Author Topic: Back to the Red  (Read 1380 times)

Offline Faulty Logic

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Back to the Red
« on: April 09, 2013, 06:46:23 PM »
You think the Wanderer Bug is resolved? Not if I have anything to say about it.

70 planets Spokes 1417703512 Fireflies

Marauders 4
Resistance 10
Rebellions 4
Roaming Enclaves 4
Fallen Spire 4
Golems 4
Spirecraft 4
Trader
Spire Civilian Leaders (haven't tried these in ages)

Normal+Champ, Schizo, Complete visibility, No Plots, No AIP/time

To compensate for this reasonably friendly setup, I'm playing against the
Crafty Spire/Technologist Parasite.

Okay, first priority is to survive the MkIV starships in the second wave. HarvesterIIIs unlocked.

I need to be cost-effective for the first ~16 minutes before the mkIV wave. That means minefields, fighters, fireflies, riot starships, and turrets.

First two waves survived. Pysite raid for 8 jumpships complete. MkI starships complete. Gametime 48:29.

By 58:24 I have assassinated 5 spire civilian leaders, freed one (who comes with a cursed golem and speed boost fab, which will be nice when I actually colonize the planet) and raided two DCs to keep effective AIP at 10.

I now remember why I normally play with SCLs off. I hate time pressure.

« Last Edit: April 09, 2013, 07:15:15 PM by Faulty Logic »
If warheads can't solve it, use more warheads.

Offline keith.lamothe

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Re: Back to the Red
« Reply #1 on: April 09, 2013, 08:02:00 PM »
You think the Wanderer Bug is resolved? Not if I have anything to say about it.
It's just a ploy to provoke AARs, really.

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Spire Civilian Leaders (haven't tried these in ages)
Not making it easy on yourself, there.  Though I guess you'll just terminate the collaborators.

Quote
Crafty Spire/Technologist Parasite.
10/10 with a Technologist is never friendly.
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Offline Faulty Logic

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Re: Back to the Red
« Reply #2 on: April 10, 2013, 08:45:38 PM »
This game died the slow death.
A combination of the following stopped all progress:
Nemesis frigates, endless streams of nemesis frigates.
Zenith traitor constantly giving fortifications to the the AI hub worlds.
Some sociopath allowing spirecraft into special forces (and not updated the crafty spire text description to reflect this).
With an exo building up, I was flat-out not having fun. So I'm starting a new game:

70 planets Spokes Fireflies 1367194527

Marauders 4
Resistance 10
Rebellions 4
Roaming Enclaves 4
Fallen Spire 4
Golems 4
Spirecraft 4
Trader Traitors. They are now disabled.
Spire Civilian Leaders (haven't tried these in ages) Still haven't given them a full game.

Normal+Champ, Schizo, Complete visibility, No Plots, No AIP/time

Vanilla/ Techno Parasite

Minefields are awesome for the first couple waves.
« Last Edit: April 11, 2013, 01:45:05 AM by Faulty Logic »
If warheads can't solve it, use more warheads.

Offline keith.lamothe

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Re: Back to the Red
« Reply #3 on: April 10, 2013, 09:04:18 PM »
Nemesis frigates, endless streams of nemesis frigates.
Per your release thread plea, for 6.019:
Quote
* Offensive Nemesis champions now do not start unless the player has entered a nebula or the game clock has reached 3 hours.

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Zenith traitor constantly giving fortifications to the the AI hub worlds.
His check is in the mail.

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Some sociopath allowing spirecraft into special forces (and not updated the crafty spire text description to reflect this).
Interesting.  I never actually (inentionally) told it to do that.  Programmatic initiative, perhaps.
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Offline TechSY730

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Re: Back to the Red
« Reply #4 on: April 10, 2013, 09:11:29 PM »
Per your release thread plea, for 6.019:
Quote
* Offensive Nemesis champions now do not start unless the player has entered a nebula or the game clock has reached 3 hours.

What about the "if the champion reaches level 5" condition?

Offline keith.lamothe

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Re: Back to the Red
« Reply #5 on: April 10, 2013, 09:27:15 PM »
What about the "if the champion reaches level 5" condition?
As I was in there I realized that one wasn't really necessary.  If someone wants to level up past that on guard posts alone... well, have fun with that ;)
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Offline Faulty Logic

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Re: Back to the Red
« Reply #6 on: April 11, 2013, 03:19:58 AM »
Quote
Per your release thread plea, for 6.019:
Quote
* Offensive Nemesis champions now do not start unless the player has entered a nebula or the game clock has reached 3 hours.
Thanks. It isn't often the AI makes me beg for mercy, so when I do, I appreciate changes.

Is 6.019 imminent?
« Last Edit: April 11, 2013, 04:53:11 AM by Faulty Logic »
If warheads can't solve it, use more warheads.

Offline keith.lamothe

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Re: Back to the Red
« Reply #7 on: April 11, 2013, 10:28:41 AM »
Is 6.019 imminent?
Probably Tuesday or Wednesday of next week, that's been the schedule lately for non-hotfixes (and I wouldn't call this a hotfix).  That said if I get a spare moment soon I can just go ahead and make it a hotfix so I don't have to write a whole new blog post or whatever.
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Offline TechSY730

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Re: Back to the Red
« Reply #8 on: April 11, 2013, 11:37:10 AM »
Is 6.019 imminent?
Probably Tuesday or Wednesday of next week, that's been the schedule lately for non-hotfixes (and I wouldn't call this a hotfix).  That said if I get a spare moment soon I can just go ahead and make it a hotfix so I don't have to write a whole new blog post or whatever.

Now that is lazinesscustomer service in action. ;D

Offline Faulty Logic

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Re: Back to the Red
« Reply #9 on: April 14, 2013, 07:54:46 AM »
Guess what triggering an SF alarm post does after 5 hours of the AI putting nemeses into SF. Answer: AI Victory.

Well, that was a pretty thorough thrashing in two different games. I'll start a new thread with no red AI to see if civ leaders are remotely plausible (and try out the new SC/Golem exos and non-lazy AI).
If warheads can't solve it, use more warheads.

Offline keith.lamothe

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Re: Back to the Red
« Reply #10 on: April 14, 2013, 09:08:38 AM »
Guess what triggering an SF alarm post does after 5 hours of the AI putting nemeses into SF. Answer: AI Victory.
Interesting, I never made that connection when adding that part of the nemesis logic.  Emergent behavior, I suppose.  As in, "emerging" into your face at relativistic velocity.

Btw, the "if human champions get strong while AIP is still low, apply uncomfortable multipliers" applies to the "dirty tricks" part of the anti-champion response (which can choose between "add threatfleet champ" and "add SF champ" currently) as well as to the straight-up-defensive nemesis spawns.  Not to the straight-up-offensive nemesis spawns but that's probably less of a factor here.

Anyway, just mentioning it because I don't know what your AIP and/or champ tier was during the times when you were getting slammed by nemesis after nemesis after nemesis, etc.


As you've probably guessed I didn't get the spare moment for a hotfix "release".  But I'm planning on getting 6.019 out Monday (noonish or somewhat earlier).
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Offline Faulty Logic

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Re: Back to the Red
« Reply #11 on: April 14, 2013, 09:16:14 AM »
AIP 19 with a frigate. You might also want to space the checks for offensive spawns out to 5 minutes, because its frustrating to kill a nemesis and then see it again before your fleet is healed.

(And before you say "well think what the AI feels against your champ" the AI doesn't have feelings. Especially not remorse or mercy.)
If warheads can't solve it, use more warheads.

Offline keith.lamothe

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Re: Back to the Red
« Reply #12 on: April 14, 2013, 09:32:43 AM »
AIP 19 with a frigate. You might also want to space the checks for offensive spawns out to 5 minutes, because its frustrating to kill a nemesis and then see it again before your fleet is healed.
The dirty tricks bank checks for spending every 5 minutes.  The normal offensive ones... ah, yes, I see.  Ok, changed.

Quote
(And before you say "well think what the AI feels against your champ" the AI doesn't have feelings. Especially not remorse or mercy.)
No, but "annoyance", "vengeance", and "amusement" are all in there.
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