: XCOM 2
« Reply #33 on: February 08, 2016, 03:11:24 AM »
What I hate the most about XCOM 2 are the loading times. Everythign else is finde but the loading times seem too high. Esspecially when you just coem back from a mission to your HQ. Why does it load so long? I would except this from the missions, but the loading times of the missions are faster.
I don't seem to be the only one, that has this problem, Nerf Now even dedicated a whole comic strip to this problem right after the game came out: http://www.nerfnow.com/comic/1743

Offline Mánagarmr

  • Core Member Mark V
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,254
  • if (isInRange(target)) { kill(target); }
Re: XCOM 2
« Reply #34 on: February 08, 2016, 06:35:34 AM »
Wait, there's  a turn limit on ALL missions now? Not sure I'm a fan of that.
Click here to get started with Mantis for Suggestions and Bug Reports.

Thank you for contributing to making the game better!

Offline TheVampire100

  • Hero Member Mark III
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,232
  • Ordinary Vampire
Re: XCOM 2
« Reply #35 on: February 08, 2016, 07:43:37 AM »
Wait, there's  a turn limit on ALL missions now? Not sure I'm a fan of that.
No one seems to, whenever you ask someone what he does not like about XCOM 2, you will most likely get "The turn limit on missions".
This was introduced to counter the very popular overwatch exploit in the first game. Players set everyone on Overwatch after each move and when someone finally found the aliens, they got shot by all the soldiers on overwatch to death, making  alot of fights trivial before they even began. The turn limit shall now speed up the gameplay, so they won't turtle in a chokepoint and wait for the aliens to come.

Here are two mods, that might interest you:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=616857663
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=616964599

The first increases the amount of turns you have in each mission (about 4 turns more at hand), so you still have a limit but don't have to rush so fast.
The second disables timers entirely except some story related missions and some special mission type where they are needed. Bot mods will still allow you to play the game normaly and with achievments on.
There is also one mod that tweaks the game that turns count only down while you are visble to the enemy, so as long as you stay hidden, no time passes.
I have none of the mods installes, so I cannot confirm if they are reliable.

Offline Mánagarmr

  • Core Member Mark V
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,254
  • if (isInRange(target)) { kill(target); }
Re: XCOM 2
« Reply #36 on: February 08, 2016, 08:00:58 AM »
The turn limit remove while concealed sounds clever. Although the concealement mechanic is just a tad bit contrived. But whatever, I'll probably not get XCOM2 anytime soon so I'll have time to look over my options. ^^ Thanks for the links though.
Click here to get started with Mantis for Suggestions and Bug Reports.

Thank you for contributing to making the game better!

Offline Mick

  • Hero Member Mark II
  • *****
  • Posts: 911
Re: XCOM 2
« Reply #37 on: February 08, 2016, 12:53:03 PM »
There is not a turn limit on all missions. In fact, the harder missions in the game have no turn limit at all.

The ones that are there are really not much of an issue. One type is a limit to complete an objective (hack a thing, destroy a thing), so you get infinite time after that objective is complete. In both cases, you can complete the objective remotely (specialist can hack from a huge distance, destroy objectives can simply be shot at with always 100% hit rate). Honestly, I don't know how people are having trouble with these.

The other type is less common and is more difficult, that's where you have to extract a VIP. You get a longer turn limit but you have to extract and leave within it. However, in these mission you do not have to kill all the aliens, once you get to the extraction point you finish.

These are part of the more or less 'standard' mission pool. The real challenges come from the blacksites, which have no timer at all (at least I haven't seen one yet).

Offline Mánagarmr

  • Core Member Mark V
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,254
  • if (isInRange(target)) { kill(target); }
Re: XCOM 2
« Reply #38 on: February 08, 2016, 01:31:34 PM »
There is not a turn limit on all missions. In fact, the harder missions in the game have no turn limit at all.

The ones that are there are really not much of an issue. One type is a limit to complete an objective (hack a thing, destroy a thing), so you get infinite time after that objective is complete. In both cases, you can complete the objective remotely (specialist can hack from a huge distance, destroy objectives can simply be shot at with always 100% hit rate). Honestly, I don't know how people are having trouble with these.

The other type is less common and is more difficult, that's where you have to extract a VIP. You get a longer turn limit but you have to extract and leave within it. However, in these mission you do not have to kill all the aliens, once you get to the extraction point you finish.

These are part of the more or less 'standard' mission pool. The real challenges come from the blacksites, which have no timer at all (at least I haven't seen one yet).
Now I'm getting conflicting messages. You're saying some missions are not limited, while
No one seems to, whenever you ask someone what he does not like about XCOM 2, you will most likely get "The turn limit on missions".
This was introduced to counter the very popular overwatch exploit in the first game. Players set everyone on Overwatch after each move and when someone finally found the aliens, they got shot by all the soldiers on overwatch to death, making  alot of fights trivial before they even began. The turn limit shall now speed up the gameplay, so they won't turtle in a chokepoint and wait for the aliens to come.
says they all are.

Wut?
Click here to get started with Mantis for Suggestions and Bug Reports.

Thank you for contributing to making the game better!

Offline Mick

  • Hero Member Mark II
  • *****
  • Posts: 911
Re: XCOM 2
« Reply #39 on: February 08, 2016, 01:43:08 PM »
It's simple, anyone saying that all missions have a turn limit is either misinformed or lying.

Offline Aklyon

  • Core Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2,088
Re: XCOM 2
« Reply #40 on: February 08, 2016, 02:17:02 PM »
Some have timers, and some do not.

Offline Mánagarmr

  • Core Member Mark V
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,254
  • if (isInRange(target)) { kill(target); }
Re: XCOM 2
« Reply #41 on: February 08, 2016, 02:43:00 PM »
It's simple, anyone saying that all missions have a turn limit is either misinformed or lying.
Gotcha. Then it's similar to how XCOMEU was then and I didn't mind that much.
Click here to get started with Mantis for Suggestions and Bug Reports.

Thank you for contributing to making the game better!

Offline Misery

  • Global Moderator
  • Core Member Mark V
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,031
Re: XCOM 2
« Reply #42 on: February 08, 2016, 04:16:36 PM »
So... seems that the general consensus on this one is positive?  As opposed to yet another game that's dumbed down and screwed up or filled with microtransactions?

Granted, that timed-missions thing sounds kinda irritating... but other than that it sounds pretty good from what's being said here.

I need to go and actually finish the first game though (not the original, I mean Enemy Unknown and the expansion).  Aint played that in awhile, not really for any specific reason...

Offline crazyroosterman

  • Master Member Mark II
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,551
  • Cluck.
Re: XCOM 2
« Reply #43 on: February 08, 2016, 04:21:43 PM »
may I ask how that extreme that random number generator for this game is? I just did the first mission of xeno earlier and it didn't seem to obnoxious kind of at the level at which I'm willing to cope with really.
It seems random, like Mick says. Sometimes you get screwed, but your soldiers are meant to die, it's all part of the game. Even if you lose an entire squad, you can still win the greater campaigin. You can also retreat if things start to get too hairy.
I'm not entirely sure what I meant by that my self I guess that just a product of it being past midnight what I meant to ask was how much can you alter the rng on things like hit chance I've seen more video of that game since yesterday though so I think I'm satisfied there.
c.r

Offline Wingflier

  • Core Member Mark II
  • *****
  • Posts: 2,741
  • To add me on Steam, click the little Steam icon ^
Re: XCOM 2
« Reply #44 on: February 08, 2016, 04:42:16 PM »
It's interesting, because I find the turn limits to be my favorite ADDITION to the game, as compared to either XCOM:EU or Xenonauts.

Once again, before there was just no reason not to play as cautiously as possible, slowly leap-frogging from cover to cover in a grueling process that could sometimes take 10-15 minutes before you even encountered the first enemy. Even after you defeated the first squad of enemies, it could be another 10-15 minutes before you found the next squad. It just wasn't fun, but the game was balanced around the idea that you were doing that, especially on the harder difficulties, so the slow, slogging pace of the game was the norm.

With the turn-limits and the new conceal mechanics, it takes a fraction of the time to get into the action (by necessity), but the game is balanced around this, so you're less likely to get trolled in the process.
"Inner peace is the void of expectation. It is the absence of our shared desperation to feel a certain way."